Should I raid with a guild that uses Loot Council?

[Deleted]

For any competitive guild = Loot Council
For any non-competitive guild = Personal Loot

Really nothing else to add. 90% of the time a loot council prefers gearing players they know they can trust and have proven themself in the past as opposed to players who joined the guild a week or 2 ago and are undergoing a trial period. I don't see the issue here whatsoever. To be fair I don't personally care too much about loot. They're a means to progress further into a raid, not to stroke my e-penis with.

[Lochton]

Been in some sort of raid with loot council since Molten Core.. It is one of the more stable methods, I think.

[Revik]

IMO you either enjoy raiding with a certain group or not. Loot and how they distribute that loot should not be an indicator or a means to satisfaction and enjoyment. If you fancy a certain group of people and you enjoy raiding with them that should be what matters no? If all you care about is loot and your bottom line all you are proving yourself to be is a mercenary with no loyalty to anyone but to the guild that will offer the best loot.

If I were an officer I would not recommend recruiting you.

That being said loot council is one of the quickest ways of distributing loot. Any guild that does a point system and you have to bid for gear is the most idiotic time consuming BS I've ever experienced. People say it is the most fair but maintaining the point system is just dumb and time consuming. If people are late just boot their asses. If people contribute more to the guild in the way of farming and making flasks etc. reward them with gear when it drops. It is so simple.

[Orangetai420]

We have used loot council for 8 years.
If you are worried about abuse and not getting gear then don't raid.

If some one said this shit to me before they tried to join my guild they would never be considered for a single piece.

I've seen a lot of shit posts but this one takes the cake.

You sir, are the reason the raiding community isn't worth the effort.

[Deleted]

Loot council, run well, is awesome and rewarding and fair. DKP is dogshit, even if it's run well, and almost always requires elements of loot council working alongside it anyway (else you end up with people taking two versions of the same trinket, Hunters taking melee weapons, etc.)

[Orangetai420]

Ahh -- The exact kind of reply that I would expect from a Loot Council fanboy.

I've been playing since Vanilla and have been MIA for parts of expansions starting with Cataclysm. I've raided with many guilds over the years, not a guild hopper just that guilds break off and disband, and out of the guilds that ran LC I've only seen it properly practiced in one guild. Even then there was a situation where a high rank got loot over someone who would have been next in line.

A straight point accumulation system works best over loot council any day.

Totally agree, 100%.

I would rather some sort of DKP or alternative point system over loot council any day.

As they say "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely" At the end of the day the council has their best interests in mind, no matter what they tell themselves.

[Choda]

Anything other than loot council is suboptimal for the health of the raid and guild as a whole. All other systems can be played and personal loot in organised raiding is just ridiculous.

IMO you either enjoy raiding with a certain group or not. Loot and how they distribute that loot should not be an indicator or a means to satisfaction and enjoyment. If you fancy a certain group of people and you enjoy raiding with them that should be what matters no? If all you care about is loot and your bottom line all you are proving yourself to be is a mercenary with no loyalty to anyone but to the guild that will offer the best loot.

If I were an officer I would not recommend recruiting you.

That being said loot council is one of the quickest ways of distributing loot. Any guild that does a point system and you have to bid for gear is the most idiotic time consuming BS I've ever experienced. People say it is the most fair but maintaining the point system is just dumb and time consuming. If people are late just boot their asses. If people contribute more to the guild in the way of farming and making flasks etc. reward them with gear when it drops. It is so simple.

This man soeaks the truth. At the end of the day if the loot distribution matters that much to you then you're not worth recruiting.

[bubbadubba]

-Loot council is preferred in higher end guilds, it gets the most out of ever piece of gear that drops. If it is a good guild they will run an addon that gives them extra information on who it will be the best upgrade for and a bunch of other variables which helps them decide what person would get the most use out of each item to progress. Ask if your guild is using an addon, if they are and it usually means you download that addon then chances are the loot council is properly done.

-Personal loot can screw people over, if it is a piece you don't want but it is higher ilvl then the piece you have then you cannot trade it. This can cause issues with progression. It is not ideal for a progression guild to use personal loot.

-A bad guild will allow a corrupt loot council, this will put the gear really one sided and they wont progress. I have seen it and those guilds never live that long. If you know that guild has been around a long time then chances are the loot council is fair.

-I could add in other variables on why loot council is better for progression guilds but it would be extremely long. DKP has more issue then the other two combined, I never want to go back to DKP and it makes it impossible to recruit around. You also don't get the best bang for your buck and most DKP systems are F'd up. Also DKP usually has some sort of loot council within it.

-The only reason personal loot is good is if your guild is short on people and you need to pug. This creates a way to make it more appealing for pugs to go with a guild group. The only time I would use personal in a raid is for that reason. Any progression guild I have been in has never had this issue, the only time we had someone not from our guild was when we sold a run for gold. Personal loot is a giant NO when selling a run.

So short form, if you are trying to progress mythic raiding then go Loot Council. If you are pugging or not so serious about what you kill then personal loot is usually better.

[Deleted]

For the vast majority the answer is simply no.

[Deleted]

But if not on council or friends with those on it, it can and does lead to people feeling they picked thier friend to get the loot. With how personal loot is now dropping more gear and being tradable it is clearly better except for a world first mythic team.

pl is only tradeable if its same or lower ilvl then what you already have for that slot, loot council is fine if the council itself isnt corrupt if the people in it know how much of gain a item is for people, they can give to person who willl have most benifit ofit so gaining largest gain overall in the raidteam which helps with progress.

[Polygons]

Only if the leaders seem unbiased otherwise I would not. From experience, I never really had any problems with it. The people in my guild who used it seemed to want to distribute loot to whoever is going to help them progress. Don't join if you can't handle getting passed up on loot. Do join if you don't really care when you get loot, you just want to raid and you trust your guild will help you get geared.

[RedNight at MMOC]

My guild is using Loot Council, and we tell everyone who raids each night that we are using Loot Council, who the officers are that will be handing out loot, the non-officer that will be in the discussion of passing out loot (this player is different each night), and what item or items will be prioritized for tanks and/or healers. We want to make sure everyone knows exactly what is going on and that no one feels like they are blind-sided.

[Deleted]

Pretty good example here of why you shouldn't raid with guilds that use loot councils... unless you're part of the council, or you're undergeared relative to the rest of the raid.

Pretty much, at least in some cases. Unless you are fine with being at the mercy of people with the occasional power complex.

[Deleted]

Personal loot = Fire Mage getting haste gear while warlock gets crit gear. Someone might get +5ilvl upgrade from personal loot while it would be 30ilvl up for another person. Those are reasons why you don't use personal loot. You play and progress as a guild.

[LordAmbrosia]

I used to be one of the people who helped distribute loot in a guild, and one thing you shouldn't be afraid of is talking with the distributors about what pieces you are looking to get. If you feel you aren't getting the gear you deserve then speak up, usually its more an issue of it being hard to keep track of 20+ people than it is malicious. Squeaky wheel gets the grease.

[grandgato]

I've only had one guild that practiced this, and it was handled poorly. Most guilds i have raided with have used some form of DKP.

[Targom]

Every loot system has potential for problems.

Personal loot won't put the gear where it needs to be, doesn't understand stat weights and priorities, and wouldn't let you trade an 845 to someone with an 830 if you have an 840.

DKP can lead to people hoarding points and not wanting to take upgrades because they are keyed in on one specific drop and they want to be sure they get that specific item at the cost of many others. Spending drops a lot when your guild starts a new difficulty, nobody wants to spend dkp on items from the prior tier when next week they can get better. It's better to put that gear on someone for a minor upgrade than to let it rot, but if you start giving out gear without dkp cost people will start trying to game that system.

Loot Council has obvious issues, though addons can help keep the system open and honest. Even if you aren't using EPGP or similar there are addons that will let people select Need/Greed/Offspec and then the whole raid can see who Needs the item and what item they have equipped in that slot. If the LC starts handing out gear incorrectly people will notice and will decide if they think they can get better loot elsewhere more fairly.

I've always felt that if the LC wants to skip me on gear that is fine, my performance will not change and the gear will drop again. If they overly stack their friends or people who don't perform well they are just hurting their chances of getting higher tier gear or clearing in one night. The few times I've been new to a guild I don't expect to see any loot for at least the first month, if I get something that is great and I get the chance to spend bonus rolls.

[Deleted]

Been using loot council for years, I understand why people are afraid of it but if you're in a respected guild the loot usually gets handled correctly. Works better for us since most of us are core raiders and for some bosses some classes should be given loot since it'll make the boss go down easier etc.

[Tyrgannus]

Loot council is worse 95% of the time but is quite literally the best possible system 5% of the time. It's a gamble of trustworthiness.

[Cheze]

if you're not gonna use loot council you should just use personal, since all the weird systems people implement end up creating bad incentives.

if you don't like/trust the people on the loot council you might have a problem... but if you don't trust/like the officers in a guild why are you raiding with them anyway?

- - - Updated - - -

Eh, lets be honest, players and guilds are both out to use one another. A guild will take a player that's viable and dump them the moment they're not, and a player should only work for a guild while it's helpful to them and leave it when it's not. One ought not be more loyal to the other than the other is to it.

Yes, I know: In before all the posts from people saying, "Not MY guild!" Yes, your guild.

lol @ this post

there are many people who (gasp) play in the guild they're in because they enjoy the experience of playing with the other people who're in their raid. If you look at your guild exclusively as a means of getting gear for yourself, don't be surprised if they drop you like a bad habit.