Organ Donor: 'Yes Unless' - Netherlands

[Xykotic]

Imagine having a sick mother. Who will die within the next 2 days, then it becoming apparant to you that someone, now dead. Opted out of giving their perfectly fine organs to save your mothers life, and would rather just set that shit on fire in a big oven, or let it rot away in the ground for arbitrary reasons like: "I think the idea sounds gross" or "My magic book says so".

I'm glad I don't have to deal with this situation. Keeping it anonymous is irrelevant, you're still just literally an immoral, bad person if you'd rather burn your organs to dust instead of having them save lives.

Feeling like I might get infracted for this, but I don't care. You are a bad person if you opt out of being an organ donor. Period.

[Mekh]

Isn't it up to the justice system to protect its citizens from those kind of people, though? I'd agree that in countries like the US this really wouldn't work at all, not yet anyway. Seeing as most (if not all) hospitals are for-profit ones, unlike here in The Netherlands.

The whole bribery thing only happens because there's not enough donor organs to go around. As soon as it's opt-out viable donors will likely outnumber people in need of organ donation.

[Canpinter]

If this ever comes to England I'll be opting out straight away. Don't like the idea of my doctor being bribed by some rich cunt to let me die so he can get my organs.

here's the thing tho, if everyone donates there would be no reason to bribe the doctor because there would be no shortage. it would be like the doctor leting you die cause he really needed that pen you had in your pocket.

[s_bushido]

if you have to opt in as a donor, your life belongs to you and you are making a organ donation

You're dead. There is no "life" involved.

[Deleted]

Are your organs going to help you as a corpse? No? Then why do you need them? Remember, fairy tales aren't valid justifications.

Actually, it's not up to you to decide what a valid justification for others is.

[Ærion]

Yes unless they have a remaining life expectancy under 40 years. Take all my organs, give them to young people.
Fuck rich old shitbags that keep hanging on to life by exchanging their failing parts for new ones. I'd rather get burned to ash then let a fossil live another 2 years.

[Deleted]

Isn't it up to the justice system to protect its citizens from those kind of people, though? I'd agree that in countries like the US this really wouldn't work at all, not yet anyway. Seeing as most (if not all) hospitals are for-profit ones, unlike here in The Netherlands.

The state is supposed to work for it's people but the only thing they are always unanimous is whether they should raise they own pay.

Things are not the way they should be, EVER.

[Rotted]

We have the same thing here in Wales (UK) I'm honestly in two minds about it.

I have no issue giving blood and I'd like to think if someone I knew needed a organ I'd do it. But the thought of someone cutting me up after I died just feels wrong, I haven't opted yet and I don't know if I will, its just I have no idea atm

[Seditian]

I guess the fairy tale in question is that human beings nor their bodies are property? Of anyone, or of the government? That's all I'm standing on here -- if you have to opt in as a donor, your life belongs to you and you are making a organ donation. If you have to opt out from being livestock, you belong to the government and the state is taking an organ confiscation. The former defines a just and moral relationship between the state and the individual and the latter defines an unjust and immoral one.

People who get opted in automatically will have a different "state" in the databank. For example: there will be three categories if this law makes it through. Yes, by default and no. If they ever decide to revoke this (I doubt it and hopefully they don't), they can instantly put all the yes-defaulted people back to no-defaulted.

I'm not sure where you're coming from with your (im)moral argument. Is it suddenly less moral to be a donor if you became a donor by default? You're still a donor and you haven't taken the 3 minutes of your life to opt-out so apparently you either wanted to be a donor, or you're too lazy to opt-out in which case you shouldn't be mad that they're using your organs to save other people's lives.

The state is supposed to work for it's people but the only thing they are always unanimous is whether they should raise they own pay.

Things are not the way they should be, EVER.

Canpinter makes a good point though, they wouldn't need to get bribed by (rich) people because the wait lists would be near non-existant. That's the ideal situation, anyway.

[Runenwächter]

My organs are not public property, you either get explicitly mentioned in my last will or you get fuck all. And while I would probably condone such transplantation if it were to save family or loved ones, I am deeply opposed to anything but an opt in.

There have been enough cases (even in my own country, lets not even talk internationaly) were doctors exchanged favors to get patients with deep pockets ahead of others. I know that is partialy due to the lack of donors. But I am not entering a system where my organs posses monetary value and thus give anyone incentive to do less than their utmost to save my life.

[Tikaru]

We have the same thing here in Wales (UK) I'm honestly in two minds about it.

I have no issue giving blood and I'd like to think if someone I knew needed a organ I'd do it. But the thought of someone cutting me up after I died just feels wrong, I haven't opted yet and I don't know if I will, its just I have no idea atm

Why? Why does that feel wrong? You're dead. Your organs are going to rot (or turn to ash if you choose cremation), why let them go to waste if they can save someone's life?

[Allybeboba]

I find some people don't like the idea of "being harvested", which I still find ridiculous, since you're dead and all.... but there still seems to be a lot of people that think you'll come into the emergency room with some huge "organ donor" flag on your stretcher, which will cause the Doctor to throw his hands up and maliciously state that there's just no saving you, while rubbing his hands together and cackling over the mere thought of all the other people he could save with your organs.

I personally have been a registered organ donor ever since I could opt in for as has my wife and daughters. Nearly 9 million in my state alone are so registered donors. It is personal choice that the government should not be making for us. It is paramount to them telling you how many children you can have.
When one liberty is taken another one is slowly removed, then another, then another, the another, and eventually we will completely be under government control or sucking off the government teet with no means to get off of it.

[Deleted]

Why? Why does that feel wrong? You're dead.

BENEFITS OF THE KILLED ( emphasis with migrants barbarians and hallal terrorism )

[Super Kami Dende]

when I die they can take whatever they need form me.

People who opt out of being organ donors are pieces of shit.

[Rotted]

Why? Why does that feel wrong? You're dead. Your organs are going to rot (or turn to ash if you choose cremation), why let them go to waste if they can save someone's life?

Why does anything feel right or wrong?

[Ishayu]

I can see the logical benefits of people being saved when there's a shortage of organs, but there are so many things wrong with this it's not even funny, especially on a human rights and legal level.

1) The government now owns your very body until you tell them otherwise ON THEIR TERMS. The government can make this deliberately complicated if they want to.
This is fundamentally at odds with almost every western constitution.

2) It is likely for a lot of people to not know about this law or know how to change it, putting them at risk of doctors looking for some money for an organ transplant. Without their consent, they can now be deliberately murdered (and the doctor can claim it was an accident, many people die in hospitals or clinics anyway) and then legally harvest for their organs by their doctor.

3) That doctor from 2) can then sell the harvested organs on the black market. I hear China would like some organs very much.

And that's just the beginning. This is a REALLY bad idea. It feels like a good idea at first, but the legal and rights implications of it, as well as the possibility for corruption, are completely ridiculous.

[Aeula]

here's the thing tho, if everyone donates there would be no reason to bribe the doctor because there would be no shortage. it would be like the doctor leting you die cause he really needed that pen you had in your pocket.

Not even worth the risk. What if my organs compatible in a way none of the others are? Not going to chance it.

[s_bushido]

It is paramount to them telling you how many children you can have.

How? That statement is gibberish. Having children will impact the rest of your life. Having your organs given to someone who needs them won't impact you at all...because you'd be dead.

When one liberty is taken another one is slowly removed, then another, then another, the another, and eventually we will completely be under government control or sucking off the government teet with no means to get off of it.

Whoops. Fresh out of tin foil. Guess I need to run to the store.

[Allybeboba]

here's the thing tho, if everyone donates there would be no reason to bribe the doctor because there would be no shortage. it would be like the doctor leting you die cause he really needed that pen you had in your pocket.

They can bribe people to get the "good" ones. The rich person gets the one from the 16 year old that was killed in a car accident while the middle class person gets the organs from the poor bastard that died from cancer.

[Ealyssa]

But there will definitely be a social stigma to saying no now that you have to go out of your way to do so.

And that's fine. Being a selfish bastard even in death should be frowned upon.

IMO people opting out of donating should also not receive any organ if they may need one.