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  1. #381
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zombergy View Post
    And what did I make up?

    I've been talking about public opinion the entire time.

    Public opinion is that the people in that community (the ones calling for his head) don't like flag desecration.
    That's fine.

    Their opinion is fundamentally irrelevant. Whether a teacher can be fired over conduct is entirely based on the codes of their profession, their agreements with their union, and so forth. A lot of parents being upset is not cause for termination, not unless his behaviour broke one of those official rules.

    Quote Originally Posted by nextormento View Post
    There's no need to invoke the constitution there: any insolent kid knows the best course of action is to cry to their parents until they call the school and demand their kid be treated well or whatever.
    If my experience is any indication, private religious schools cave to that bullshit easily.
    This wasn't a private religious school, it's a public school. I already linked their website. They're part of the Cumberland County Schools system, specifically.


  2. #382
    Quote Originally Posted by Zeta333 View Post
    It may be the teachers right to stomp on the flag. But not in a place of learning where a class of 30+ kids are looking for him to teach them, and instead he goes on to make a political statement.
    IDK, being exposed to radical or contrary political opinions sounds pretty damn useful for students in a history class.

  3. #383
    What happened to the student's freedom of speech?

  4. #384
    The Unstoppable Force Super Kami Dende's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yirrah View Post
    The irony of seeing so many of the usual suspects that regularily rant against awful "SJW's trying to censor other people" doing the exact same thing themselves is downright hillarious!

    Please, keep it up. This is hypocrisy circus at its best!
    The far side of both wings of politics are as retarded and hypocritical as eachother. Though this isn't a new thing.

  5. #385
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkeon View Post
    But, always keep it in mind, Freedom of Speech is NOT Freedom from Consequences.
    An action having consequences means that it's not actually a freedom.

  6. #386
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    An action having consequences means that it's not actually a freedom.
    This is inherently unworkable in the real world. Let's say you start throwing out racial slurs in a McDonalds. Your speech rights of course protect being a shithead. However their property rights protect them throwing you out. The only way to prevent your actions from resulting in consequences is for someone else to lose their freedoms. Doesn't work.

  7. #387
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    This is inherently unworkable in the real world. Let's say you start throwing out racial slurs in a McDonalds. Your speech rights of course protect being a shithead. However their property rights protect them throwing you out. The only way to prevent your actions from resulting in consequences is for someone else to lose their freedoms. Doesn't work.
    I agree that it's essentially unworkable, so we really should call it the limited capacity that it actually is

    Pointless post on my part, but the whole 'not free from consequences' thing annoys me.

  8. #388
    Well if he was doing this as a lesson then we are all looking at this wayyy out of context. he is way with in his rights to do this. It's not even close to illegal. That student was just being butt hurt.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeta333 View Post
    It may be the teachers right to stomp on the flag. But not in a place of learning where a class of 30+ kids are looking for him to teach them, and instead he goes on to make a political statement.
    He was teaching history, He did this as part of a teaching lesson. No political statement. Look at the story. The student just got super butt hurt.

  9. #389
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    This wasn't a private religious school, it's a public school. I already linked their website. They're part of the Cumberland County Schools system, specifically.
    Was just the anecdote section. Kids can do that everywhere.
    However, I'm not seeing any direct evidence of it being public or private, really. Out of curiosity, can you point out what exactly makes them public and not private in any way?.
    In any case, I'm not entirely certain of how education is structured over there. Here we have schools that are publicly funded but remain private (this figure is what most religious schools choose here.). They're subject to some regulation, and they're rather cheap, but they're free to do most of the things a private institution does. Such conduct their labor relationships with teachers with no state intervention other than the worker's law: cause is required, but, if they need one, they'll find one.

  10. #390
    The Lightbringer Christan's Avatar
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    Main question would be for if the kid did something criminal: public or private school?
    If public, since those are funded by local gov't it could be argued he was a govt offical on public property(assuming he was outside(firey flags inside! Nty) and school isnt on rented land.
    If private, yep illegal.

    Second question would be, was he under tenure at the school in question, under contract, teachers union w/e.
    If so them firing him for having commited no crime may be against the law, they could end up getting sued, whether public or private.

    If he wasnt under contract of the sorts, AND,in an "employment at will" state, then they can indeed of fired him for any reason whatsoever.

    Not enough facts in that FOX, news story, of course there arent, guessing other media outlets have eaten this clickbait story, but are there any facts out there or not?
    Still I cry, tears like pouring rain, Innocent is my lurid pain.

  11. #391
    the teacher is a piece of trash, glad this kid got him suspended needs to be fired.

    good job kid show that piece of trash.

  12. #392
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimusmc View Post
    the teacher is a piece of trash, glad this kid got him suspended needs to be fired.

    good job kid show that piece of trash.
    Next time he should only exercise speech the government likes.

  13. #393
    I see nothing wrong. He was fired because of what he did. He expressed his free speech and the student expressed their right to record in a public place. The company expressed their right to fire him.

    Teacher is just mad because everyone else is allowed to express their rights too.

  14. #394
    Quote Originally Posted by Assbandit View Post
    Please tell me what possible intent someone could have when they not only recorded the instructor but then posted it online as well along with taking it to the principal. If he was truly being patriotic, the kid could have just taken the flag and that would have been the end of it. Instead, pictures can obviously be seen from the article, gee I wonder how they found their way online, clearly it was the student trying to show social media how good the lesson was.

    You're more than welcome to consider me biased but that's nothing but an attempt to deflect. It doesn't take a genius to deduce his reasoning unless you're naive or just don't want to believe it because it doesn't align with your personal bias.
    I never brought up bias until you did. Nor have I made any attempt to hide mine. You simply highlighted my bias as a means of invalidating my argument which is a. hypocritical because you clearly have one also, and b. illogical because my having a bias in no way merits on an argument being made unless I am using that bias to misrepresent the facts. I didn't misrepresent anything. I just said comparing this student's actions to the liberal SJW is a false equivalence because he did not exhibit the behaviors we deride in the liberal SJW. He took a picture and picked up a flag. He did not pitch a fit and make demands. Feel free to speculate about his motivations if you wish. Just acknowledge that no matter how justified you feel in making that speculation, it is just you speculating, according to your own personal biases. My original point stands.

  15. #395
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    An action having consequences means that it's not actually a freedom.
    That's stupid.

    You are free to drink poison, but if you die that doesn't mean you are not free to drink whatever you want. (Not telling you to drink poison...Some people need to be told that apparently)

  16. #396
    Quote Originally Posted by Asiwassaying View Post
    I see nothing wrong. He was fired because of what he did. He expressed his free speech and the student expressed their right to record in a public place. The company expressed their right to fire him.

    Teacher is just mad because everyone else is allowed to express their rights too.
    Government doesn't have a right to punish people for their speech.

  17. #397
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Government doesn't have a right to punish people for their speech.
    And baking a cake without eggs is very difficult. Not sure what both of these statements matter here. We are talking about a school, a teacher, and a student. Teachers get fired, and students get expelled. It's a job. No one went to jail.

  18. #398
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilrak View Post
    Why would that please me?
    I just found your reaction to somebody kneeling to be funny.
    Oh, ok. I guess we're fine then.

  19. #399
    Quote Originally Posted by Asiwassaying View Post
    And baking a cake without eggs is very difficult. Not sure what both of these statements matter here. We are talking about a school, a teacher, and a student. Teachers get fired, and students get expelled. It's a job. No one went to jail.
    Public schools are part of the government

  20. #400
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Public schools are part of the government
    And you can be fired by the government.

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