Is it too easy to get gear at the moment?

[Deleted]

It is true.
Whereas in every other expansion you could not reach normal mode gear before the raid opens, now you can.
The itemization of the raid items is pretty awkward, the best trinkets and gear do drop in mythic+ dungeons, getting a proc from 865 to 880 is by no means an issue and that is mythic standard gear level. But instead of having 1 weekly reset for mythic+ you can run them all over as long as you have keystones. (which is no problem for people like me who got several alts 840+ extra for keystones)
So even AFTER raid release we will run into this situation.
Tomorrow we as a guild will run into normal mode EN with 25+ players with ilvl 848+, many even 850, few with legendaries even 850+.
I expect to clear it in about 2-3h.
Heroic wont be any problem too, so there goes that.
Its not even worth doing splitraids, at least thats how I feel because the better gear is waiting in dungeons. (and btw mythic+10 is a guaranteed 880+ in a box per week, too)
so we are planning on clearing nhc/hc and then spamming the living hell out of dungeons.

Lets look back at HM progress in WoD:
We got into the Raid with ~20 players with ilvl between 840 to 850 depending on how lucky you were with WF drops, and how many gold you spent on random epics. But only a few hardcore rich people got to ilvl 655 before HM, and even then, the gear was not even optimized properly, because you were limited to world drops (665 items).
so we did need a lot of items in HM nhc.

There is definitely a difference. People are reaching softcaps preraid due to crafted gear, people have with a "normal" amount of dedication at least 845+ preraid.
The difference is too small, the gear we get too good.
And dont you forget the legendaries!

I agree with the op on this.

[Jewsco]

The big difference is (you really should try reading replies in the thread as opposed to just the OP) is that in wod 630 was 25 ilevels below normal highmaul gear, in legion we are now geared equal to normal emerald dream. I hope you understand how that might be a problem for:
a. people who raid normal mode, they have very little gear incentive to clear the place
b. people who raid heroic because if they are skilled enough they can just breeze through it, because instances are usually quite easy if you are almost fully geared in the previous tier of instance

- - - Updated - - -



Pretty clearly a badly disguised shitpost

You raid just for gear? That in and of it self is pretty sad.
But I'll play along last I checked raid tier pieces are way better than the 840 or 850 gear had now. So there is your gear to raid for if that is why you raid, enjoy.

- - - Updated - - -

It is true.
Whereas in every other expansion you could not reach normal mode gear before the raid opens, now you can.
The itemization of the raid items is pretty awkward, the best trinkets and gear do drop in mythic+ dungeons, getting a proc from 865 to 880 is by no means an issue and that is mythic standard gear level. But instead of having 1 weekly reset for mythic+ you can run them all over as long as you have keystones. (which is no problem for people like me who got several alts 840+ extra for keystones)
So even AFTER raid release we will run into this situation.
Tomorrow we as a guild will run into normal mode EN with 25+ players with ilvl 848+, many even 850, few with legendaries even 850+.
I expect to clear it in about 2-3h.
Heroic wont be any problem too, so there goes that.
Its not even worth doing splitraids, at least thats how I feel because the better gear is waiting in dungeons. (and btw mythic+10 is a guaranteed 880+ in a box per week, too)
so we are planning on clearing nhc/hc and then spamming the living hell out of dungeons.

Lets look back at HM progress in WoD:
We got into the Raid with ~20 players with ilvl between 840 to 850 depending on how lucky you were with WF drops, and how many gold you spent on random epics. But only a few hardcore rich people got to ilvl 655 before HM, and even then, the gear was not even optimized properly, because you were limited to world drops (665 items).
so we did need a lot of items in HM nhc.

There is definitely a difference. People are reaching softcaps preraid due to crafted gear, people have with a "normal" amount of dedication at least 845+ preraid.
The difference is too small, the gear we get too good.
And dont you forget the legendaries!

I agree with the op on this.

And you will clear all this even on heroic first time thru? Ok.
And even if you do you and your raid team is way above the exception to the rule.
Do you even know the number of people that even raid normal let alone heroic.
But yeah clear that raid in heroic first week I am sure you will because everyone always does.

[Molis]

The whole point of your thread is one reason Legion is better. It is not raid or die for the 95% of people that do not step foot in Normal Mode.
Raids will still provide the best gear, however now everyone else has access to better gear.

Your post also reflects one other great thing about Legion. Non raiders have tons of options now.

[Deleted]

As respectfully as possible: You really don't understand the demographics of the game. The 'vast majority' of players aren't dedicating nearly as much time as you think.

With all due respect, you have access to the same statistics about this as I do: none, so all we have is our subjective opinions to go by.

Having said that, this obviously doesn't apply to people who arn't interested in getting high item level/gearing up. No matter how small/big the people who actually care about gearing up is, this thread is about those people having too easy of a time doing so.

If you arn't interested in raiding/getting geared that's a completely fine playstyle to have, but those are the people that arn't gated by mythic lockouts, they are gated by their willingness to play the game, because of this that population really is irrelevant to this topic.

[manypillars]

(you really should try reading replies in the thread as opposed to just the OP)

I read enough replies to see other people point out all it was was you clutching pearls over ilvls and gear fapping.

Clearing EN is a requirement of Loremaster. You know, that achievement for casual players who do world content and generally not seen as worthy of raiding. If nothing else the people you think need to be pushed to clear normal will clear the raid one way or another if they want to eventually fly. The people skilled enough to breeze through heroic with 850 likely see heroic as a speed bump on the way to mythic.

[Deleted]

You raid just for gear? That in and of it self is pretty sad.
But I'll play along last I checked raid tier pieces are way better than the 840 or 850 gear had now. So there is your gear to raid for if that is why you raid, enjoy.

Euh, where did I say that (I didn't say that, you just made that up) I just said that people (who arn't me, I don't raid progress in normal) have less incentive to do so because they are already fully geared from that place.

Secondly, can you somehow back up the statement that normal mode 850 pieces are somehow better than mythic warforged 850 pieces? because afaik this isn't the case also tier pieces arn't released with emerald nightmare so that in itself is just bullshit

And you will clear all this even on heroic first time thru? Ok.
And even if you do you and your raid team is way above the exception to the rule.
Do you even know the number of people that even raid normal let alone heroic.
But yeah clear that raid in heroic first week I am sure you will because everyone always does.

Euh yes, any top 2000+ guild is probably expecting to clear heroic within the first week

- - - Updated - - -

The whole point of your thread is one reason Legion is better. It is not raid or die for the 95% of people that do not step foot in Normal Mode.
Raids will still provide the best gear, however now everyone else has access to better gear.

Your post also reflects one other great thing about Legion. Non raiders have tons of options now.

Yep I agree with you that non-raiders have good options now, it just feels like their options are a little too good.

- - - Updated - - -

I read enough replies to see other people point out all it was was you clutching pearls over ilvls and gear fapping.

Clearing EN is a requirement of Loremaster. You know, that achievement for casual players who do world content and generally not seen as worthy of raiding. If nothing else the people you think need to be pushed to clear normal will clear the raid one way or another if they want to eventually fly. The people skilled enough to breeze through heroic with 850 likely see heroic as a speed bump on the way to mythic.

I could personally care less about gear, for me gear is just a means to an end to see progress, if the guild gives me no gear because it is the best solution for progress I am completely happy with that, so no, idc about gear or ilevels.

I know that it is a part of loremaster, though as far as I am aware that can be done through LFR as well? Don't really see how this is related.

[Leodok]

The title pretty much says it all, I personally feel like it is too easy to get geared atm.

There are so many different ways of gearing it is a miracle if you arn't ~850 geared yet.
-World quests give items up to i840 with the chance of it being warforged up to 850, this maximum will probably go up on wednesday
-Heroics give items at 825 with a proc chance upwards of item level 850
-Mythics give items at 840 with a proc chance upwards of item level 850
-Pvp world quests give items that are 840 but can go up to 850
-Professions give you a BiS 850 item for ~30-50k, depending on item prices and oblitherum prices.

Personally, I have an 850 ilevel shaman (been unlucky with legendary) and an 844 ilevel monk.
That monk hit level 100 8 days ago.
I cleared every single mythic on that monk the day after he hit level 110, after buying myself to 805 item level.
In the start it was a bit of a hassle but as long as tanks listened to when I asked them for a mana break we could do it no problem.

In previous expansions the heroic instances were pretty easy by the time you had the equivalent of full normal gear, which is 850.
Because of this I expect most raiders worth their salt to put a pretty decent dent in heroic Emerald Nightmare, personally I am part of a top 1k mythic guild who plans on clearing heroic heroic twice in the first week.
Because of this and the relative easy that the first ~5 or so mythic level will be, a lot of people will be hitting ~860 ilevel by the time mythics start the week after.

In previous expansions you could powerclear heroic dungeons but you would still be pretty far away from having full normal gear whereas now almost everyone who takes this game remotely serious should be at least 845+.

Besides that, item level is a far worse proxy for skill than it was in previous expansions, especially for healers and tanks which are so high in demand that even the pretty bad ones are able to get full mythic gear simply because they can keep trying to find groups to carry them untill they are succesfull.

Earlier today I tried pugging mythic HoV on my alt and first had a tank that wiped us 3 times on heimdall because he couldnt dodge lightning, after which I kicked him (he was 838). The tank I got afterwards was 840 but didnt understand that you had to move the boss on the second encounter but I somehow managed to keep us alive in spite of the boss having~25 or so stacks of one buff and ~10 of the other.

So what do you guys think? is gear too easy to get?

I suppose it is too easy depending on you playstyle.
I've got 615 ilvl or something like that, because I prefer to do things a bit slowly to better enjoy the content. I also do story stuff over gearing stuff (Suramar is much higher in my priority list than world quests or dungeons).

And then there are the people who are still not 110.

I think gearing could be a bit slower, though. It's certainly way faster than it was in WoD.

[unfilteredJW]

I thought it was till I talked to some other folks in the guild.

I am apparently an outlier.

[Pony Soldier]

I actually enjoy it. Gives me something to work on and I constantly feel like I'm progressing my character instead of feeling like I hit a wall that I can't pass. I hope they continue with this system. Raids aren't out yet either so I would imagine all this 840/850 gear will quickly become obsolete anyway. So people should enjoy feeling superior while it lasts.

[Deleted]

I actually enjoy it. Gives me something to work on and I constantly feel like I'm progressing my character instead of feeling like I hit a wall that I can't pass. I hope they continue with this system. Raids aren't out yet either so I would imagine all this 840/850 gear will quickly become obsolete anyway. So people should enjoy feeling superior while it lasts.

yea thats true, it does give you something cool to do a lot of the time

[Jewsco]

Euh, where did I say that (I didn't say that, you just made that up) I just said that people (who arn't me, I don't raid progress in normal) have less incentive to do so because they are already fully geared from that place.

Secondly, can you somehow back up the statement that normal mode 850 pieces are somehow better than mythic warforged 850 pieces? because afaik this isn't the case also tier pieces arn't released with emerald nightmare so that in itself is just bullshit



Euh yes, any top 2000+ guild is probably expecting to clear heroic within the first week

- - - Updated - - -



Yep I agree with you that non-raiders have good options now, it just feels like their options are a little too good.

- - - Updated - - -



I could personally care less about gear, for me gear is just a means to an end to see progress, if the guild gives me no gear because it is the best solution for progress I am completely happy with that, so no, idc about gear or ilevels.

I know that it is a part of loremaster, though as far as I am aware that can be done through LFR as well? Don't really see how this is related.

So you don't care about gear but complain that there is no gear for you? Which is it?
One week to clear it on heroic I will wait to see when you do because I don't believe it at all

[Deleted]

So you don't care about gear but complain that there is no gear for you? Which is it?
One week to clear it on heroic I will wait to see when you do because I don't believe it at all

I am a mythic raider, I could care less about normal loot

[Queen of Hamsters]

Best gear for its time, worst gear not far from now.

And no, I don't think it's "too easy". Wtf?

[Jewsco]

I am a mythic raider, I could care less about normal loot

Then why are you complaining it is to easy to get gear then?
Which is it?
Too easy to get gear or dirty casuals can get gear?
Think it is the later right?
And this gear will be meaningless soon due to raids anyway.

[Deleted]

850 item level is NOT high, it's obviously a good number to go into Normal/Heroics on but it's not in any way, shape or form a high number to have. Over the next week the majority of players who step into normal EN will be sitting on 855'ish if they down at least 4-5 bosses. After another week of players getting into Heroics etc you will see ilvls of 860 much more commonly, the pattern will continue.

I'm 850 in my Rogue and I missed last weeks reset and half of the other one, with no Legendary. Wonder if I should make a big longwinded post to show this off? :/

- - - Updated - - -

I am a mythic raider, I could care less about normal loot

You should care about normal loot going into your first Mythic run. They're potentially better than your Mythic 5 man loot and some of the trinkets are itemized WAY better than the Mythic 5 man ones. So ya, you should really care this week to get those normal drops. Even the tiniest upgrades will help your Mythic progression.

[dakalro]

It's actually harder to get best pre-raid gear than previous expansions. Mythic lockouts ensure that.
In previous exps it took 1-2 days to get to BiS ilvl and mostly BiS items from spamming random heroics.

It is easier though to grow in power relative to the world mobs, to get to the point where you don't really care that you trained half a camp with you when you dismount.

[Sansnom]

The title pretty much says it all, I personally feel like it is too easy to get geared atm.

There are so many different ways of gearing it is a miracle if you arn't ~850 geared yet.
-World quests give items up to i840 with the chance of it being warforged up to 850, this maximum will probably go up on wednesday
-Heroics give items at 825 with a proc chance upwards of item level 850
-Mythics give items at 840 with a proc chance upwards of item level 850
-Pvp world quests give items that are 840 but can go up to 850
-Professions give you a BiS 850 item for ~30-50k, depending on item prices and oblitherum prices.

Being able to acquire them does not it is easy to get them. WQ can give you item that high but it purely based on luck and I doubt that the necessary roll will be high. So while it is possible to get those, what are the chances that you can get them?

Not every player can spend 50k just to gear upto 850 for raiding and then have those gear replaced by raid gear.

Personally, I have an 850 ilevel shaman (been unlucky with legendary) and an 844 ilevel monk.
That monk hit level 100 8 days ago.
I cleared every single mythic on that monk the day after he hit level 110, after buying myself to 805 item level.
In the start it was a bit of a hassle but as long as tanks listened to when I asked them for a mana break we could do it no problem.

So what do you guys think? is gear too easy to get?

8 days is meaningless. What is more important is the hours. I doubt you spend 8days nonstop, no sleep, toilet break, food etc. So why not list how many hours instead? 8days with 15hrs+ per day? Yeah, I can expect people to be geared in that time. Less even.

So no, I do not think it is any easier to get gear. There are more options since it means no more dungeons spam early on.

[Deleted]

Then why are you complaining it is to easy to get gear then?
Which is it?
Too easy to get gear or dirty casuals can get gear?
Think it is the later right?
And this gear will be meaningless soon due to raids anyway.

Just because an issue doesnt affect me personally, it can still be an issue, I don't understand the false dichotomy you are trying to create tbh.
Also if casuals want gear, they should be free to get it.

All I am saying is that this completely nullifies any normal-mode progression, being 2 days into the content now it looks like im proven completely right, normal mode is an absolute joke and you can just faceroll through it and outheal most mechanics

[Jewsco]

Just because an issue doesnt affect me personally, it can still be an issue, I don't understand the false dichotomy you are trying to create tbh.
Also if casuals want gear, they should be free to get it.

All I am saying is that this completely nullifies any normal-mode progression, being 2 days into the content now it looks like im proven completely right, normal mode is an absolute joke and you can just faceroll through it and outheal most mechanics

Again did you play last epansion? Normal is basically the old flex and was easy. But not easy for all but easy for heroic or mythic teams as it should be. You do know you can do heroic or mythic if normal that easy right? You do know normal isn't the only difficulty right? So why are you whining again?

[Every Pwny]

My first week running every mythic (minus the rep ones) I ended up getting 3 pieces of gear, two of which were gloves. You got pretty lucky to get a lot of gear from mythic runs going from 805 to 844