Finally the Alliance fistpump moment we deserved [SPOILERS]

[Surfd]

Did the alliance know that the Horde also lost their warchief in this conflict ?

They should. I mean, unless their information network is utterly and completely inept, it would be practically impossible for them not to know that Vol'jin is dead and Sylvanas is the new warchief. I mean, hell, as the horde player, you are informed almost immediately after returning from the Broken Isles assault scenario that the Horde is aware that Vairan is dead and that the alliance is blaming us for it and rattling sabers in our direction. And this is before Vol'jin even kicks the bucket. If the Horde can get that kind of battlefield intelligence in that short of time, the Alliance has no excuse for not knowing Sylvanas is inducted as the new warchief in a massive ceremony shortly there after.

[Phuongvi]

They should. I mean, unless their information network is utterly and completely inept, it would be practically impossible for them not to know that Vol'jin is dead and Sylvanas is the new warchief. I mean, hell, as the horde player, you are informed almost immediately after returning from the Broken Isles assault scenario that the Horde is aware that Vairan is dead and that the alliance is blaming us for it and rattling sabers in our direction. And this is before Vol'jin even kicks the bucket. If the Horde can get that kind of battlefield intelligence in that short of time, the Alliance has no excuse for not knowing Sylvanas is inducted as the new warchief in a massive ceremony shortly there after.

So they still mad because the Horde left the broken shore after Vol Jin was fatally wounded.
If they don't understand why the Horde ¨left¨the Broken Shore after the injury wich cost the Horde leader, almost Thrall and Baine.
They just want to be mad just for the sake of been mad.

[Xkiller9000]

All well and good, except that if that is the case, he doesnt have a leg to stand on.

- Sylvanas didnt kill his son. His son killed himself by jumping infront of an arrow, in the middle of a goddamned war. Sure, it was rather tragic, but you cant blame Sylvanas for something she never intended to do. Hell, She herself even admitted it. His son died trying to be heroic, not because Sylvanas tried to kill him. So he doesnt get to claim right to vengeance for that.

- Sylvanas also didnt kill Varian. If you want to blame anyone for that, blame Voljin for ordering her to make sure that the horde didnt "die" down to the last man fighting an overwhelming army of demons while the King Chin hurled petty insults at Garrosh. Hell, you cant even really blame Voljin. Varian's death lies completely on his own shoulders, since it was his choice to sacrifice himself to kill the Felreaver, when there must have been about a dozen different ways that they could have handled that situation.

remember, the alliance doesnt know that the horde had to retreat, to them, the horde abandoned the alliance

[greeeed]

Yes you can, Genn did this 100% for HIMSELF, even if he claims it was for the Alliance - it wasn't. Anduin never approved of his actions, and to start with didn't want him festering his anger towards the horde/sylvanas from the moment he found out his father died.

He already know, he sent him alongside 7th Legion.
A Fleet which always fight against the horde before Genn even joined them
(They are the one who fight battleship boss in IceCrown)


It's like other said, alliance don't know why they retreat.
Though he told Genn to act only if evidence that she will harm the alliance.

And that whey he was searching for what the hell she was doing.

Though he never stop attack them because he was 100% sure they are doing something, he just need to find evidence, and he found it.
And Like the NPC said, If she mange to control the Val'kyr, she will able to raise more undead( and having another extra life).
(Main reason for the Horde to fight the Alliance in Ashran was because Alliance found strong weapon.)

[Raetary]

Sylvanas doesn't care. How could she? She doesn't feel anything. She feels no love for anyone, not the Forsaken, or anybody else. She can't. That's what it means to be undead. She's not capable of having feelings. How much do you except someone with no feelings, someone incapable of love, to sacrifice for someone else? Sacrifices come from love and compassion.

undead do have emotions and feelings...

[RyanEX]

+10; He put me on ignore when I quotes his rant back to him


Because avenging the Warchief involves beating the Legion.
Meanwhile Genn wants revenge for:
1. His son, which jumped in front of an arrow.
2. His Kingdom, he has a point here.
3. Varian, which had nothing to do with the Horde. And even if it did, it has nothing to do with Sylvanas.


Yeah, now she dies in 2000 years! Damn you, Genn.

For point 1 if Sylvanas hadn't invaded his kingdom his son wouldn't have had to jump in front of the arrow when they fought to take it back. Either way it was a lose lose for her.

If He DIDN'T jump in front of the arrow we'd instead have Genn's son looking for revenge. Unless your point is that it's Genn's fault for fighting back in the first place.

[Spellweaver]

undead do have emotions and feelings...

I'm sure they can feel anger and hatred towards the living.

But they can't feel love, one of the Dark Rangers (Dark Ranger Velonara) in the Trueshot Lodge straight up tells the player that she can't feel love or happiness due to being an undead.

[Maxilian]

I'm sure they can feel anger and hatred towards the living.

But they can't feel love, one of the Dark Rangers (Dark Ranger Velonara) in the Trueshot Lodge straight up tells the player that she can't feel love or happiness due to being an undead.

Its not completely true that they can't feel love, but "Good emotions" are weaker, reason why is easier for them to get hang up with bad emotions (like anger and hatred)

[Spellweaver]

Its not completely true that they can't feel love, but "Good emotions" are weaker, reason why is easier for them to get hang up with bad emotions (like anger and hatred)

If it's not completely true, how do you explain this exact quote from Dark Ranger Velonara?

"<The dark ranger sighs.> I suppose he has a certain charm. He can't help his ignorance. But he must realize that my heart is incapable of feeling love or happiness, nor could we... engage in the sort of intimacy he desires. I am a dead, rotting thing, and only the abyss awaits me. Please if you find any fondness for him at all, break his heart now. It will save him true pain later. <Velonara pauses for a moment, then takes a single black rose and caresses its petals.>"

[Alienshroom]

Meh hardly a worthy moment from any angle, she could have easily killed him but he just walked away? Alright.

[Raetary]

I'm sure they can feel anger and hatred towards the living.

But they can't feel love, one of the Dark Rangers (Dark Ranger Velonara) in the Trueshot Lodge straight up tells the player that she can't feel love or happiness due to being an undead.

no.
the undead have less positive emotions like love or happiness, but they still can feel them.
it depends on the undead.

sylvanas loved vareesa till she broke her heart.
meryl can feel happiness, same with alonsus.

[Spellweaver]

sylvanas loved vareesa till she broke her heart.

Sure, Sylvanas loved Vereesa so much that she wanted to murder her and turn her into an undead.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Sure, Sylvanas loved Vereesa so much that she wanted to murder her and turn her into an undead.

Still love, twisted love, but love none the less.

After learning of the plan's failure, the Banshee Queen rampaged through the wilderness, angrily killing any wildlife unfortunate enough to get in her way and proclaiming that she would never attempt to love again.[39]
http://wow.gamepedia.com/Sylvanas_Windrunner#War_Crimes

[Raetary]

Sure, Sylvanas loved Vereesa so much that she wanted to murder her and turn her into an undead.

she wanted to give her a painless death then raise her so she can rule by her side, the forsaken would never accept a living as their leader and sylvanas knew that.

vareesa was just bitchy enough to accept the offer and give sylvanas false hopes.

[Darththeo]

If it's not completely true, how do you explain this exact quote from Dark Ranger Velonara?

"<The dark ranger sighs.> I suppose he has a certain charm. He can't help his ignorance. But he must realize that my heart is incapable of feeling love or happiness, nor could we... engage in the sort of intimacy he desires. I am a dead, rotting thing, and only the abyss awaits me. Please if you find any fondness for him at all, break his heart now. It will save him true pain later. <Velonara pauses for a moment, then takes a single black rose and caresses its petals.>"

Maybe you should pay attention to that. Look at the last part ... it is clear she DOES feel positive emotions. Her actions directly contract her quote.

[Kallisto]

So let all these players skip it, does that mean the people who do want to learn more of the lore are shit out of luck, because other players might not care? That's a bad way to design the game, and that's a bad way to deal with lore.

It's called why bother wasting time, money and effort on things the vast majority of people will just skip, they're a business not a charity and anything that isn't profitable is to be canned. If you care about lore buy the books. If you're too poor to pay $10 a year on a new book then maybe look for a new hobby. (This is coming from someone that does care about lore.)

[Maxilian]

If it's not completely true, how do you explain this exact quote from Dark Ranger Velonara?

"<The dark ranger sighs.> I suppose he has a certain charm. He can't help his ignorance. But he must realize that my heart is incapable of feeling love or happiness, nor could we... engage in the sort of intimacy he desires. I am a dead, rotting thing, and only the abyss awaits me. Please if you find any fondness for him at all, break his heart now. It will save him true pain later. <Velonara pauses for a moment, then takes a single black rose and caresses its petals.>"

Is true that she can't... engage in the sort of intimacy he desires, but she does feel love, a little bit twisted and not the same way as living things (but it have been seen in different kind of quests and others that undead can feel love, rare, but they can)

[Oneirophobia]

But that doesn't change the fact that Alliance players tend to not like Sylvanas and would want to see her plan to enslave Eyir fail.

I like Sylvanas. The game would get mighty boring if she was as flat, one dimensional and boring as the characters on our side. At least Genn is stirring shit up, I guess. He still come across as an idiot who doesn't stop and think to me, though.

[Maxilian]

It's called why bother wasting time, money and effort on things the vast majority of people will just skip, they're a business not a charity and anything that isn't profitable is to be canned. If you care about lore buy the books. If you're too poor to pay $10 a year on a new book then maybe look for a new hobby. (This is coming from someone that does care about lore.)

I don't agree with you, as someone who cares about the lore, but who doesn't have the money to spend on books (or just spend it on other things like the new DND adventure), but i do agree that there are other ways to learn this things (Like wowpedia), its not as detailed as the book (and will never be the same) but its better than nothing (sometimes i read those things first and then the book)

[PrivateSmiley]

before you get on your Genn Graymane highhorse, i think you need to remember some things

he LEFT the alliance during the 3rd war.

het LET the high elves and the citizens of Loaderon be destroyed and consumed by the scourg,

and he did NOTHING to help them.

he had FORSAKEN his neighbors for his own selfish pride and greed.

remember that.