DPS Rankings after Day 1 of Emerald Nightmare

[Deleted]

As a hunter it seems really hard getting any invites to any content right now... As MM i liked my raid damage. BM is pretty good in other content. I have ran into no issues completing any mythic or anything. Just seems baffling that people are so toxic in this game.

[Ilir]

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/10

FF14's raid DPS chart.

Why exactly can square enix do this, but Blizzard can't come anywhere close to this?

less classes and no spec.

not hard to figure out ^^

[Ellianar]

Blizzard intentionally designs classes with strengths and weaknesses. Each spec is different because of situations like Single Target vs. Cleave vs. AoE on top of burst capabilities/ramp up time as well as some Execute phase bonus damage Melee/Ranged and cast while moving or lack thereof. That is all before the plentiful utilities such as offhealing or teleports or soaking.


This is why total DPS numbers should be taken with a grain of salt. What I hope for is that Blizzard and players alike start working with success charts. That would be much more relevant.

It does not matter if, say Ele Shaman has low numbers in case he made important contribution by destroying important Ads with Ascendance burst or soaked an important mechanic via bonus resurrection.

https://twitter.com/occupygstreet/st...55240831737856

yeah no fuck that, with Legion blizzard forced player to be pigeonholed into a single spec, so every single spec in the game need to be good at ST, Cleave and AoE.

Blizzard wrote dumb rules, now they have to take responsibility

[Moggie]

Damn. Not a single warlock spec being high up is a first.

Shhh... The locks in the class forums are proclaiming lock dps is fine after they topped their raids meterz...

[farza]

Shhh... The locks in the class forums are proclaiming lock dps is fine after they topped their raids meterz...

Ofc they will. There are not many locks exist in this game already. And more of them quiting/rerolling now or will quit/reroll if blizz will not do some balance. Srsly

[lolpve]

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/10

FF14's raid DPS chart.

Why exactly can square enix do this, but Blizzard can't come anywhere close to this?

Blizzard are incompetent from the top of management down to the lead devs. Unfortunately they have a lot of hugely talented programmers and artists being led by cretins.

I'm sure ex Blizzard North staff shake their heads at many of the dumb things blizzard does in the last few years.

[Life-Binder]

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/10

FF14's raid DPS chart.

Why exactly can square enix do this, but Blizzard can't come anywhere close to this?

because 7 DPS vs 24 DPS (+ Disc xD) ...

[Deleted]

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/10

FF14's raid DPS chart.

Why exactly can square enix do this, but Blizzard can't come anywhere close to this?

Now add on another 17 classes and see what that chart looks like, I mean it's already got a 10% difference from the top of the chart to the bottom...

[Dsc]

They have done this to themselves. I blame the Wrath team and "all specs viable" for much of it. Toss in 3 new classes, x3 specs, the ridiculous artifact thing. (Not much worse than glyphs were, I know why they scrapped those...). It's a logistical nightmare.

Normal MMO talent trees, a manageable amount of classes, and 1 or 2 PvE and 1 pvp spec, combined with some PhD mathematicians. = Fixed. But it will never happen.

They've created a monster, they can't control.

[Faildevil]

Subtlety :-(

[Holofernes]

As a hunter it seems really hard getting any invites to any content right now... As MM i liked my raid damage. BM is pretty good in other content. I have ran into no issues completing any mythic or anything. Just seems baffling that people are so toxic in this game.

hunters are not invited for low dmg. they are not invited for messing up runs by pulling adds. I have encountered a hunter that messe up a +3 vault of warden run, who actually had a sorry macro for his barrage mispulls.

[Jhowzera]

So why put 938247 classes and specs if you can't handle them?

[Aurora]

Blizzard intentionally designs classes with strengths and weaknesses. Each spec is different because of situations like Single Target vs. Cleave vs. AoE on top of burst capabilities/ramp up time as well as some Execute phase bonus damage Melee/Ranged and cast while moving or lack thereof. That is all before the plentiful utilities such as offhealing or teleports or soaking.


This is why total DPS numbers should be taken with a grain of salt. What I hope for is that Blizzard and players alike start working with success charts. That would be much more relevant.

It does not matter if, say Ele Shaman has low numbers in case he made important contribution by destroying important Ads with Ascendance burst or soaked an important mechanic via bonus resurrection.

https://twitter.com/occupygstreet/st...55240831737856

Sustained single target is meant to be the baseline around which everything is balanced and WoD did a relatively good of that. Specs having niches in other areas such as soaking, support healing, support def cds, AoE, cleave, burst, multi-dotting etc etc is an accepted and understood part of the game and mostly welcomed in terms of making each spec feel unique. But they've never indicated employing a design of trading off single target for things like AoE or support, in fact during WoD development they referenced the use of Shaman dps with low damage but high desirability for bloodlust and buffs as something they were moving away from as nobody wanted to do low personal damage and feel like a stat stick.

So why put 938247 classes and specs if you can't handle them?

Gotta sell the next expansion somehow

[Magnosh]

What?

Simcraft had MM near the bottom when its currently top 3 for the fight. It also had an almost universal higher dps at 840 ilevel, when any guild that has gotten to heroic ursoc is above 840. Also one of the main arguments against the simcraft logs was the fact that it was only a patchwerk fight, which constitutes sort of one out of 7 fights, and it's even wrong on the one fight.

Statistics are what they are. You picked one of the outliers on those simulations. The fact is they predicted Arms warrior and Feral being far above everyone else and everyone screamed how wrong the sims were.

[Cirayne24]

So why put 938247 classes and specs if you can't handle them?

Outside balance issues, I understand why they would want all classes/specs to be viable. At 60, it was no fun telling druids the only way they could raid was to go resto for innervate, or pally's had to be holy, or hunters to go marksmen, etc. In Wraith, the game had what like 10 million players, so obviously a company would try to cater to the most people possible in order to continue to make money.

Above said, I'm all in favor of having a PvE spec and a PvP spec. I don't care if the DK wants to go blood for PvP, sorry, go Frost since UH/Blood is for PvE only. It might hurt peoples feelings, but, in my opinion, it would be healthier for the game over all.

- - - Updated - - -

In fact during WoD development they referenced the use of Shaman dps with low damage but high desirability for bloodlust and buffs as something they were moving away from as nobody wanted to do low personal damage and feel like a stat stick.

Didn't they say Cata was all about "Bring the player not the class?"

[Aurora]

This is a rather loose interpretation of one comment three years ago

It was recent, it was 10 days ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueofleg...zkp6?context=3

[ThrashMetalFtw]

In fact during WoD development they referenced the use of Shaman dps with low damage but high desirability for bloodlust and buffs as something they were moving away from as nobody wanted to do low personal damage and feel like a stat stick.

Pretty sure they said that at the end of WotLK, not WoD. Cata was the first expansion where every class got talents that allowed them to scale with all 2ndary stats. Remember WotLK where certain classes had 150% Crit dmg, not 200%, or DoTs not benefitting from Haste (was fixed for SPs mid ToGC, other classes had to wait until Cata).

General balance was fine in Cata and in WoD. For some reason, we had way bigger outliers in MoP, on both sides of the spectrum (Mages, Locks and Ferals were all incredibly OP at different points of the expansion, while Shadow, Ele and Ret was dogshit for most of the expansion).

There will always be a "best" spec and a "worst" spec, the problem is that Blizzard are usually very slow at fixing outliers, even when there's tons of data and evidence to showing the obvious problems.


Talking about current balance, it's not that bad. Better than MoP launch with Mages shitting on all and everything, that's for sure. Also, looking at logs, Warlocks are in a weak spot right now, but they are nowhere as bad as some ppl make them out to be. They are still much better than what Shadow, Ele and Ret were during most of MoPs lifetime.


Also, the argument about pure vs hybrid should have died 8 years ago. Blizzard has stated that all Dps specs should be as close as possible since Cata at least. The argument that a Warlock should do more dmg than a Priest because the Priest can heal, has got to be the worst of all time. When you join a raid or a guild as a Dps, you're a Dps, not a "Dps who might reroll Healer if my class sucks as Dps". For me, playing Shadow, it's way more realistic to reroll to another Class, than it is to reroll Healer.

When you are specced Shadow (or another Hybrid Dps specs), you job is to Dps, not Heal. Your job is to do as much dmg possible, just as if you were a Mage or a Lock. The advantage of playing a "Pure Dps" class, should be that you have 3 specs to switch between, allowing you to be more flexible and choosing the best spec for the fight (which is kinda broken atm because of shitty balance, but that's not the point). You should NOT have a numerical advantage over somebody performing the exact same role as you, just because their class can Heal/Tank IF they respec (thus, removing their ability to Dps).

[Extremities]

With over 500 people working on wow, you think balance might not be as difficult as they make it. Then again, I don't work in the development industry so it may be complex as all hell. Either way, 500 deep, they should be able to figure something out. Granted, not all 500 are working on balancing but im sure they have plenty of people working on it.

[Deleted]

Frost .... =/

Paladin, every other class has atleast one specc above ret

[mistahwilshire]

Except there was for years and developers stated as much. Which is why hybrids sucked ass for years. Unless you're just ignoring the first few years of the game.

If there was any validity to that at all, then Warlocks would have been viable DPS in Vanilla. Instead they had one spec that was even fathomable to take in to raids and it was literally only to support Mages. They were pure support like Paladins and Shaman.

Absolutely arbitrary coincidence.