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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by masterprtzl View Post
    Conflag does not proc off ignite, it procs off fireball.

    It does, actually.
    http://www.wowhead.com/spell=205023/conflagration

    Enemies affected by either Conflagration or Ignite have a 10% chance to flare up and deal (40% of Spell power) Fire damage to nearby enemies.

  2. #22
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by nickseng View Post
    Conflag doesn't. Flare up does.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by mascarpwn View Post
    Conflag doesn't. Flare up does.
    Right, thats what I meant, either way on topic, its not worth it to flamestrike

  4. #24
    Why Flamestrike at 3+ just to put ignite on them when you can just use Phoenix's Flames instead? It will hit three targets, and spread to basically all of them by the time Cinderstorm finishes casting.

  5. #25
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by whisperingsage View Post
    Why Flamestrike at 3+ just to put ignite on them when you can just use Phoenix's Flames instead? It will hit three targets, and spread to basically all of them by the time Cinderstorm finishes casting.
    Which is why you only FS on 8 or more targets.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by pkm View Post
    From my experience, in dungeons with short lived mobs, just flame strike 3+. Why?

    It immediately spreads ignite to all which means that conflag can start procing all over the place, and I can cinderstorm right away into the mobs without waiting ignite to spread. Couple this with living bomb and RoP, very few can beat the burst dps. Until raids and mythic+ comes out this works fine.
    Actually, phoenix flames puts ignites on everything, so you don't need to use your hot streak for that purpose. I pretty much always use PF as part of my opener on trash packs as it's the fastest way to get ignite rolling for conflag and CiS. Once you get the gold trait for phoenix flames, it's easy to always have a charge for trash packs.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by whisperingsage View Post
    Why Flamestrike at 3+ just to put ignite on them when you can just use Phoenix's Flames instead? It will hit three targets, and spread to basically all of them by the time Cinderstorm finishes casting.
    Because the ignite from proc flamestike is more than phonix ones

  8. #28
    Deleted
    dunno if this has been answered, but does anyone know if LB explosion damage is calculated on cast or when it explodes?

  9. #29
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by mascarpwn View Post
    Which is why you only FS on 8 or more targets.
    which is wrong, if the mages in the top 10 guilds in the world says its at 3+ targets through in game testing and their own sims/math then im inclined to agree, that doesnt mean that there isnt situations where its better to use FS at 8+ targets but its never ever only when there is 8+ targets.

  10. #30
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    which is wrong, if the mages in the top 10 guilds in the world says its at 3+ targets through in game testing and their own sims/math then im inclined to agree, that doesnt mean that there isnt situations where its better to use FS at 8+ targets but its never ever only when there is 8+ targets.
    Where did you get that information from? A link maybe? I'd love to see more opinions on this.

  11. #31
    Because the 8 target sim is just that, a sim where 8 target are alive infinitely, which never happens in an actual raid. Like I said earlier, your use of Flame strike will depend on how long the adds are alive for.

  12. #32
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Heretias View Post
    Where did you get that information from? A link maybe? I'd love to see more opinions on this.
    well i cant exactly link conversations ive had but you could say, make a character on a realm and ask them or ask them in streams, every1 ive asked has said its 3+ targets, ofc they can be wrong, just like rinoa's statement can be wrong but if they say its so then im inclined to relay that to ppl that believe otherwise ofc ppl are free to draw their own conclusions and follow the 8+ targets mantra.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by mokuton View Post
    dunno if this has been answered, but does anyone know if LB explosion damage is calculated on cast or when it explodes?
    When it explodes. Best way to burst trash imo is to put up LB and then drop a rune of power while it ticks on the one target so that the rune is active when it explodes.

  14. #34
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    I'm pretty certain the answer to this question comes down to how long the targets will live, and how many there are. I believe the spellpower% of pyro is 400% or something compared to FS 180%. So at 3 or more targets, flamestrikes instant hit will be more damage than pyro. Now, obviously pyro hits harder, spreads a stronger ignite. But it doesn't hit more than one target at once. Flamestrike is upfront instant moderate amount of damage on all targets, with a weak ignite.

    But then you have to figure out if the prolonged ticking of pyro ignite will outdamage FS aoe in the long run. That makes it even more complicated.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by whisperingsage View Post
    Why Flamestrike at 3+ just to put ignite on them when you can just use Phoenix's Flames instead? It will hit three targets, and spread to basically all of them by the time Cinderstorm finishes casting.
    The flame strike isn't just for the ignite. Though assuming you are running cinderstorm then yeah PF/fs whatever gets ignite all up at once.

    Also for people running kindling you will probably just wanna use pyroblast regardless to get kindling procs.

  16. #36
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    which is wrong, if the mages in the top 10 guilds in the world says its at 3+ targets through in game testing and their own sims/math then im inclined to agree, that doesnt mean that there isnt situations where its better to use FS at 8+ targets but its never ever only when there is 8+ targets.
    So, you tell me I'm wrong, based on anecdotal evidence?

    You know what, go ahead and FS on 3 mobs - let's see how well you fare.

  17. #37
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by mascarpwn View Post
    So, you tell me I'm wrong, based on anecdotal evidence?

    You know what, go ahead and FS on 3 mobs - let's see how well you fare.
    aye but i doubt all the top tier mages are wrong tho.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    aye but i doubt all the top tier mages are wrong tho.
    But here's the thing though, Rinoa's guides are based off of theorycrafters who have shown their proof. And it's available for all to inspect (simc).

    On the other hand, you claimed to have talked to the top tier mages. Who you've never mentioned by name, or shown any proof. And we don't even know if you've talked to one or two or ten of them.

    So you can understand why it's a bit hard to take your word.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    aye but i doubt all the top tier mages are wrong tho.
    They are all wrong if they use FS on 3 targets that survive for long time, without flamepatch talent.

    But I doubt they're wrong, I believe they don't use FS on 3 targets in these situations

  20. #40
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Wenoxar View Post
    They are all wrong if they use FS on 3 targets that survive for long time, without flamepatch talent.

    But I doubt they're wrong, I believe they don't use FS on 3 targets in these situations
    yeah, of that i can agree with you 100% what you use depends entirely on how long the mobs live, in dungeons and prolly most raid encounters as well, FS on 3+ is definately the way to go but on council fights where the bosses are close enough for the pyro ignites to get high and spread and similar situations like that then pyro is the way to go, but generally speaking FS is most likely the way to go.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by nickseng View Post
    But here's the thing though, Rinoa's guides are based off of theorycrafters who have shown their proof. And it's available for all to inspect (simc).

    On the other hand, you claimed to have talked to the top tier mages. Who you've never mentioned by name, or shown any proof. And we don't even know if you've talked to one or two or ten of them.

    So you can understand why it's a bit hard to take your word.
    well furty states the same as me in his guide as do ppl like xyronic and you can be sure that ppl like them atleast knows what they are doing and ppl in their respective guilds would have the same opinion as them and i dont know about you but im inclined to take the word of ppl in top 10 guilds in the world.

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