Is it ever acceptable to play a weak spec you enjoy in PvE?

[Kyriani]

Because it is? I mean, if you're not setting sights on mythic raiding you shouldn't be raiding since that is the endgame everyone is intended to strive toward. I guess if you PvP, Gladiator is the same but it's insignificant by comparison.

I despise this line of thinking. Not saying anything negative towards you, just that the notion that "Mythic is the only "real" endgame" is abhorrent to me. I want nothing at all to do with Mythic raiding. IF and I stress IF, I want to raid I don't want it to be "hard" I want it to be "fun" and fun is very subjective. Raiding these days is so far and away more complicated than it was way back in the day, it's not "fun" for me anymore. This line of thinking that "Mythic is the only real endgame and you should be striving towards it if you raid" is why I stopped raiding with my guild. This line of thinking pushes most guilds to do it or else they aren't seen as "legit". It's like peer pressure in high school. -_-

[Super Kami Dende]

Except that you are wrong. Not all speccs are viable in mythic raiding.

Yeah, they are. EVERYTHING is viable. some just make it easier.

[dacoolist]

Mainly for PvE concerns, yeah. Let's just say, I'm someone who's only ever PvP'd and rushed into leveling Artfact power for a spec only really stated to acceptable for that this expac. When I finally discovered PvE is the real game and want to get into it, I'm pretty choked with regret now that I'm stuck with that spec.

That said, there is the option to simply play this spec into PvE but to me, the game is only real at Mythic and I've heard in tryouts they'll reject you on sight based on what spec you are running. But are there ever exceptions? What I have on mind is Frost DK btw, and what I am regretting is likely not going Unholy since I tried tanking on the class and decided it's not for me.

You got it backwards about PVP and PVE m8, also: It's only acceptable to hate the game, and play the spec that makes your e-peen biggest. If you don't put down big numbers, I'm kicking you from mmo-c.com

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I despise this line of thinking. Not saying anything negative towards you, just that the notion that "Mythic is the only "real" endgame" is abhorrent to me. I want nothing at all to do with Mythic raiding. IF and I stress IF, I want to raid I don't want it to be "hard" I want it to be "fun" and fun is very subjective. Raiding these days is so far and away more complicated than it was way back in the day, it's not "fun" for me anymore. This line of thinking that "Mythic is the only real endgame and you should be striving towards it if you raid" is why I stopped raiding with my guild. This line of thinking pushes most guilds to do it or else they aren't seen as "legit". It's like peer pressure in high school. -_-

It's 100% ok to get geared from LFR and be Rank Juan - but you'd feel better about yourself if you would hop in a mythic and wipe on boss's continually until you lose all hope in humanity.

[Halyon]

Doesn't Blizzard officially hate certain specs though?

Certainly feels that way. It's painful to play BM, and SV is...well...

[Deleted]

Well, it depends on what you want to do.

I want to raid in a mythic guild that aims for strong, fast progress!
What you want is no longer important, everything you do should be aimed towards the benefit of the guild. That means ceding your crafting materials (if they are needed), donating excess gold to the guild bank, farming pots and flasks and food. It also means playing the most optimal spec you can, and if your entire class is weak and basically not viable in high end raiding, it may even mean rerolling all together. These are the sacrifices you make.

I don't really care, I'd like to clear normal and maybe heroic! I just want to have fun with friends.
All specs are viable, even the worst spec in the game is still within 20% of the highest DPS spec. That is a massive difference, of course, but nothing that will matter in a more casual guild where the encounters you fight are eventually going to be outgeared by the items you'll get. Just play what you enjoy and have fun

[Murderdoll]

Yeah, they are. EVERYTHING is viable. some just make it easier.

...and those that make the encounter harder than it needs to be are seen as unviable.

2H Frost in HFC was unviable because it was simply not doing anywhere near the damage of its other two specs.

[Super Kami Dende]

...and those that make the encounter harder than it needs to be are seen as unviable.

2H Frost in HFC was unviable because it was simply not doing anywhere near the damage of its other two specs.

Everything is still Viable. All classes are tuned to be Viable. People just see the ones that are overtuned and assume everything else is unviable. Stupidity generally does this.

[Semune]

Play what you like, but if you apply to my mythic dungeon group or raid with me, you either pull the numbers or get kicked.

If you don't care much about keeping up with current endgame content, feel free to play that arcane mage instead of fire, or sin rogue instead of outlaw.

[Vichan]

If you're not raiding super high end mythic progression then play whatever you like

[Magicpot]

In most competitive raiding guilds you play whatever fotm the guild needs to progress or you get benched, simple as.

There is no room for "play what you want" in mythics, its "play what performs best".

[JIMM-]

In most competitive raiding guilds you play whatever fotm the guild needs to progress or you get benched, simple as.

There is no room for "play what you want" in mythics, its "play what performs best".

^, this +1 , this guy gets it. There is no room for sub optimal specs for mythics progression, any competent guild will choose to bench you if u insist on playing a weaker spec when a stronger one is available, unless they dont have any strong bench players waiting to come in, in that case if im the RL i would still recruit someone to replace u if u insist on playing a weak spec.

Personally I think,

"play the best spec" if you're going for Cutting Edge achievements.
"play whatever u enjoy the most" if you're only going for Ahead of the Curve achievements or LFR, etc .

[Dch48]

Because it is? I mean, if you're not setting sights on mythic raiding you shouldn't be raiding since that is the endgame everyone is intended to strive toward.

This is patently false. A very small percentage of people ever see Mythic. Therefore it is not intended to be done by everyone . Not at all. It's only there for the small percentage who wanted it.

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Certainly feels that way. It's painful to play BM, and SV is...well...

To me, MM is the painful one to play. And the most boring.

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Play whatever makes you find fun and makes you happy, fuck off whatever anyone else thinks. Your playtime isn't about making everyone else a happy camper. Play how you want to play. You're the one paying for it.

Quoted for truth.

[Grishnaar]

You can and SHOULD be able to play ANY spec you want.

That being said, if you look at it like that, you should also know that going into Mythic is 99% our of the question and for Heroic, you're expected to try to perfect your spec.

I'm pretty sure Normal raids can be done with any specs, as long as you know how to play.

Also, this:

You should play the game however you want if you don't play competitively.

However, if you are in a mythic guild who aim for realm 1st, expect to be forced to choose the best spec out there if not an extra alt with it.

[Spiral Mage]

Curious attitude that one MUST do Mythic and that "everyone should aim for that".

Personally, I'd run a raiding guild for years and we -never- aimed for that. We were happy doing normal raids. Why? Because we all got together two nights a week and had fun on voice chat, joking and talking, and shit while downing bosses and getting loot. It aint the best loot in the game but who cares, man? The real reason you play a game is to have fun and that's precisely what we did. Meanwhile, my friends in hardcore guilds complained to me that I wasn't doing real content (because they wanted me to join whatever guild they were in, with them) but at the same time, guess how many of them were ever happy playing WoW? None. It was always a "gotta get the gear" treadmill to them and it made them miserable.

So you tell me what's really important? Making yourself miserable chasing gear you'll replace before you can blink, or trying to kick back, have fun and feel good about what you're doing every night?

I also never ask someone to swap specs unless it is a very serious problem. I took a look at the highs and lows, and made realistic assessments of what someone realistically should be doing. As long as you were somewhere in the realistic range, and not under the required DPS for a fight (back when we had hard DPS checks), then if you're enjoying your character, I'm happy for you.

[Ritushido]

As has been stated you should play the best spec in Mythic and progressive raiding. Anything lower than that it doesn't really matter as long as you do some research on your spec and can perform your best with it.

[Halyon]

To me, MM is the painful one to play. And the most boring.

I agree on the boring part, but I personally never touched MM outside a period of focused progress raiding, and back then it wasn't as awful. But BM has always been my favorite spec, both in terms of playstyle and theme...maybe except dire beast because random animals don't appeal to me, but I digress. I find BM the worst to play because they got butchered so hard and messed with my personal attachment to it...

[Stava]

Why do so many people just assume we are miserable and hate the game if we raid mythic? Do you really think we would put the hours in if we did not enjoy raiding mythic?
First you say how you should play the game the way you want and then proceed to saying that we should quit because you don't enjoy raiding mythic.

[Deleted]

The difference between a weak spec and a strong spec always gets blown out of all proportion.

Firstly, a "strong spec" on one kind of boss fight will be a "weak spec" on some different kind of boss fight; e.g. movement-heavy vs fairly sedentary bosses. Single-target fights versus trash-heavy bossfights, or council bosses.

Secondly, the majority of bossfights aren't hard gearchecks (We don't see "hard" enrages or Patchwerk bosses more than once or twice per raid tier). You will frequently wipe on a boss at 1%, but you will never wipe on a boss at 1% due to having a bunch of players with a sub-optimal spec in your raid team; You will never have a raid team whose composition is optimal for every boss unless you're competing in the world first race, switching between 5+ alts.
If your spec happens to be weak on DPS for a particular boss, or even for most bosses, it doesn't matter because the difference between killing a boss versus not killing a boss is nearly always about survival, situational awareness, teamwork and knowledge of boss mechanics. A player who has nailed down the mechanics of any more complex encounter; including the timings, cooldowns, positioning etc. will do really well regardless of whether their spec happens to be sub-optimal.

Thirdly, the difference between 'strong' and 'weak' is often counted in terms of utility rather than throughput. Some classes and specs are just more useful and versatile than others because they can do things which, despite being immeasurable on the meters, make them situationally ideal for a number of encounters. For example, a hunter is usually an ideal choice for kiting, and some classes with strong personal cooldowns are ideal for solo-soaking.

And Lastly, WoW is a co-operative team game. It's not a game where a handful of players in a guild can "carry" the rest. The throughput potential of your spec within the context of an entire raid team is insignificant to your team's overall progress. There are 19 others who need to perform, and who also need to have nailed the execution of the bossfight. Your team may be only as strong as your weakest player, but their spec generally has absolutely nothing to do with it, unless it's a matter of utility (soaking, kiting, interrupting, etc.)

The reality is that most people do not play their character up to its full potential anyway - chances are that you're probably not in a raiding team of people who play their spec to its full potential. Choosing a strong spec that you don't enjoy isn't going to help you or your raid team with progression.

Focus your time being great at whatever spec you enjoy playing the most, and on having a thorough understanding of how bossfights work. The spec you choose to play is one of the least important things when it comes to your performance in a raid. Your best players in any raid are the ones who didn't fail to any of the mechanics, and who also made sure that they weren't the ones standing in somebody else's way causing someone else to fail.

[CParker1987]

I know a lot of people are gonna say I'm full of it by saying this but I'm not, I've seen it first hand multiple times.... every spec in the game is viable if you learn how to play it. Take ret pally for example... pretty bad off on paper but in the hands of someone who has learned to adapt and overcome still a decent spec. The only time and I do mean the only time specs are gonna matter is to guilds like Method and the such. Those guilds that are aiming for world firsts and all that junk. I raid with Quest on Thrall. Yes we are a mythic raiding guild but we are not hardcore, raid everyday type guild. Play what you enjoy and don't let anyone tell you that you have to play a certain spec. There are guilds out there that will take you, especially if you can learn to be a good raider. Too many people out there are terrible raiders with terrible raid feet (meaning they stand in stuff instead of moving out of it) and just have no knowledge of mechanics or anything like that. So in the end, I'm sure some raid leader has that guy they'd like to get rid of to put someone decent in his place, even if he is playing a subpar spec (again on paper). Just learn the spec, adapt and overcome.

[Keile]

Of course it is.

Unless your guild is pushing Mythic progression (and even then if they tell you to swap specs I'd contest it if you are good at your spec you will perform just fine) then play what spec you enjoy. Even when a spec is falling behind they typically are not behind as people make them out to be. A spec could be <1-2% behind another spec of the same class and the community would cry gloom and doom and preach about how bad it is when in reality it's not a big deal.