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  1. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by ZazuuPriest View Post
    Yes super sluggish considering i got from 100-107 in about 9 hours, and that just from questing and picking up random treasure along the way (read: not all of them) any moron can have their main artifact to level 10 (at least). How will people ever alt.
    Apparently your reading skills aren't as good as your faux-sarcasm. My point was pretty obvious that the leveling is a good bit slower than MoP and WoD were, and pretty much exclusively quest-driven considering dungeons award almost no experience without quests, and there's bound to be some repetition.

    In hindsight now that I've hit 110 on my main and alts, I actually don't think it's all that bad with rested, I'm just not someone who personally likes repeating the same almost exclusively neutral-faction quest chains on every character I reach 110 on. I'm personally hoping in a future patch that they ease up on it or else I probably won't be leveling my demon invasion-fueled alt army, which I'm kind of okay with, it's just a shame I won't see the order hall stuff for them.

    On a side note, it's incredible how many people jump on my ass about this post when I actually said "It may be too early to say". It's like people on this forum can't actually have a reasonable discussion without spewing attitude and shit.

  2. #402
    Not being able to fly is kinda of lame. That being said, the zone design with flights paths, the whistle and the kite it's extremely easy to get around. Just a little frustrating being a healer having to push through mobs to go somewhere.

  3. #403
    Deleted
    Stormheim. It's absolutely awful; terrain, quests, NPCs...

  4. #404
    class balance. still bothers me that after 12 or so years they still have no clue how to put all classes in the same ballpark of dps.

  5. #405
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Sammonoske View Post
    No flying. I said it, deal with it
    Pointless scaling.
    Diablo 3 like Loot RNG.
    Lack of effort put into Demon Hunters. Both specs are spammy and feel incomplete.
    Several uninteresting Artifacts.
    PvP balance is at it's worst.
    Same +1

    I want to add the nerf to the kite.

  6. #406
    Field Marshal Sunshadow's Avatar
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    I loved and love everything...except for the artifact weapon. As a paladin (not sure for the other classes yet as I've yet to level them), the Ashbringer feels incredibly weak. I get that Blizzard changed the time in a fight to last several seconds longer but it's sort of a mixed bag when your supposed high-powered weapon takes thrice as long to kill some nameless mob. If they reduced the time in combat by about two seconds, it might feel better.

    Also, I get that the weapon will likely get stronger with time and after significant work put into powering it up but the weapon should feel potent and formidable right out the gate before veering off into superpowered levels. Feels kinda lacklustre. The narrative - gameplay dissonance is extremely strong here, in my opinion.

    But that goes away once you transmog another weapon over the artifact which is not ideal, at least, this early in the game.

  7. #407
    So far the weakest stuff I've encountered is lost abilities. I enjoyed fire mage a lot in WoD, but now it's kind of boring and doesn't bend as well to varying situations. My main, the warrior, really misses his old self-healing capabilities, and my shaman cries herself to sleep over losing the glyph-enhanced speed of the ghost wolf form. Though Outlaw rogue feels much better than Combat before.

    I also disliked the order hall bar at the top of the screen, but thankfully the addon MMO Champ featured at the front page got rid of it.

    The level-scaling thing is great in the way it allows us to play the four pre-Suramar zones in the order we like, but it has its downside. I was at 109 in Stormheim, mobs were 108, then I dinged to 110 and mobs were suddenly 110 too and considerably tougher than just before. I bet gearing solves that, but right now I'm reminded of TES4: Oblivion's high-geared bandits.
    Now you see it. Now you don't.

  8. #408
    Deleted
    The gameplay overall is quite weak and boring. I feel like I'm constantly leveling my character, always questing.. There's always shit to do, but it's lackluster rewards like 150 AP. Who cares when I need 20k+ for my next trait? I realise with time it'll be more AP, but by the time you've got the artifact research ramped up, you'll be needing multiple hundreds of thousands of AP for the next trait, they'll still feel like shit.

    Why are mythics weekly lockout? Heroics are a joke and give lackluster rewards after a day or two at max level. The only reason to run them is in hope of a warforged or titanforged item, and even then they're rarely higher ilvl than mythic gear.

    Class hall was cool, but ended too fast. Same with professions. I like the new system they're using, but why must we already be over and done with them after less than a week at 110? Why can't there be a constant progress for months, just like with the AP grind? There's no point in even introducing the profession system when everyone and their mom got maxed out in a couple of hours. Why can't it be like old times where certain enchants are hard to get.

  9. #409
    Quote Originally Posted by Azurae View Post
    Stormheim. It's absolutely awful; terrain, quests, NPCs...
    Glad someone said it. I'm fine with the other three zones (and actually, I really like Highmountain), but Stornheim can go die a fiery hell.

  10. #410
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
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    Excessive amounts of trash mobs everywhere.
    I don't see what is fun about being forced into combat all the time.

    That and the lack of flight make world quests very annoying and unfun to do.

  11. #411
    The mission time sinks in the class campaigns.

    Artifact power making it harder to keep up with off specs and alts.

    The new violet hold. I hate this style of dungeon and it's a recycled location with demons instead of dragons.



    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnillon View Post
    To me and my BF the most annoying things are the class, class hall and profession quest. As we are from different classes with different professions then half the time we cannot really "enjoy" the leveling together due to not being to help one another in finding stuff. If you mainly go at it on your own w/o any friends then probably the time you spend traveling to your class hall, dalaran and the quest area.

    Maybe if you are used in playing your favorite class and now it's "broken" and "pruned" too much for you. But one can get used to everything I recon.

    But other then that there's not much wrong with the expansion in general. What might tick people off, you might not care at all.
    The vast majority of the content can be done together.

  12. #412
    Fluffy Kitten Sonnillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin
    The vast majority of the content can be done together.
    Yes, ofc it can. But waiting for your other half when you are finishing something or when he is finishing something is not really fun or productive, specially when the other has "tougher" things to do or is not that good at it. The leveling experience was segmented due to not being able to everything together is my only gripe so far.

  13. #413
    Deleted
    It definitely has to be classes being shadows of their former selves.

    I feel like Blizzard, by introducing the artifact weapons, focused too much on the "class fantasy" rather than the gameplay, which is arguably the most important aspect in a game; knowing the little ins and outs of your classes/specializations doesn't really seem that important nor rewarding anymore, mainly because most of the intricacies and complexity within are simply gone due to the pruning.

    (In Wrath, little differences like a better mana gems/mana pots/evocation management allowed an undergeared arcane mage to be on par with full heroic ones for example. In WoD, the difference between a good subtlety rogue and a mediocre one was huge and, frankly speaking, satisfying to witness)

    Personally speaking I don't feel rewarded by dumping points into the artifact weapons and watching numbers grow, mainly because that's their whole purpose at the moment, a mere number increase rather than adding depth and choices to the gameplay of the class we're being encouraged (to not say forced) to focus on for the whole expansion.

    Classes now feel washed out and without a purpose, with the same basic, dull, reactive rotation closer to a guitar hero simulator than the previous WoW gameplay experience.
    Last edited by mmoc49319dad18; 2016-09-09 at 11:19 AM. Reason: spelling

  14. #414
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    The mission time sinks in the class campaigns.

    Artifact power making it harder to keep up with off specs and alts.

    The new violet hold. I hate this style of dungeon and it's a recycled location with demons instead of dragons.
    Mission stuff is a joke now with the phone app, at least if you can whip it out every few hours and do like 5 clicks.

    It's actually super easy to keep off specs up to date now.. You'll be maybe 1 trait behind on your main weapon, but have 1-2 other offspecs pretty much up to speed, due to how steep the curve of AP requirement for next trait is.

  15. #415
    I doubt this will be a popular opinion, but I find the usage of dungeons to gate not just class quests but also professions to be irksome. Now I'm not saying a dungeon couldn't have special stuff for professions, but basically making it that you had to do dungeons to get you 700-800 skill ups is a tad tiresome. Will certainly be when I've to go through the same process with my alts.
    This is not to say I'm not enjoying Legion, just feel some of the gating seems disjointed from the content that's gated. What was wrong with using the profession itself to gate profession based content? Did my class quest really need to take me to the violet hold when I should be hunting down a dreadlord? Rather than randomly gating behind dungeons and missions, they could've added more in between class quests to achieve a more coherent story of said feud.

  16. #416
    Quote Originally Posted by Cellineth View Post
    Mission stuff is a joke now with the phone app, at least if you can whip it out every few hours and do like 5 clicks.

    It's actually super easy to keep off specs up to date now.. You'll be maybe 1 trait behind on your main weapon, but have 1-2 other offspecs pretty much up to speed, due to how steep the curve of AP requirement for next trait is.
    The missions were never difficult per say just annoying that you have to wait 100 combined hours to get to your third relic slot at the end of the chain.

  17. #417
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    The missions were never difficult per say just annoying that you have to wait 100 combined hours to get to your third relic slot at the end of the chain.
    Why? If anything there should be more you could progress towards. It's boring the class hall is practically useless after a week into lvl 110.

  18. #418
    Quote Originally Posted by Cellineth View Post
    Why? If anything there should be more you could progress towards. It's boring the class hall is practically useless after a week into lvl 110.
    You still get missions that reward artifact power or dungeon quests etc. I juat hate the time gating aspect of the five mission blocks. They're neither challenging nor rewarding and exist only to slow you down several days.

  19. #419
    Weakest point is also one of it's strongest points...

    World Quests

    World Quests are amazing... the perfect open world, progression oriented, endgame.

    But... no flying available at max level results in you spending more time traveling... a LOT of travel time. Time you could be leveling/playing an alt... time you could be running dungeons, farming mats, exploring, farming old raids... ANYTHING.

    But no... we have to flight path and ride on the ground everywhere. While there a many that will claim it's a good thing... millions disagree and are going to stop playing until it is back in game. I know I am.

    Think about it... this is a GAME... and people are OK with Blizzard saying... we will turn on a feature you have used the past 8 years... oh, let's see.. a YEAR from now. That is fucked up on so many levels.

  20. #420
    Brewmaster TheVaryag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishoj View Post
    Every expansion has something it doesn't do well. In trying to decide whether or not to get back to WoW, I want to know what problems I'll be facing in this expansion. I really wish I'd waited to ask that question before sinking three weeks into WoD when that came out. So, what are the things that Legion doesn't do so well and which might become the thing that people complain about once the new expansion smell wears off? Nothing is flawless, and I'd like to know what this expansion isn't great at.
    Let's not say what the weak points are, while we haven't seen what all of Legion has to offer, the patches and so on. But as someone whose played WoW for nearly 12 years, I do have many gripes with It, that people either didn't notice cause they're fanboys and they don't care, or just Ignore these aspects to enjoy other ones. But since you asked, this is what I saw so far:

    1. Bad leveling pace, With only a few bars rested, having done all 4 zones, 1 dungeon per zone, a few pet battles, the order hall campaign, and mining quests I got stuck at level 109, and had nowhere else to go. Suramar doesn't scale with level for some reason, and since you have 4 zones, It's expected you get 2.5 levels per zone, give or take to reach 110. But many people are complaining that they've been stuck at level 107-109 without being able to level further too much. I also had about 12 "Bonus" quest zones left to do, which one would assume from playing WoD are "Bonus" therefore optional, back In WoD you could do each zone's chapter and move on, and be well above level for the next zone, and you didn't even need to do the big bonus zones that awarded a bunch of XP. Typically you'd end up in Spires of Arak, towards the end of the chapters there and ding lvl 100 and then go to Nagrand as a level 100 despite It being a level 88-100 area, which Is a good thing. It seems Blizzard forces you to do every, single, little quest, In each zone just to ding 110 and that's going to be a PAIN for alts, If you wanna get multiple chars to 110.

    I've never seen the expansion quests been so bad as to not let you ding highest level before you even enter the last zone which Is usually high level only In each expansion. WoD had Nagrand, Mists had Vale of Eternal Blossoms, Cataclysm had Twilight Highlands, Wrath had Icecrown (Albeit It wasn't nececery to be highest level there, there were lower level quests there as well, so It wasn't that bad). The pace hasn't been this bad since Vanila, where you could get stuck at level 55 and had nothing to do to ding anymore. You do here, there are quests, but they're on the side, they're side-quests, not part of the chapters, and one could assume from WoD that you only need to do the chapters per zone and go to the next zone and next and be lvl 110 before you know It, well wrong.

    2. High Difficult out of nowhere Suddenly, unless you were mythic geared from WoD, you hard a hard time leveling through the Order Hall pre-quests and get your artifacts, as well as just general leveling as well as Campaign quests and stage-based quests (Which upon DCing, starts you back at stage 1 as well, big gripe)

    This would be fine, If they were saying "We're going back to the hardcore difficulty of everything, you know, TBC level of hard" but they didn't, and definitely aren't going that way, as ALL of the classes have been dumbed down (The 3rd point to be made soon), and killing more then 3 Mobs Is usually Impossible unless you pop CDs, at least for me as a Fury Warrior, which Is oddly weak In DPS as opposed to the new Arms spec. I mean, we do have artifacts right? But even then, even If you do use all of your Artifact Traits you still won't be that powerful, did you see the Artifact talent tree? It's a glorified version of the old school talent tree pre-cata, but worse - with % upgrades to damage and other non-interesting upgrades you'd not expect In an artifact of such power.

    3. Class "Casualification" I'm sure we all know, since Cataclysm Blizzard went down the route of "Casualifing" the game, heirlooms, LFG, LFR, easier content (Which Is an irony to the difficulty spike mentioned above out of nowhere - yet the dungeons remain easy as nails with an overly geared group), even the abilities and stats were dumbed down so much In Legion, where we would have pages of abilities, each class has roughly 2 pages of them (And I'm not talking about Vanila where we had tons of pages of the same ability but with different ranks of It), and most classes have poor healing or survivability unless you're a class with healing spells or a mage with food. Don't be scared to give us pages of abilities, Blizz. We know how to use them, and If we don't we learn and then we actually become good at playing our class.

    4. Artifact Talents & "Power" We've been hyped to high hell over Artifacts, but their talents trees, as mentioned above are a glorified version of the old school talent trees pre-cata, with mear % based upgrades and other non interesting upgrades, and while some of the given artifact abilities are factually better then others (Ashbringer's frontal cone attack that stuns demons and undead - which is oddly useful against the Legion now unlike the other artifacts!) the other artifact given abilities are laughable, I also thought we'd get more abilities put Into the Artifact trees, but we barely get one good additional ability to the already dumbed down abilities we got with Legion.

    5. Story per area & Legion's general fan service Obvious attempt to re-ignite peoples Interest In the game, by giving us all we've wanted, or most of It... Demons Hunters, Illidan Is back and somehow the hero of the universe, Turalyon and Alleria kinda sorta, Night Elven story with Xavius and the nightmare (Val'sharah), Azshara making a bigger appearance (Aszune), Vrykul, vikings, odyn, bjorgen fjorgen (Stereotypical Scandinavian voice acting, which I love but must make scandinavians cringe), a "Valhala" of WoW for warriors. which they named Valhalas to not be confused with the area of Valhala in Icecrown (Stormheim ofcourse), and I assume, various places related to Deathwing and so on....? Didn't see as much fan service here, so Highmountain was the nicest In that regard (Highmountain) - and all of this, reeks of desparation to hook people In for WoW for the last time before It fails, they've realized people lost Interest, more and more since Cata/MoP and are trying this to get our attention. It's not a coincidence that since end of Wrath, from 10 mil subs we went to 5.5 In Mid-WoD Q3 2015 (And presumably around 3 - 4 mil currently), people lost Interest when the game became casual and not hardcore anymore, people loved the hardcore aspect. All the zone seem tailored to fit these fan services rather then make a good zone and then fit In the quests later. Queue that gif with Grom killing Mannoroth In WoD, where Grom's face Is Metzen and Mannoroth's face just says "Lore".

    6. Patch 7.1 Karazhan Patch announcment before expansion launch Never In WoW history we were told a patch for an expansion before that expansion launched, that also reeks of desparation, which they try to mask by bravery In their newest product. 7.1 Is a small raid (Like Onyxia), a weekly lockout Karazhan Dungeon on mythic difficulty and some more Suramar story. This will be the 2nd patch In WoW history, right after 6.1 that doesn't have a raid tier, which I'm conflicted about honestly. Raiding Is not, and should not be Endgame, however those that do raid will get bored quick I'm sure, and Mythic Dungeon gear will only be as good as Normal to Heroic levels of raid gear - so their "Concentration" on dungeons this time around won't last. And the future patches for Legion look bleek If this is all we'll get per patch, and eventually get told "Working on next expansion, sorry!"

    7. World Quests seem to be just the Garrison Zone Quests we had before, but split Into 4 smaller chunks. It's still mostly "Fill this bar, kill guys, go to the next zone", but split In 4 chunks, where 1 quest Is kill 12 guys, move to 2nd quest, where you kill guys until a bar fills, 3rd quest Is free 5 dudes from a cage, and 4th Is fill a bar again... not to mention, HALF of the World Quests are repeats of the quests we've already done In that zone, so they're recycling It, and worst of all... you know how you can get to free a guy from a cage In a quest during leveling, and 2 other people can free the guy as well? As In the cage won't disappear until everyone who sees It can use It? That's gone In World Quests, now you don't share the reward. You get the cage, you get the reward, cage vanishes, you gotta find a new one... which Is so dumb, It makes the world quests so much artificially harder and I'm sure they know that.





    Those are my gripes so far, and yes, as someone whose played nearly 12 years of this game, I have the right to criticize the game, and that means I want It to Improve. That's to ward off idiots going "Well then don't play the game, hurr durr". I know we've not seen the whole expansion yet, tried everything, even the raids, but once you try some content you can criticize that content.

    Although, one relatively good thing about this, Is the Suramar area and story around the night fallen. I still hate the difficulty spike Is even more noticeable in Suramar, but the city Is just amazing, I wish all Capital cities were so grand, imagine Stormwind/Orgrimmar filled with streets and corners like that. You almost feel like a Night Fallen Ezio In the city - almost.
    Permabanned on WoW since April 14th 2015, main acc I had since vanilla gone and trashed for no good reason, 6+ years later still banned with more appeals resulting in my BATTLENET games being suspended for a month eachtime I try making TICKETS because I'm asking for help with the perma ban. Blizzard has stopped caring for their first veteran players and would rather we leave, considering the Lawsuit, can you afford to keep peps banned even for so long under questionable circumstances?

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