[Prot] WoD/Legion Alpha Discussion

[Taeldorian]

I honestly do think LotP needed a nerf. At 35% * 1.2 * (1+Vers) * 1.3, LotP was getting ridiculous. (not even talking about relics boosting it more, or Avenging Wrath) It was getting up into the 60-70% of missing health range at times, on potentially a 6-8 sec CD, which is not really the "tanks less self-sufficient, more self-reliant on healers" model they're going for.

Now, Ignore Pain definitely needs a fucking nerf too, but that's a separate issue.

I wonder when the ignore pain nerf will come. I hope soon because it makes Prot Warriors really OP. Easiest tank to heal in mythics by far.

I don't think this nerf is too bad. Prot Paladins were also really easy to heal. I just dislike seeing Prot Paladins being brought down without ignore pain being touched.

[Sacredknight19]

Pawn weights ( Pawn: v1: "Comb_Pre_raid": Strength=7.4, Stamina=7.94, CritRating=6.9915, HasteRating=8.144, MasteryRating=7.566, Versatility=8.2235, Armor=19.608, Dps=1.7905)

From prot pally discord

[Kaharon]

Maybe I was just playing poorly but I felt much weaker as a prot paladin than on my vengeance tank and blood dk in dungeons, of course I could not try out raids yet but they all have comparable ilvl (845). Could of course be that dk and dh both are self-sustain tanks whereas my paladin always requires some healing.

Them now nerfing our self-heal and utility as an off-tank, I don't really like it. Just shows how Blizzard usually balances stuff, first buff it, then nerf it again.

[Masternewt]

There we go, as expected. Self heal nerf, survivability nerf (even shittier shields with AS) and damage nerf. And that's before they even see how things play out in raids.

[epec]

There we go, as expected. Self heal nerf, survivability nerf (even shittier shields with AS) and damage nerf. And that's before they even see how things play out in raids.

Yeah, glad my warrior is almost geared at 110. In the 12 years off and on playing this game, I have no faith at all for blizzard not to make completely retarded unfounded changes based on the emotional whim of some dev. The simple fact they can make this change with the current state of warriors sends a strong message.

[Nuckels]

So are you as bad at cs as you are at wow?

Worse, im good at SSBM tho.

[kirielle]

Trying to give Pawn a go, as secondaries play a larger part in this expac for tanks than it did before.

Figuring out a stat weight to follow for a basic

Haste > Vers > Mastery > Crit kind of build

Does the following look to be correct (Kind of took the one from Noxxic - I know horrible source, and rejigged it to be more correct, but unsure on the values)?

Stamina [12.07] > Haste [9.07] > Versatility [7.57] > Mastery [6.07] > Crit [4.57] > Strength [3.07]

Pawn weights ( Pawn: v1: "Comb_Pre_raid": Strength=7.4, Stamina=7.94, CritRating=6.9915, HasteRating=8.144, MasteryRating=7.566, Versatility=8.2235, Armor=19.608, Dps=1.7905)

From prot pally discord

These numbers are incredibly specific for something that varies based on gearset, boss mechanics, and raid composition

[Deleted]

These numbers are incredibly specific for something that varies based on gearset, boss mechanics, and raid composition

about the discord quote: "stats are combined of 4 metrics and me pulling things out of butt"

[Deleted]

These numbers are incredibly specific for something that varies based on gearset, boss mechanics, and raid composition

These numbers are as specific as you would expect them to be, considering how incredibly specific the conditions are for which they are calculated

Probably:
- no movement
- perfectly executed rotation
- averaged over more than a hundred thousand 7-minute fights

People protest against simmed numbers all the time and I don't blame them. The problem is that pages like noxxic put those values out without context. If you get those numbers from Theck or Liminiara they could write you a 20 page article on how they were calculated, how valid they are, how much they vary depending on your choice of talents, how they differ for bad players ect... etc...

[celinamuna]

These numbers are incredibly specific for something that varies based on gearset, boss mechanics, and raid composition

Because people want specific numbers. Very large portion of population do no care for it's variance due to gearsets, boss mechanics and raid comps.
They want to have an easy way to figure out which gear piece they want. Without re-running sims with both gear pieces on multiple simulations.

I can either provide numbers that i view as somewhat correct (based on my # analysis of a number of different things) vs them getting those numbers from noxxic.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

They should give us free artifact re-specs when they nerf specific artifact traits.

[Sepelio]

You wouldn't spec out of it anyway.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

(Hotfix in testing; to be applied with next weekly maintenance) Light of the Protector and Hand of the Protector now heals for 30% of missing health (down from 35%).
(Hotfix in testing; to be applied with next weekly maintenance) Scatter the Shadows (Protection Paladin artifact trait) now increases the healing of Light of the Protector by 6/12/18% (down from 10/20/30%).

Developers’ Notes: Protection Paladin self-healing was buffed substantially near the end of beta, based on concerns that it was too weak, but those concerns have proved unfounded. We're bringing it back down to its intended level.

fk me?

Scrolling through latest news and not seeing these. Where were they posted? What date? Thanks - not doubting you; just wanting to read the entire post.

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You wouldn't spec out of it anyway.

Yeah was just looking at it and pretty much have to spec StS. Especially now that self-heals are weaker, we need every buff to them we can get. :P Just never fun when it's your turn getting nerf bat.

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Now that attack power is not displayed on our Battle.net page, can someone remind me how to calculate it? I googled but was finding formulas from 2006. Guessing those aren't current the way things change with Blizz.

Reason I'm asking, is with the nerf tonight I'm taking another look at Light of the Titans for more self-healing. If my strength increases my attack power by 23000 and mastery increases it by 16%, the HOT from LotT should be well over 100k each time we use it, right? Probably closer to 150k? That's only a 6% heal, but it's 6% of total health every time we use LotP/HotP. Would balance out some of what we lost today.

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Is anyone else looking at shifting talents and/or artifact points in response to latest nerfs? From DPS to survivability or vice-versa? Since both are being nerfed (from what I hear, still haven't found/read entire original post), I'm leaning towards focusing on survivability and letting the DPS focus on DPS. :\

[Gallahadd]

So the damage nerf has gone out right? It's just the LoTP/StS nerfs that are coming on wednesday?

[skynet1990]

So, is there a solid source for theorycrafting for Protection Paladin?

Versatility > Haste > Mastery seems like an awkward Stat Prio for Prot because escpecially in Raids there is hardly any Versatility Loot dropping which leaves me with the Question wouldn't it be more effective to Gem and Enchant rather Haste than Versatility?

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

So the damage nerf has gone out right? It's just the LoTP/StS nerfs that are coming on wednesday?

idk - I've been searching news threads and not finding it. All I know is what's been quoted here. Hoping someone will link at some point so I can read the original in full context.

Never fun to have your dps and survivability nerfed at the same time, but the game goes on and who knows? What they will buff/nerf next? Kind of like the weather: hard to predict, and pointless to complain about.

[Gallahadd]

Tbh, IF the damage nerfs have gone out... I honestly can't see the difference. Ran a couple of mythics last night and I was still putting out more than respectable damage, had no problem questing either.

[Deleted]

Tbh, IF the damage nerfs have gone out...

they didnt

[celinamuna]

So, is there a solid source for theorycrafting for Protection Paladin?

Versatility > Haste > Mastery seems like an awkward Stat Prio for Prot because escpecially in Raids there is hardly any Versatility Loot dropping which leaves me with the Question wouldn't it be more effective to Gem and Enchant rather Haste than Versatility?

Why would stat priority change, just because raids have little of that gear ?

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/7...-september-16/

Thanks.
/10 characters

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Even if we're going to keep positive attitudes in the face of double nerf this week, I think Blizz owes us a chance to respec our artifacts without paying penalty. It's not that I want to spec out of Scatter Shadows; it's that I want to spec even more for defense in light of having 40% less self-healing. The penalty should only apply when it was our mistake that required respec; not when Blizz makes major changes on us. I submitted this suggestion to Blizz; I encourage more to do the same.