Is 850 item level gear incentive enough to do kara?

[Lochton]

They said they gave it a weekly lockout so they could make the gear a higher item level. 850 is pretty low considering its rather easy to get that in mythic and mythic plus dungeons. Should have been 860 or 865.

You shouldn't really look at item level of content before it is released, sometimes the numbers aren't what they should be. Then again, Karazhan isn't meant to be massive, still just a dungeon while we are apparently to have a mini raid too, if one is to believe the Q&A.

[threads]

850 is in line with mythic dungeons. kara isn't a new raid.

[Asrialol]

Having it as heroic so everyone can do it would be incentive, but trying to get a mythic group probably means I'll be skipping it. Not through choice, just through reality.

Will still try and do the attunement though - that should be fun.

I love how you try to make it seem as if not everyone can do mythic.

[grandgato]

I love how you try to make it seem as if not everyone can do mythic.

Everyone can do them, which is why they should be available through the LFD system.

[schwarzkopf]

I love how you try to make it seem as if not everyone can do mythic.

The maths means that many DPS won't get into mythics.

Raids - 80% of people are DPS
Dungeons - 60% of people are DPS

That's a 20% disparity.

In WoD, I didn't get into any mythics until almost a year after launch.

An automatic LFD tool for mythics would give level access to all DPS.

Would be simple enough to make it that you have to have done the relevant heroic say 3 times to do the mythic via the tool.

[ShiyoKozuki]

Ah, and which peer-reviewed study do you have on hand to prove this claim?

Playing vanilla and other MMO's since 2004 and watching the effect it had on them, and how mmos without cross server and queueing for content had 100x better communities and easier to make friends.

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If they made the new Kara drop 100% ilevel 100 gear. With the solo or exception of each class having a single piece of gear that was ilevel 851 coming only from te final boss. People would be complaining because Kara is "mandatory". They don't need to give each raid/instance tier a big boost anything will do.

They do when it'll be easier than the normal raid yet give the same damn gear.

[ShiyoKozuki]

I will agree that somehow it often felt like I had an easier time getting into groups in Vanilla/TBC than I do today. But then, I think that's largely a factor of the potential pool of people to choose from is just so huge now compared to back then when you kinda had to just make do with who was online on your server at the time.

That's EXACTLY the problem! Why stick with what you have when there's a new shinier better group of players 2 clicks away? It makes people disposable, which is horrible.

[Deleted]

Playing vanilla and other MMO's since 2004 and watching the effect it had on them, and how mmos without cross server and queueing for content had 100x better communities and easier to make friends.

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They do when it'll be easier than the normal raid yet give the same damn gear.

Just out of curiosity. how do you know kara will be easier then normal raids? My understanding was it would be a 5 man raid equivalent.

[Otimus]

That's EXACTLY the problem! Why stick with what you have when there's a new shinier better group of players 2 clicks away? It makes people disposable, which is horrible.

With that train of thought, you'd also have to be willing to start merging realms, as some just can't sustain themselves that way (Which is really all a lot of the stuff Blizzard has done has been to avoid doing, for whatever reason (my guess is it's because realm mergers are always seen as bad publicity).

[Deleted]

oh god damn... why does everything need an "incentive" to do? why dont you just do it for the fun it will bring?
remember kara? it was awesome, and with new tech and new shit it probably will be awesome again.
and on ilvl, its just 10 ilvl higher then current mythics but it is still higher, so if you really have an incentive to do mythics or mythics+ then kara should still be top for the 2 free ilvlupgrades (since gear scales by 5 points).
just do the content for the content, not for some aribtrary carrot on a stick.........

[Otimus]

oh god damn... why does everything need an "incentive" to do? why dont you just do it for the fun it will bring?
remember kara? it was awesome, and with new tech and new shit it probably will be awesome again.
and on ilvl, its just 10 ilvl higher then current mythics but it is still higher, so if you really have an incentive to do mythics or mythics+ then kara should still be top for the 2 free ilvlupgrades (since gear scales by 5 points).
just do the content for the content, not for some aribtrary carrot on a stick.........

I would imagine it's not so much the incentive to do, but the incentive to do it more than just once. Seriously, even things I really, really, really, really love, (Well, except Super Mario World, I could probably replay that every week for a year before getting bored with it!) I don't exactly want to play over and over again.

I'd argue there's really not much in WoW, or any MMORPG, really, that is fun enough to stand on it's on merits to warrant repeated rapid succession play. You need either friends or items to entice you. That's pretty much by design.

[Marston]

I would imagine it's not so much the incentive to do, but the incentive to do it more than just once. Seriously, even things I really, really, really, really love, (Well, except Super Mario World, I could probably replay that every week for a year before getting bored with it!) I don't exactly want to play over and over again.

I'd argue there's really not much in WoW, or any MMORPG, really, that is fun enough to stand on it's on merits to warrant repeated rapid succession play. You need either friends or items to entice you. That's pretty much by design.

For all we know, each boss could drop guaranteed 200 Artifact power or Blood of Sargeras or something else. Karazhan could get a weekly quest with rewards. Maybe the upgradeable ring, that goes all the way up to 875 may need upgrades over several weeks. I am pretty sure even with "only" itemlevel 850-855 loot there could be more than enough reasons to go there.

[Wingspan]

Not really, people do not always know whats good for them. Instant gratification people dont care if its bad for the genre or not, they WANT IT NOW!!! They dont care about anything but themselves, not the community, or heath of the game, only "I want to get in and get out asap because my time is valuable".

Yes really, because it is not ultimately in the hands of the players to include (or not include) a queue system in their game. That is 100% determined by the developers.


The mere fact that queue systems have not been completely abolished from mmos by these same developers is all the proof you need to see that even the developers have no evidence to prove that queues hurt more than they help.


There is simply no proof (at all) to support your claim... only your personal feelings/opinion on the matter.

[Deleted]

Go play on a wod private server if u want all content to be queueable.

Haha, just had to quote because it made me laugh
I doubt there is WoD private servers that are populated, or if there even is any WoD servers, but I guess I could be wrong

[IIamaKing]

People are so damn hypocritical.

In one breath in the other thread you'll rant about how if a run is 11 minutes instead of 10 that you're "carrying" and wasting your time and why should you have to endure that when you're so awesome because you deserve fast, smooth runs and blah blah.

In your next, you complain about "instant gratification" people who "want it now now now" because they want to just queue and play the game with the time they have.

If people spent less time trying to constantly one-up each other by calling them out for every perceived shortcoming in regards to their approach to playing a damn video game, maybe we'd all be a little better off.

Apples and oranges, nothing "instant" about me putting together a higher ilvl group after I ground out the gear.

[Asrialol]

The maths means that many DPS won't get into mythics.

Raids - 80% of people are DPS
Dungeons - 60% of people are DPS

That's a 20% disparity.

In WoD, I didn't get into any mythics until almost a year after launch.

An automatic LFD tool for mythics would give level access to all DPS.

Would be simple enough to make it that you have to have done the relevant heroic say 3 times to do the mythic via the tool.

Nothing stops you from rolling a healer or a tank. Nothing stops you from making your own group. There is absolutely no reason mythics should be included in the LFD tool.

[grandgato]

Nothing stops you from rolling a healer or a tank. Nothing stops you from making your own group. There is absolutely no reason mythics should be included in the LFD tool.

There are plenty of reasons why Mythic Dungeons should be available to queue. They aren't challenging enough to warrant their exclusiveness being first and foremost.

[IIamaKing]

It's not apples and oranges at all. But yeah, I knew you'd reply with something along the lines of, "But it's not the same for me, I HAVE GEAR!"

So everyone else is impatient, entitled little brats who just "Want it now" because they want to use a prominent feature in the game to do things faster, but not you. No sir, due to your item level, you EARNED the right to be impatient and want it now and do things faster and not have to endure painful 11 minute runs.

I mean, just look at your posts in the other thread and how amazingly impatient and intolerant you are there, then come back and look at what you're complaining about here. It's just amazing that you feel the need to call these people out when your attitude is such.

Seriously, you complained SO MUCH about the idea of a run maybe being a little slower, or how much time it would take for you to look at someone's gear rather than item level, and then you have the nerve to try to bash others for - as you put it - "I want to get in and get out asap because my time is valuable"

It's comical, it really is.

First I wasn't complaining about shit here, so stow that. I simply stated that players do not necessarily choose the path thats BEST, they choose whats fastest.

In the other thread, I was saying that yeh, when I run mythics, I have no need or want to bring in lower ilvls. Because, it could slow me down, BOTH of my views are rooted in the same logic. Players choose the fastest route.

But, you argue about every thing, make hyperbolic bullshit points all over the place, done with you here. Good day.

[IIamaKing]

So basically what I said. You think you get to be impatient because of your item level but if anyone else values their own time they need to be berated for it.

What item level should I have before I'm allowed to not want to waste my time? If I'm 850 do I get to start charging people for talking to me?

What in the actual fuck are you babbling about? You know what, never mind I dont care.

[Darkeon]

Why is that? Whats so hard about hopping into the GF to find a group or use it to make your own?

I just rather not deal with the typical toxicity that the place is known for. If, in the end, the solution is to get a random group anyways, I find the lack of queue-able option to be just stubbornness.