Flag-stomping teacher has no regrets, wants student punished

[Dr Assbandit]

Perhaps I've not read all the facts, but all you liberals crowing that this young man is just the conservative version of the perpetually offended SJW that we conservatives always complain about, false equivalence is false equivalence. This student didn't throw a hysteric fit, he didn't disrespect the teacher, he didn't seek a "safe space" or demand the teacher be fired or that her personally receive some other kind of special consideration. All he did was take a picture, pick up a flag, and deliver it to the principle. If all of you were half this civil in expressing your disagreement, we'd have much less to make fun of you over.

The teacher does have a right to desecrate the flag. Anyone with even the most rudimentary understanding of the 1st Amendment understands that. He is not however free from the public scorn and professional consequences that may stem from his expression. All that being said, it takes very little personal courage to desecrate the American flag these days as it is very much in vogue. Even if he is terminated in that school district, he'll likely be turned into a martyr rewarded greatly by the well funded and deeply entrenched liberal media and education establishment.

If you honestly believe that the student who took the picture wasn't hoping for some form of disciplinary action to take place that you are either being incredibly disingenuous or you are blinded by bias.

It's amazing that when the shoe fits the other foot, suddenly he's not the conservative version of a SJW. One doesn't need to "throw a hysteric fit, or seek a "safe space" to be considered a SJW, and this lad fits the bill.

[NineSpine]

Maybe he should have burnt a Quran, he could have made the same point, or perhaps a rainbow flag.

That doesn't demonstrate the lesson at all. The point of the First Amendment is that unpopular speech (or speech plus) is protected, not that you can beat up on oppressed groups. Also, neither of those symbols stand for the value of free speech.

[Theinquisition]

Perhaps I've not read all the facts, but all you liberals crowing that this young man is just the conservative version of the perpetually offended SJW that we conservatives always complain about, false equivalence is false equivalence. This student didn't throw a hysteric fit, he didn't disrespect the teacher, he didn't seek a "safe space" or demand the teacher be fired or that her personally receive some other kind of special consideration. All he did was take a picture, pick up a flag, and deliver it to the principle. If all of you were half this civil in expressing your disagreement, we'd have much less to make fun of you over.

The teacher does have a right to desecrate the flag. Anyone with even the most rudimentary understanding of the 1st Amendment understands that. He is not however free from the public scorn and professional consequences that may stem from his expression. All that being said, it takes very little personal courage to desecrate the American flag these days as it is very much in vogue. Even if he is terminated in that school district, he'll likely be turned into a martyr rewarded greatly by the well funded and deeply entrenched liberal media and education establishment.

Well said, ultimately a waste of time in this forum, and I wouldn't be shocked if Endus banned you.

[NineSpine]

Perhaps because he is trying to attack the student for exercising the same right? The teacher performed an act that he knew would be offensive to some of the students and their parents but felt he should no be exposed to any negative comments concerning it.

Photographing people and spreading those photos is not the same right.

[ranzino]

The teacher can be said to have performed A (disrespecting students), and B (performing an act that reasonably would be expected to cause a disruption), so suspending him is reasonable.

Nope. Exercising a First Amendment clause is neither disrespecting students nor disruption. to say it bluntly: students are not entitled to be offendend by a lesson within the limits of the constitution.

[NineSpine]

Well said, ultimately a waste of time in this forum, and I wouldn't be shocked if Endus banned you.

Yes, conservatives are so oppressed by Endus. The level of conspiracy theorizing and victimhood complex on the right knows no bounds.

[Kellhound]

Flags are just pieces of cloth that you CHOOSE to place meaning in, then you CHOOSE to place that meaning in reverence. To someone else, that same piece of cloth has no meaning, or a different meaning entirely.
Would you be whining if he was stomping on a towel? How about a Hijab?

Towel? Unlikely. Hijab? I absolutely would be pissed, as it is known to have meaning to people.

[NineSpine]

Well, heres the issue, he did it while on the tax payers time. while acting as a teacher, he is representing the school and the district, not just himself. It's a given that some students and parents would find this demonstration offensive, and frankly he should have used a bit more common sense. I am confident that the etacher could have found a less provocative way to teach about the first amendment.

The teacher could have found a way to use his free speech that didn't offend you, because offending you is more important than his free speech. Got it.

[Machismo]

Apparently conservatives don't really like freedom of speech and the First Amendment.

[Zechs-cenarius]

Well he did give the ultimate lesson in the first amendment.....he is free to exercise it but not free from the consequences. LOL.

[Kellhound]

Pretty sure that actually stomping on the flag would be more memorable and more effective of a way to prove a point, and tbh it's a point kids should learn while also learning NOT to get offended over it.

Punishing the teacher just shows kids that their rights are meaningless as long as someone complains enough / acts offended enough. It's literally propagating SJW and PC culture.

You want acceptance of it, when what should be taught is tolerance. There is a difference.
Exercising your rights is not without consequences, that too is a valuable (and more realistic) lesson.

[NineSpine]

Apparently conservatives don't really like freedom of speech and the First Amendment.

They are authoritarians. They hate freedom of speech and the first amendment. They believe in adherence to authority, and little else.

[Darkeon]

Pretty sure that actually stomping on the flag would be more memorable and more effective of a way to prove a point, and tbh it's a point kids should learn while also learning NOT to get offended over it.

Punishing the teacher just shows kids that their rights are meaningless as long as someone complains enough / acts offended enough. It's literally propagating SJW and PC culture.

Well, I would say they learned an even more valuable lesson: It's okay to act\say offensive things AND, IN TURN, some people will criticize\punish and disagree with you for it - and that's okay too. Freedom of Speech does not mean Freedom from Consequences. It is that simple.

[NineSpine]

You want acceptance of it, when what should be taught is tolerance. There is a difference.
Exercising your rights is not without consequences, that too is a valuable (and more realistic) lesson.

Exercising your rights SHOULD be without government consequence, and reprimand here may very well be government consequence.

[Dellis0991]

He should not have brought his personal political ideas into school and now he butt hurt because a student filmed his antics....some things you keep to yourself.

[Super Kami Dende]

I know you guys really want to pretend that the reaction would be harsh from the left if it was a quran or a rainbow flag, and maybe it would be, but i think i would bet my life on the right wing being wayyy more nationalist than the left is social justice warriory

I'm a right leaning nationalist and couldn't give a shit if someone stomped on a flag, Free speech is far more important than a piece of cloth.

[Dr Assbandit]

Flags are just pieces of cloth that you CHOOSE to place meaning in, then you CHOOSE to place that meaning in reverence. To someone else, that same piece of cloth has no meaning, or a different meaning entirely.
Would you be whining if he was stomping on a towel? How about a Hijab?

Of course not, they would be cheering if he had stomped on a hijab while saying how brave he is for sticking it to them Islamics. They would also probably call whoever stopped or took the hijab from being stomped on a liberal SJW (insert typical buzzword here).

[Endus]

The teacher can be said to have performed A (disrespecting students), and B (performing an act that reasonably would be expected to cause a disruption), so suspending him is reasonable.

A> isn't a factor at all, because schools almost universally don't have any such requirement; they DO have expectations that students will respect the staff, however. And educating students about the First Amendment is in no way "disrespecting" them.

B? That's the role of a teacher. To challenge their students, and expand their intellectual boundaries. The students who caused the disruption are the ones in error.

AFAIK he was "only" stomping on the flag. Burning would have been the ultimate way to demonstrate the wide playground of first amendment's "freedom of speech" clause, but perhaps he abstained because the safety rules.

If he wasn't burning it, then there's absolutely nothing actionable here.

Well, heres the issue, he did it while on the tax payers time. while acting as a teacher, he is representing the school and the district, not just himself. It's a given that some students and parents would find this demonstration offensive, and frankly he should have used a bit more common sense. I am confident that the etacher could have found a less provocative way to teach about the first amendment.

You realize you're arguing for a "safe space" where students aren't made to face truths that they find uncomfortable, right? Don't you usually rail against that stuff?

Challenging students' incorrect assumptions is a fundamental part of the teaching process.

[NineSpine]

I'm a right leaning nationalist and couldn't give a shit if someone stomped on a flag.

You know "fascist" is much shorter and easier, and honest.

[AndaliteBandit]

I know you guys really want to pretend that the reaction would be harsh from the left if it was a quran or a rainbow flag, and maybe it would be, but i think i would bet my life on the right wing being wayyy more nationalist than the left is social justice warriory

Imagine how they would have reacted if Tebow had been penalized for praying instead of just mocked, like the Muslim player who actually was penalized for praying?