Outlaw Rogues - thoughts after first raid night?

[Faildevil]

The DPS is good. Not OP, but very good. But...you can perform good in your raid, but in comparsion to the top logs you seem like sh### because you had to reroll 10 times over the course of a boss fight, while the top few hundret have 2+ buffs on average the whole fight.

While Sub...the spec I spend around 150k AP into, I was 7th on skada for the nightmare drakes but had 93% on warcraftlogs.

[Haaizor]

It was fine, managed to stay well above 210k on single target fights with shit rng.

[Deleted]

After doing a full clear of both normal and heroic, I think outlaw is slightly ahead of where it should be. At the moment, outlaw can shine in every scenario, which isnt necessarily a bad thing, but I believe that each spec should have its own strength's and weaknesses. The RNG gods were definitely in my favor the last couple days, as I had a few ideal scenario's where I rolled a 6. I could see Run Through getting about a 10% nerf, which would be outlaw more close to assassination. With that being said our shadow priests are whooping ass and it's very hard to compete with them even when getting very opportune rolls.

They're just above middle of the pack in the charts, and you want them nerfed? Mmkay dude.

[Geckoo]

In my opinion the biggest issue with RtB right now is how our performance is more related to getting good rolls than it is to actual player skill. The DPS variation between good luck and bad luck is still too big, nothing new that we didn't know from beta, but i hope that with more players this issue becomes more visible.

[Xetenor]

I definitely picked up some things that others mentioned. Just my thoughts.

Acrobatic strikes is very very good since sprint is only a 1 min CD. Very good for many bosses and adds cleaving. Basically a must. I shouldn't have specced into grapling hook which costed me a lot on dps when I couldn't reach boss or adds and also grappling hook is extremely buggy in raids. You can't even use it in almost all the terrain.

Ghostly strike I probably would only use this if I know its just one target I will be dpsing which is rare sorta but I would think I would be energy starved. Quick draw works great for now and will stick to it.

RTB - Definitely avoid rolling often. I should've used MOD before pull to get long buff instead of building up. If you get shark stick to it; it's basically the best if you cannot get 2 or more buffs that preferably includes shark. I made the mistake rolling too often. Also I think it's probably not the best to save up 6 CP to roll, rather maybe do 3-4. I did get A LOT of 1 buffs, probably out of 20 rolls in a fight I probably got 10-15 rolls of 1 buffs using 5-6 CP. It really got me very frustrated at times.

Stats - I am definitely gearing up more for haste instead of mastery. Mastery is just crap. Also every gear doesn't need vers always. I found myself energy starved more than I would like to so now having more haste for tomorrows raid should help we will see. It's pretty sad how you have to wear lower IL gear for better stats but I guess for now that will do until more raids open up and we get geared more.

Surviving - I think iron stomach may not be as good as I thought though since our healers aren't really doing that great and I rather not rely on them too often, I tend to self heal during times when dmg is coming but I definitely need to try cheat death since it's costing me too much dps in the long run. I think cheat death would be really good option and better overall. Still not sure, there is just so much raid damage happening that self surviving is so important...more important than doing more dps at times.

That's about it.

[Deleted]

It was fine, managed to stay well above 210k on single target fights with shit rng.

Yup, if you play correctly even with the worst RNG you can stay above 200k pretty easily on most fights.

[Xetenor]

So do you guys just not even bother rerolling if you get one rogers buff? I know you want 2 or more buffs but makes me wonder.

[Deleted]

i was sure about that assa could pull ahead of outlaw ( any sim sect believer here in this forum flamed me hard ) , but didnt mind assa will pull so hard ahead.
day one meters for proof:

http://i.imgur.com/Cwny6uZ.png

Still like outlaw more, more fun and easy rotation.

[Minka]

i was sure about that assa could pull ahead of outlaw ( any sim sect believer here in this forum flamed me hard ) , but didnt mind assa will pull so hard ahead.
day one meters for proof:

http://i.imgur.com/Cwny6uZ.png

Still like outlaw more, more fun and easy rotation.

If I see this misleading chart anohter time I will punch the next assa rogue on the street I see.

this is average for all logs. FOTM is outlaw so we have 6846546546x more outlaw rogues this means 6546854698546 more bad rogues playing this spec.

If you want to see the real proof look for top 10 on every boss rogue specs you see outlaw dominating

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/10#class=Rogue

[Deefame]

That's not proving anything tho because Outlaw top dps is heavily inflated by good rolls. Neither is the 75th percentile chart purely because Outlaw had 10x more parses. At this moment it's impossible to prove anything. Testing both myself I'd still say Outlaw is better.

[Deleted]

If I see this misleading chart anohter time I will punch the next assa rogue on the street I see.

this is average for all logs. FOTM is outlaw so we have 6846546546x more outlaw rogues this means 6546854698546 more bad rogues playing this spec.

If you want to see the real proof look for top 10 on every boss rogue specs you see outlaw dominating

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/10#class=Rogue

here the correct chart. You just have to put the percentile to top1% of the players https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10/#dataset=99

[Deleted]

What is the best opener atm in raids? MFD then RTB? or ambush saberslash RTB?

i find Ambush > Saberslash > Pistol shot > RtB to be good for a quick 6 CP RtB roll, if i roll something bad i usually use MfD for another 6 CP roll

[Vorkreist]

something tells me you haven't mastered the spec at all. It requires quite a bit of discipline.

Cool story

[TnTizz]

i find Ambush > Saberslash > Pistol shot > RtB to be good for a quick 6 CP RtB roll, if i roll something bad i usually use MfD for another 6 CP roll

Now is this optimal or the difference of the start of rotation don't matter?

[SkyGlow]

Cleared normal last night. (Guild didn't play beta). My thoughts on raiding as outlaw are:
Damage seems fine. Grappling hook is a godsend for mobility in most encounters. Feint/Cloak is still super strong. RNG is infuriating. It felt like every good rolls I had my mates failed and we wiped. If I had tons of terrible rolls in a row they got their shit together.
Can't say I enjoy Outlaw. :/

[Twix]

Outlaw dps is good.. but I hate the RNG involved

[Deleted]

The RNG is "okay"

but the times where you roll 1 buff 6-8 times in a row hoping for a good roll for CD's or BL is just infuriating.

I tend to keep shark og True Bearing when if they're the only buff i'm rolling, just to deal dmg or get my CD's back up

[Deleted]

It is unfortunate that outlaws scale very poorly and soon subtlety will overtake it in damage as we gear up.

14 posts of wrong.

Gj bro

I'm honstly thinking of switching away from GS aswell. Its really annoying for some of the bosses and the damage increase isnt really that big for Ursoc and Nythendra anyway

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The RNG is "okay"

but the times where you roll 1 buff 6-8 times in a row hoping for a good roll for CD's or BL is just infuriating.

I tend to keep shark og True Bearing when if they're the only buff i'm rolling, just to deal dmg or get my CD's back up

The only time is keep 1-rolls is if i get a shark for burst phases.

I'. not sure its technically the best thing to do, but fuck no am i going to do 1 run through per 20 seconds because the only buff i have is true bearing

[Airblade]

14 posts of wrong.

Gj bro

I'm honstly thinking of switching away from GS aswell. Its really annoying for some of the bosses and the damage increase isnt really that big for Ursoc and Nythendra anyway

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The only time is keep 1-rolls is if i get a shark for burst phases.

I'. not sure its technically the best thing to do, but fuck no am i going to do 1 run through per 20 seconds because the only buff i have is true bearing

I'm with you on that. Ghostly Strike just doesn't seem to be a big enough DPS boost to warrant the energy spent on trying to keep it applied. Overall I was able to keep up with the top 10 DPS (we have a lot of feral druids, arms wars, a ret pally with BiS legendary, and 2 DH's).

Grappling Hook seems like it works for some fights and for others Acrobatic Strikes will be better. My personal usage will be:

Neth - Acrobatic (especially for Heroic during Heart of the Swarm Phase)

Ursoc - Grappling Hook to quickly get into position for the charge

Ill - Either one works. Acrobatic makes cleaving things that are close together much easier but grappling hook gives you mobility to get to them / get out of the eye room

Ren- Either one again. Acrobatic makes dancing around venom / tornado easier but grappling hook, in theory, will let you get from platform to platform quicker / out of bad stuff easier.

Dragons - I'd say Acrobatic but it might changed based on the dragon makeup for the fight.

Cenarius - I'm thinking Grappling hook (this is where we stopped last night). Lots of stuff to quickly get to and get out of.

[Deleted]

What type of fight in simc is best to use?

Patchwerk is standard - I do some HelterSkelter Sims, though they are generally less applicable. The most important thing about the Sims are statweights - Versatility remains high, though not always top - Haste tends to sim higher for me on ST right now (Using Alacrity) and Crit sims as my best stat on cleave/aoe