Xal''atath, one quote in particular [SPOILERS]

[Raetary]

Thats like... your opinion, man.

good luck living in
"hey dude, i crashed into your dog with my car yesterday, he lost 3 legs lulz!"
"haha! that's fine! he cant die and feel pain anyway!"
land

if you dont feel pain, you cant feel for others nor for yourself because you never felt any kind of pain before.
if you have infinite resources, you wont be careful at all with what you are doing and throwing everything around you like its nothing, and the resource, whatever it may be would loose its value.

death and decay are important for nature, if you srsly dont see at least this you need your brain cells exchanged.

[Raetary]

Except if you can't die you don't need to eat, and without decay you can't starve. That would extend to the plants and other things as well.

I'm not arguing against the concept of necessary balance in the WoWverse, but that is a poor analogy for it.

welcome to earth without death:


i hope you like living literally on top of other peoples heads.

- - - Updated - - -

also, without pain you wont know what is dangerous and what not.

"lulz look at my hand! its turning black from all the sparky fire around it!"

[Dispraise]

welcome to earth without death

A universe without any of the negative aspects would have developed in a different fashion. Build me a model of a universe where death, decay, or disorder never existed then get back to me.

also, without pain you wont know what is dangerous and what not.

And without the possibility of injury or death nothing is dangerous, so moot point.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Keep in mind that the forces of entropy(I.E. Void Lords) have an actual goal and some sentience. They're not necessarily just a force of nature. They're actively doing stuff.

[derpkitteh]

So you are talking about perfection. Which cannot exist in a universe with entropy.

You cannot account for chaotic events... and human nature does not play well with "perfection". We should (in my opinion) always keep reaching for it; But it is always going to be out of reach. And in the end, the universe itself will die.

it can't exist irl, due to the failings of whatever either caused it, or the failings of natural life itself.

but in fantasy it can.

[Aucald]

Knowledge of sadness, hurt, or pain adds an element of perspective to one's enjoyment of general happiness - you cannot fully appreciate a positive emotional state without knowledge of its opposite. That being said, positive vs. negative emotional content is somewhat off-topic from Xal'atath's many whispers.

[Raetary]

those are all parts that make us living beings for gods damn sake.
we are not machines, machines dont feel negative emotions, in fact they dont feel anything at all, machines dont feel pain, machines cant die, all you guys describe as perfect utopia without the balance of positive and negative is a universe full with robots.

[Al Gorefiend]

I wish the VO for the blade wasn't so bad. It doesn't sound Old God at all. I tried to Headcanon that it just uses a voice your PC recognizes but it still just sounds like a telephone operator voice.

It also says a bunch of other stuff that was interesting to hear. Something about I should stop wasting time with the Legion or something?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I wish the VO for the blade wasn't so bad. It doesn't sound Old God at all. I tried to Headcanon that it just uses a voice your PC recognizes but it still just sounds like a telephone operator voice.

It also says a bunch of other stuff that was interesting to hear. Something about I should stop wasting time with the Legion or something?

Something about a worse threat or something like that. I assume they mean the Old God N'zoth or something like that.

[Al Gorefiend]

I wish the VO for the blade wasn't so bad. It doesn't sound Old God at all. I tried to Headcanon that it just uses a voice your PC recognizes but it still just sounds like a telephone operator voice.

It also says a bunch of other stuff that was interesting to hear. Something about I should stop wasting time with the Legion or something?

The exact quote is "hurry up and defeat the fallen Titan already, there are greater battles to fight"

[Balinus]

Hey u guys discussing philosophy, we kinda had enouight, if u wanna keep debating open a thread, lets talk about the dagger yes? XD
Just like the dude above said,, the old gods think that the cruse of flesh is a blessing. The titanforged thought it was a curse. So we cant take thing LITERALLY when the dagger says something. She is manipulative.

- - - Updated - - -

The exact quote is "hurry up and defeat the fallen Titan already, there are greater battles to fight"

THIS i found interesting.

[Deleted]

"I know the naaru consider us horrors to be resisted. We do not share this view. They are merely beloved brethren that lost the true path. They will return to their masters... in time."


There's just something about this that continues to bug me...

The Blade seems to be insinuating that the natural form of the Naaru is the Void state, not the Light state. Given that it has now been revealed that (at least some) of the Naaru stem from Elune, could it be not that Elune "created" them, but rather that Elune "purified" them (a la the Holy Nathrezim from paladin class hall)?

This then leads to another question: is the "eternal conflict" between Void and Light, or between Void Lords and Elune/her compatriots (whoever they may be, if any even exist)?




Just a pondering that I can't get out of my head

It's also stated that the blade is extremely devious and to trust it is to invite madness and failure. It seeks to control you, corrupt you and take you over.

[Balinus]

Well,i agree, the curse of flesh isnt a curse, imagine sex between titanforged?? lol

[Deleted]

How can there be positive emotions without negative? How would you know it is a "positive" emotion, if you had nothing to compare it to?

Like in a magnet, you need both polls, they are dependently originated. You cannot have a positive poll without a negative one.

And Utopia only exists in the mind, not reality(or in this case, The Warcraft Universe).

You wouldn't have a name for this. You just would feel great all the time, it would be the way things are. Eternal Happiness, no negative feelings.

life needs death.
death needs life.

order needs disorder.
disorder needs order.

life needs death.
death needs life.

light needs shadow.
shadow needs light.

its a balance, its a circle.

life brought order and life.
void brought death and disorder.

Why? You can claim that pseudo-philosophical stuff and act like it is deep in meaningful, but if you can't argue why it is good that way, it's without worth.

In which way death, hatred, anger, sadness, destruction, decay makes the world a better and more liveworthy place? If everything the Void brings would disappear, life would be an eternal paradise. Pretty much what christian heaven promises. You wouldn't even need a thing, no matter what happens, you would feel happiness and good emotions. We don't need bad emotions to know that good emotions are good. we consider them good, because they feel good. Without the bad stuff, the good emotions wouldn't be less valuable, they would only be the norm, something everyone feels all the time, without dark thoughts or moments that could lesser them.

If you end up experiencing every possible event, over and over again.... forever.... not sure you would find that a "pleasant" or "meaningful" thing. Living for a long time is nice, living forever, after having experienced everything, and not forgetting the past, would be torture.

Why? Argue. Explain. Why would remembering a perfect, happy past a torture? How would remembering, if things would right now change, the bad stuff a torture, if you lack the abillity to associate bad memories with bad emotions? How could feeling love and sympathy towards everyone and living for all eternity with them, without something bad happening bad? Like, in western society most people never feel real hunger, but still eating feels good. We can appreciate this good feeling, without really knowing the real opposite. There can't be a bad thing, torture or whatever, because their is no possibility to feel something bad without the existence of the Void and we know that an existence with only Light is good, at everypoint the light-affiliated Afterlife is described as paradise while the Void is a place of eternal torture.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Never trust anything Old God related.

[Zandalariprelate]

It could also be her playing games with people...

But from my point of view, from reading the Chronicles, the Void and the Light are like the Yin/Yang. Both are required, or neither exists. Light is creation, Void is destruction. Endless creation, or Endless Destruction would not "work". So the eternal struggle is just that. Keeping a balance between the two, because when one gets out of hand, neither really "win" and whatever beings exist in between the two (all the energies that come out of light and void mixing), suffer.

- - - Updated - - -



Yeap, pretty much this as well.

Then why both sides try to destroy each and other and remember the void lords want to control the world soul of azeroth to conquest the reality and resharp in his own image, i see more that like a sith/jedi or heaven/hell kind of conflic like the diablo franchise

[Ashkiman]

What if Elune herself was the one who created Naarus in their void forms and then got purified somehow and started making good Naarus?

[Raetary]

but if you can't argue

i just did that like half an hour ago...
reading posts is hard i guess?


anyway, im done with this discussion.
could we move from real life philosophy back to warcraft void and light?

[Raetary]

Well,i agree, the curse of flesh isnt a curse, imagine sex between titanforged?? lol

except that titanforged didnt need sex to reproduce?
they are forged, its literally in their name.

[Raetary]

the curse of flesh is a curse.
it made the titan-forged weaker and easier to corrupt.