No flying in 7.0 confirmed

[Mafic]

i think that will go the other way around, in WoD most peoples didn't give to much to no fly because there were problems that eclipsed it, if legion has less problems and more content peoples will most likely begin to notice no-flying and ask for it.

Avianna's feather was nerfed late in the expansion cycle and garrisons hid a lot of issues with world design and by restricting flight. We are already seeing cracks formed and we haven't hit the 30 day mark. The litmus test as always is 30-60 days where infatuations wears off and reality starts to set in where the possibility of no flight for 12 months is a real possibility.

[rebecca191]

At this point the question really is will no flying + lots of world content lead to faster burnout, slower burnout, or no real difference at all. A couple weeks in beta was enough to burn me out but I've always hated no flight zones. So who knows how average player will feel in a month or two, I guess time will tell.

[Connll]

Blizzard has changed what they consider success, so they like box sales and everything else is a bonus. The problem is that was way back when they were still talking about faster expansions.

True, but considering how fast they had to change directions after the no-flight-ever-again announcement, I think there is a decent chance that the guys Higher in the hierarchy saw a loss in hard curreny flowing into their coffers, and took action.

Don´t you think Legion will experience a similar event?

This is why this mid expansion talk translates to probably a year wait for flying most likely and that will not fly or be acceptable by the vast majority of the playerbase.

Very Likely true.

I see 3 possibilities: 1- Players revolt again shortly (1-2 months) after launch; 2- Players do not revolt at all; 3- Players do not revolt, but simply throw their hands up to the sky and quit in disgust, quietly.

Option 1- Would probably reult in Flight being enabled sooner, for whomever forced the devs hand the first time, will probably do so again if the game experiences a massive sub loss;
Option 2- In this case, the devs would simply *not* enable flight at all (this is what they want, after all), or maybe enable it in 8.0;
Option 3- If this happens, the alarms will be sounded, but since the current devs dislike Flight, they will not be able to connect the dots; servers will only get emptier and emptier.

Of course its always possible that something completely different happens. But those are the 3 outcomes I see as most likely.

[Eapoe]

Avianna's feather was nerfed late in the expansion cycle and garrisons hid a lot of issues with world design and by restricting flight. We are already seeing cracks formed and we haven't hit the 30 day mark. The litmus test as always is 30-60 days where infatuations wears off and reality starts to set in where the possibility of no flight for 12 months is a real possibility.

If there was a nerf to Aviana, it wasn't until flight was released. Garrisons didn't hide anything about the world, they just made it where the world was not needed. Quite a difference, and anyone who actually went into the world knows there was very little wrong with it. It was not a perfect world, and there was no incentive to be in it after the first month or 2 when you were overloaded on quest items. The garrison however did not hide the world from anyone.
As for your next point, what are these "cracks" you try to bring up every other post? Are you talking about the people who feel like there is nothing to do? Do you mean the people who feel like there is too much to do? Are you talking about the people who complain about no flight in a world that is easily accessible but they don't want to spend an extra 2 seconds of thought figuring out the 20-30 second path around the mountain they complain about?
Do you post anything other than doomsaying and unsubstantiated complaints?
Let's face it, after 507 pages and 10,000+ posts the only things that hold true in this forum is simply:
Flight is out of the game for the new areas at this time. Some people are upset, some people aren't. Everything else has been feces slinging and opinions.

[Anzaman]

Then again, even if some players do end up revolting, it's quite hard to say how large amount of players actually feel that way. We can't really just connect frozen accounts to flight either, since it might not have anything to do with it. Forum up/downvotes are quite eh, very small part of players use forums, and then again.. how many actually use up/downvote system.. I usually try to avoid forums with such systems.

Like for example I would have most likely just purchased an month along with Legion since there's slight content drought in FFXIV, and it would have been perfect chance to come and check how it's going over here, and after that month I could've gone back for new major-patch. But sadly my driving school happened to be around same time, so I can just read and watch other people playing it, such pain to try to avoid most major spoilers.

[Connll]

Did you even read what you're replying to? I was talking about them abandoning "no flight ever" but sticking with their vision of creating content designed to be tackled from the ground. That is why we have pathfinder coming later in the expansion. If you consider that a "pro-flight" victory then there should be nothing for you to complain about, but from what you post it seems you consider that to be more what "anti-flight" people wanted.

We have patchfinder coming later in the Xpack because the devs are a bunch of spiteful morons. There is no rational reason to not include flight or delay it, as demonstraded multiple times in this thread.

A rational adult would understand that his experiment failed, and would simply re-enable Flight. A rational adult would also state his plans for complete removal of Flight BEFORE WoD´s launch, so that his customers could make informed decisions, not try to hide the announcement in an obscure site after stringing players along with false promises until almost the end of the game´s development cycle.


Instead, we got this: Patch finder is nothing more than allowing flight after there is nothing else to use it for; its practical effect is essentially the same as removing flight form the game. Again, as demonstrated multiple times in this thread.

What do I have to be bitter about?

You mean what you are projecting.

First, your inability of even read what the text is saying: Example: I ask for something more substantial than projecting; Your answer is about bitterness; textbook case of non-sequitur.

Second, your utter inability of even considering that people might like something different than you;

Third, your false accusations: You accuse me of being "bitter" about the game not being made "to my exact specifications", which is bullshit, because:

A) with Flight, everyone can play in whatever way it strikers their fancy, Sky or ground, as opposed to groudn only;
B) I have said more than once that if Patch finder would be completable at launch, I would do it, albeit reluctantly;

As opposed to YOU, who are simply unable to accept anything other than everyone grounded in any and all relevant content.

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Then again, even if some players do end up revolting, it's quite hard to say how large amount of players actually feel that way. We can't really just connect frozen accounts to flight either, since it might not have anything to do with it. Forum up/downvotes are quite eh, very small part of players use forums, and then again.. how many actually use up/downvote system.. I usually try to avoid forums with such systems.

Correct. The only way (that I can think of) A player can revolt in this case is not only posting in the forums, but unsubscribing and stating clearly that no-Flight was the cause.

Although is it possible that, once the losses reach a certain treshold, Flight is re-enabled as a marketing tool. Remember Burning Crusade? They announced Flying mounts as one of the big features of that Xpack.

[Deleted]

And there's plenty of people who say things like "flying iz dumb an ur dumb 4 wanting it".

How about we focus on the real discussion instead of wasting time on the low-end of the spectrum? Yeah?

I guess those people wont mind blizzard removing every flying mount in the game and disabling flying for all previous expansion because why have a flying mount if you cant fly.

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The reaction to "no flight ever" showed there was a sizable number of players happy (or at least content or ambivalent) to do without flight in current content as long as they get to fly eventually, in other words people who are happy (or at least content or ambivalent) with pathfinder, or as you would call them "anti-fliers."

You're just bitter about the game not being developed to your exact specifications so you're creating accusations of spite instead of accepting that not everyone shares you're taste.

Ok so the people that dont care about flying are happy so that means the rest of us are not entitled to be happy with the game because the no flyers got what they want.

Add flying into the game, if the no flyers dont want flying fine dont get it for the rest they can, win win.

I am just getting ****** off with the 5-10m detours trying to find a way to a quest that is right next to me on another level (Like the wisp world quest today)

[GasaiYuno951]

this is still an issue? lol wow

[Mafic]

We have patchfinder coming later in the Xpack because the devs are a bunch of spiteful morons. There is no rational reason to not include flight or delay it, as demonstraded multiple times in this thread.

A rational adult would understand that his experiment failed, and would simply re-enable Flight. A rational adult would also state his plans for complete removal of Flight BEFORE WoD´s launch, so that his customers could make informed decisions, not try to hide the announcement in an obscure site after stringing players along with false promises until almost the end of the game´s development cycle.


Instead, we got this: Patch finder is nothing more than allowing flight after there is nothing else to use it for; its practical effect is essentially the same as removing flight form the game. Again, as demonstrated multiple times in this thread.



You mean what you are projecting.

First, your inability of even read what the text is saying: Example: I ask for something more substantial than projecting; Your answer is about bitterness; textbook case of non-sequitur.

Second, your utter inability of even considering that people might like something different than you;

Third, your false accusations: You accuse me of being "bitter" about the game not being made "to my exact specifications", which is bullshit, because:

A) with Flight, everyone can play in whatever way it strikers their fancy, Sky or ground, as opposed to groudn only;
B) I have said more than once that if Patch finder would be completable at launch, I would do it, albeit reluctantly;

As opposed to YOU, who are simply unable to accept anything other than everyone grounded in any and all relevant content.

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Correct. The only way (that I can think of) A player can revolt in this case is not only posting in the forums, but unsubscribing and stating clearly that no-Flight was the cause.

Although is it possible that, once the losses reach a certain treshold, Flight is re-enabled as a marketing tool. Remember Burning Crusade? They announced Flying mounts as one of the big features of that Xpack.

There is a rational reason for Blizzard not to be forthright with the plans for flight in WoD and Legion. Their primary goal is to maximize upfront, front loaded box sales, because if they laid out the plan for flight for Legion in its entirety it would make a lot of players balk.

This is the slow boil of the frog in the pot method. Have players invest in the expansion and then do the bait and switch hoping they have accepted and normalized the game without flying through psychological conditioning. They tried this method in WoD, but it failed, because players could not accept a world without flying given how WoD was designed. So, Blizzard did the same thing with Legion but introduced the flight whistle hoping players don't notice the illusion once more.

The flight whistle so far has worked, but it is simply a gimmick and like Avianna's feather it has severe limitations as the expansion drags on and artifact power needed for next upgrade scales at a staggering pacing. Players are hitting 18k AP for next upgrade and that will worsen in the next month.

By then, not even the flight whistle can mask the grind that awaits players.

It is the slow boil that kills the frog not the sudden surge of heat.

If you think Blizzard will not try again to incapacitate or outright remove flying be ready for another surprise.

[Dormie]

Funny how many flying arguments revolve around some conspiracy of Bliz being maniacal.

[Mafic]

At this point the question really is will no flying + lots of world content lead to faster burnout, slower burnout, or no real difference at all. A couple weeks in beta was enough to burn me out but I've always hated no flight zones. So who knows how average player will feel in a month or two, I guess time will tell.

The burnout rate would have been normal as other expansions, but Blizzard with artifact power with no flying is going to accelerate burn out of players. Once legendaries are required for certain group encounters players will feel the slog of the Broken Isles.

Flying isn't something they can yank out and replace..even with the gimmicks they still fail to replicate what flying adds and means to the player base as a whole.

[Eapoe]

There is a rational reason for Blizzard not to be forthright with the plans for flight in WoD and Legion. Their primary goal is to maximize upfront, front loaded box sales, because if they laid out the plan for flight for Legion in its entirety it would make a lot of players balk.

This is the slow boil of the frog in the pot method. Have players invest in the expansion and then do the bait and switch hoping they have accepted and normalized the game without flying through psychological conditioning. They tried this method in WoD, but it failed, because players could not accept a world without flying given how WoD was designed. So, Blizzard did the same thing with Legion but introduced the flight whistle hoping players don't notice the illusion once more.

The flight whistle so far has worked, but it is simply a gimmick and like Avianna's feather it has severe limitations as the expansion drags on and artifact power needed for next upgrade scales at a staggering pacing. Players are hitting 18k AP for next upgrade and that will worsen in the next month.

By then, not even the flight whistle can mask the grind that awaits players.

It is the slow boil that kills the frog not the sudden surge of heat.

If you think Blizzard will not try again to incapacitate or outright remove flying be ready for another surprise.

Blizzard had been forth coming with plans for flight. "Projected best guess towards the middle of the xpac." Take into account that Blizzqrd has also stated they are no longer going for faster and faster xpac releases to be able to concentrate on the one they have and to provide more quality in design and content. Furthering this idea is that looking at history of lengths of xpacs, it is a safe assumption that Legion will last 2-3 years. If you go by middle of xpac you are looking at 1-1.5 years before flight is brought in.
The fact you and others might not like that length of time is moot for the people that are playing if they find the game enjoyable. So far, this xpac has been easily accessible and there are still numerous amounts of things to be done.
As for your other doomsday prophecies, it should be well substantiated that there will be no lost subs due to lack of flight. This is easily determined by the fact that those they would have lost from it are already gone (the no fly no buy crowd), and those that quit going further on are going to be due to the fact that they are not enjoying the game as it is laid out. Sure you might have people like SirCowDog who is playing now, but even that lost sub can't be attributed to no flying in game as he wouldn't have played if it wasn't gifted/guilt tripped into playing again.

[Mafic]

Then again, even if some players do end up revolting, it's quite hard to say how large amount of players actually feel that way. We can't really just connect frozen accounts to flight either, since it might not have anything to do with it. Forum up/downvotes are quite eh, very small part of players use forums, and then again.. how many actually use up/downvote system.. I usually try to avoid forums with such systems.

Like for example I would have most likely just purchased an month along with Legion since there's slight content drought in FFXIV, and it would have been perfect chance to come and check how it's going over here, and after that month I could've gone back for new major-patch. But sadly my driving school happened to be around same time, so I can just read and watch other people playing it, such pain to try to avoid most major spoilers.

It is better to wait and see what patch 7.1 will bring and when it will release as it will be an indicator of where the expansion is heading. But by the time patch 7.1 releases FFXIV will have another expansion in the works or ready for the winter release.

[Glorious Leader]

It is better to wait and see what patch 7.1 will bring and when it will release as it will be an indicator of where the expansion is heading. But by the time patch 7.1 releases FFXIV will have another expansion in the works or ready for the winter release.

Should point out this holiday season is also jam packed with other games as well not just mmos. Shit and new consoles as well. Lot's of competition for the gaming dollar.

[Dhrizzle]

We have patchfinder coming later in the Xpack because the devs are a bunch of spiteful morons. There is no rational reason to not include flight or delay it, as demonstraded multiple times in this thread.

A rational adult would understand that his experiment failed, and would simply re-enable Flight. A rational adult would also state his plans for complete removal of Flight BEFORE WoD´s launch, so that his customers could make informed decisions, not try to hide the announcement in an obscure site after stringing players along with false promises until almost the end of the game´s development cycle.

Instead, we got this: Patch finder is nothing more than allowing flight after there is nothing else to use it for; its practical effect is essentially the same as removing flight form the game. Again, as demonstrated multiple times in this thread.



You mean what you are projecting.

First, your inability of even read what the text is saying: Example: I ask for something more substantial than projecting; Your answer is about bitterness; textbook case of non-sequitur.

Second, your utter inability of even considering that people might like something different than you;

Third, your false accusations: You accuse me of being "bitter" about the game not being made "to my exact specifications", which is bullshit, because:

A) with Flight, everyone can play in whatever way it strikers their fancy, Sky or ground, as opposed to groudn only;
B) I have said more than once that if Patch finder would be completable at launch, I would do it, albeit reluctantly;

As opposed to YOU, who are simply unable to accept anything other than everyone grounded in any and all relevant content.

It has been explained multiple times why the devs have chosen not to allow flight at the start of this expansion, I understand that you disagree but the fact that other people have different opinions to you does not make them spiteful, irrational or morons. It's laughable considering you're accusing me of not considering that people might like something different whilst throwing out those insults.


As for this part;

First, your inability of even read what the text is saying: Example: I ask for something more substantial than projecting; Your answer is about bitterness; textbook case of non-sequitur.

I said you were being bitter, you countered by saying I was projecting. The term "projecting" I assumed referred to psychological projecting, where I would have taken my own bitterness and projected it onto you. If that isn't what you meant could you please explain what you think "projecting" means in this case and I'll modify my reply.

Ok so the people that dont care about flying are happy so that means the rest of us are not entitled to be happy with the game because the no flyers got what they want.

Add flying into the game, if the no flyers dont want flying fine dont get it for the rest they can, win win.

I am just getting ****** off with the 5-10m detours trying to find a way to a quest that is right next to me on another level (Like the wisp world quest today)

It's been explained a few times that if Blizz allowed flying most gamers would use it as the best tool to overcome the obstacles set before them and quickest or most efficient path to their objectives. That means that Blizz would either have to balance the game around people using the flying mounts so players who don't use them will have their progression hampered, or they balance the game around ground mounts and have most players complain that they burned through the content too quickly.

Ultimately it boils down to flying not working with the sort of content Blizz want to make in WoW, so they cut it out of the game.

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Funny how many flying arguments revolve around some conspiracy of Bliz being maniacal.

Blizz are simultaneously masters of manipulation and experts at understanding the human psyche whilst simultaneously being blithering idiots who can't see the trends even a random forum poster can figure out.

[Ordinator]

I said you were being bitter, you countered by saying I was projecting. The term "projecting" I assumed referred to psychological projecting, where I would have taken my own bitterness and projected it onto you. If that isn't what you meant could you please explain what you think "projecting" means in this case and I'll modify my reply.

So far he's accused everyone of projecting. It's his go to argument. Lol.

[Mafic]

Should point out this holiday season is also jam packed with other games as well not just mmos. Shit and new consoles as well. Lot's of competition for the gaming dollar.

Yeah patch 7.1 will be better than patch 6.1 but with no flying and with not much else planned for the patch other than Kara it is not exactly a patch to be excited about either.

[Vestig3]

Why are people under the impression that WoW loosing many subscriptions in wod and that Legion will loose many have anything with flying not being ingame right now? Are you that delusional to see the real reason WoD lost so many subs?

[rebecca191]

I sure how you adhered to your stupid signature and didn't buy the expac. It gives me GREAT pleasure to think that you would be skipping the best expansion in the game due to your ignorant views on flying.

And please don't spread misinformation. There is a lot in 7.1 beyond Kara that has already been announced.

I swear, some people are victims of their own stupidity. Cheers!

Some of us who chose not to buy it played beta. Legion has potential but no flying ruined any chance of me wanting to play more than a couple of weeks at this time so I didn't buy it. WotLK and BC were both much better in my opinion, WoD was worse, I can't say at this point whether I think Legion is better than Cata or MoP, theme/lore is better but game play was so irritating to me with no flying. I'll buy it later on when flying is on the PTR and do the damn achievement at that point. Legion may be the best expac to you, obviously it's not the best expac to others. There's no such thing as an objectively "best" expac.

[Zalamander]

I sure how you adhered to your stupid signature and didn't buy the expac. It gives me GREAT pleasure to think that you would be skipping the best expansion in the game due to your ignorant views on flying.

Don't let the hype get to you because its dying out pretty rapidly now.
This expansion already starting to feel locked behind artificial gating and when I think about it I still had at least as fun this long after release in Mists of Pandaria AND I was flying and still enjoyed the world.