7.1 spoilers "An Elven Problem"

[Aucald]

Yeah, I know. But my Point is, they would never need a Guardian and stuff if the Elves had teached them proberly right from the beginning and if they had showed them the methods to hide their magic, like they used for themselves- And asking the humans to give up magic completely is absolute hyprocritical, considering that the Elves destroyed half of the world and didn't wanted to stop with their magic.

There's no way to "teach them properly," the usage of Arcane magic always carries the risk of alerting the Burning Legion. There are a variety of ways to mitigate this risk - the Council of Tirisfal and the Guardian were the Human solution whereas the Runestones were the High Elvish one. The Runestones may not have been something that the High Elves could simply replicate for the Human Magi.

[Enthralled]

You can't deny, Humans acted by far more responsible than the High Elves when they met the burning Legion the first time.

What? This doesn't even make sense. The High Elves lived in a kingdom that was sealed off from detection from the Burning Legion. How more responsible could they have gotten? And they had to swoop in a save the situation when they heard about what was going on with the reckless casting by human mages in Dalaran.

All I can do is assume you meant to type "Highborne" there.

[steelballfc]

What? This doesn't even make sense. The High Elves lived in a kingdom that was sealed off from detection from the Burning Legion. How more responsible could they have gotten? And they had to swoop in a save the situation when they heard about what was going on with the reckless casting by human mages in Dalaran.

All I can do is assume you meant to type "Highborne" there.

you seems to have forgotten that the Humans are the Superb race

[Deleted]

Yeah, I know. But my Point is, they would never need a Guardian and stuff if the Elves had teached them proberly right from the beginning and if they had showed them the methods to hide their magic, like they used for themselves- And asking the humans to give up magic completely is absolute hyprocritical, considering that the Elves destroyed half of the world and didn't wanted to stop with their magic.

The problem was that the humans were more intuitive and imaginative with magic then the high elves. The giant pillar of fire death was something the quel'dorei never imagined it was possible.

It's hard to teach about something that you don't even it's possible in the first place.

[Aucald]

The problem was that the humans were more intuitive and imaginative with magic then the high elves. The giant pillar of fire death was something the quel'dorei never imagined it was possible.

It's hard to teach about something that you don't even it's possible in the first place.

The Elves always seem to measure Arcane might on a purely personal basis - spells known, feats managed, or the basic power of one's workings. It took the Humans to pool their powers in a choral type of effort - probably underlining the major difference between how the two races think.

[Combatbutler]

The Elves always seem to measure Arcane might on a purely personal basis - spells known, feats managed, or the basic power of one's workings. It took the Humans to pool their powers in a choral type of effort - probably underlining the major difference between how the two races think.

The elves did work together in the past but not on this scale usually a dozen or so cooperating, not a hundred channeling a single spell, the chances that this could backfire are enormous if even one of them screws up.

[Deleted]

The Elves always seem to measure Arcane might on a purely personal basis - spells known, feats managed, or the basic power of one's workings. It took the Humans to pool their powers in a choral type of effort - probably underlining the major difference between how the two races think.

It's the underline arrogance behind every single elf.

[Rhlor]

was a human sorcerer who brought the legion to azetroth in the third war.

[Deleted]

was a human sorcerer who brought the legion to azetroth in the third war.

An outcast from Dalaran that basically wrote the book of undead and nihilism (he never cared about the Legion).

[Deleted]

There's no way to "teach them properly," the usage of Arcane magic always carries the risk of alerting the Burning Legion. There are a variety of ways to mitigate this risk - the Council of Tirisfal and the Guardian were the Human solution whereas the Runestones were the High Elvish one. The Runestones may not have been something that the High Elves could simply replicate for the Human Magi.

Or we can just destroy the Burning Legion

[Rhlor]

An outcast from Dalaran that basically wrote the book of undead and nihilism (he never cared about the Legion).

the leader of a cult that infiltrated in all lordaeron

[Aucald]

Or we can just destroy the Burning Legion

That would do it, yes. But I don't that particular mitigation strategy was in the power of either the High Elves or the Kingdom of Arathor. Though recent information has begun to make me doubt the "all powerful" part we often think of Sargeras.

[goblingirl]

Elf gasm yay!

I never understood why they ignored elves for so many years - oldest highly organized culture on Azeroth, so damn much history they could delve into. All my toons are elves except my paladin, and if my paladin could be a night elf, she would be.

Finally story that isn't about the orcs. We waited 12 years!

[ravenmoon]

Elf gasm yay!

I never understood why they ignored elves for so many years - oldest highly organized culture on Azeroth, so damn much history they could delve into. All my toons are elves except my paladin, and if my paladin could be a night elf, she would be.

Finally story that isn't about the orcs. We waited 12 years!

and extremely popular, you're not the only ones, a bunch of us wondered - why the in absentia in Night elf lore? why do so little with one of the most popular wow groups. Ofc, many concluded it was to build horde lore, and being in the alliance, well, you couldn't have two big shots and do the horde well, so humans just dominated Alliance narrative while they built up the horde, what this meant was that night elves got nothing except neutral stuff very nearl all of which was druidic - any more would have needed an expansion focus if you wanted to do it justice, and that didn't happen till now... and ofc, when you focus on night elves you're going to touch ALL elves - whereas the opposite isn't necessarily treu for high/blood elves, as they were already established in game with the humans and orcs before their origin story, the Nelves came along. So blizzard could sustain BElf/HElf lore without dealing with NElves, and they did, NElf/BElf interaction has been few and far between, a few humiliations of NElves by BElves, and the odd exachange,

However when dealing with NElf lore,e specially if you're going back to the War of the Ancients, you're going to affect all elves.

[Deleted]

What? This doesn't even make sense. The High Elves lived in a kingdom that was sealed off from detection from the Burning Legion. How more responsible could they have gotten? And they had to swoop in a save the situation when they heard about what was going on with the reckless casting by human mages in Dalaran.

All I can do is assume you meant to type "Highborne" there.

Because look at the first contact with the Legion:

Humans: "Hey, High Elves, could you help us? There are this nasty creatures that start so spreat after we used a little too much magic. And yeah, they seem to be pretty evil and we don't like it, so how can we handle this situation best? Because really, they try to lead us into some sinister deals all the time and it's really annoying."
Elves: "All hail Sargeras, our new God!"

[Rhlor]

Because look at the first contact with the Legion:

Humans: "Hey, High Elves, could you help us? There are this nasty creatures that start so spreat after we used a little too much magic. And yeah, they seem to be pretty evil and we don't like it, so how can we handle this situation best? Because really, they try to lead us into some sinister deals all the time and it's really annoying."
Elves: "All hail Sargeras, our new God!"

I remember it was a human who brought the horde and was possessed by sargeras

I also remember that first council trisfal was full of high elves and the first guardian was a half elf

Ethylar, Aertin Brighthand, Rohar

[Combatbutler]

Because look at the first contact with the Legion:

Humans: "Hey, High Elves, could you help us? There are this nasty creatures that start so spreat after we used a little too much magic. And yeah, they seem to be pretty evil and we don't like it, so how can we handle this situation best? Because really, they try to lead us into some sinister deals all the time and it's really annoying."
Elves: "All hail Sargeras, our new God!"

They were entirely differently contacted, Sargeras contacted them himself, and lured them with promises of power, just like he did with the eredar. The legion didn't bother to offer anything similar to the humans.

[Zulkhan]

I apologize for the slight off-topic I'm going to cause but this will not take long.

I am. I simply want an example. Such as " Grom's strength was immense" or "Grom's strength was cut in half after the battle" in which the word "strength" is referring to someone's army.

I'm just providing to this guy the example he wanted:

Vol’jin could not help smiling as day surrendered to dusk and long shadows pointed toward dawn. Toward the Zandalari. His group’s traps and attacks had not killed nearly as many of Khal’ak’s forces as he desired, but she had been moved to acts of desperation because of them. She’d flung two companies wide, diluting her strength, and bulled on through a number of attacks. By the time they reached the monastery, they’d be angry, frustrated, and weary—three things no general likes in his soldiers.

Shadows of the Horde, pg. 144

It's an expression used in multiple contexts so is no goddamn surprise to find examples of this in Warcraft as well.

Now, given what you just read, read your beloved quote again and tell me if its wording is in any way different from what I just quoted.

Honestly, since the obvious answer is "no", I think we could just move on and let this thread stay on topic.

[Mehrunes]

I'll refresh your memory if you forgot:

I went through that thread a bit and damn, what an adventure. Especially post #113. So spot on.

[Koryn123]

You can't deny, Humans acted by far more responsible than the High Elves when they met the burning Legion the first time.

After the elves brought demons, they put up runestones around Quel'thalas that prevented their magic from being detected by the Legion, and so the Legion never realized Azeroth was still around.

After the humans brought demons, they made a bandaid solution with the Guardian, trusting in their own prideful arrogance that they could handle whatever demons came along.


The elves basically put a sign by a cliff edge that says "Don't go near the cliff edge, you'll fall."

The humans parked an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff, saying "Oh, it's okay, this way, if people fall and get seriously injured, they'll get medical attention right away and be fine!"


The humans' solution was not at all a preventative measure. The Elves' was. The high elves fixed their leaky pipes, while the Kirin Tor just put a tiny bucket underneath to catch the water drips, not big enough to hold the drips for long.


And Aegwynn was arrogant enough to think she defeated Sargeras, and told the Council of Tirisfal to go to hell rather than give up her powers for the next Guardian, resulting in Medivh causing all sorts of catastrophic events.


At some point, the humans must be held accountable for their flagrant abuse of magic with no mind for the repercussions of their actions.

The Elves didn't take such extreme measures to control the humans, because Strom was already keeping them on a tight leash. They couldn't have known that the humans would go out on their own to do all the magic they pleased. Basically, they trusted the humans to exercise some form of caution and adhere to their own laws. Instead, the humans left and made up new laws that let them do whatever they wanted.