First presidential debate - September 26: Trump vs Hillary

[Celista]

That's the point I'm making. I cannot believe there's a legitimate way to make $600 million of gross income all be untaxable income.

Probably why he gets audited every year...I can't believe he's had years where he paid nothing in taxes, either. That is pretty astounding.

[Deleted]

Trump is going to fuck shit up for us with pretty much everyone but Putin. And that's if he can even keep that thing going. People outside the us does not like him. He also does not like them. He is going to be exceptionally bad for your alliances.

Is he starts demanding more money from every single country he is going to start loosing alliances.

[mvaliz]

Trump has some fantastic ideas! He is going to make a great leader for this country; a much better one than Obama. Trump is one of the few that wants to return America to its former glory. I've been pretty hyped all night

Why do Dump supporters just seem to post these oddball empty bot-like rhetoric posts instead of, you know, contributing to the thread discussing the actual debate?

...oh who am i kidding! you know this is just a guy bot-spamming his rhetoric :P

[Stommped]

You're explicitly changing it. She makes brownies. Your argument was that giving her more money to spend on making more brownies would necessarily result in her selling more brownies at that same price point, because sales are, in your mind, directly tied to production.

That's what trickle-down economics is.

I'm pointing out how ridiculous that is. If she makes 50,000 brownies for her school fair, and keeps her price point the same, she isn't going to magically sell more brownies, just because she's got a lot more waiting in the minivan outside. That's not how markets work. Demand drives markets, not production. This is like first day of Economics 101 level stuff.

What? No, you guys made up the ridiculous brownie example. I explicitly said that if demand truly is capped (rarer than you are giving credit for) then you invest in OTHER markets. You can't just give the girl 30,000 and tell her she cant use the money on anything other than brownies, thats not reality.

[Breccia]

Probably why he gets audited every year

Did he say fifteen years in the debate?

[Kellhound]

You're explicitly changing it. She makes brownies. Your argument was that giving her more money to spend on making more brownies would necessarily result in her selling more brownies at that same price point, because sales are, in your mind, directly tied to production.

That's what trickle-down economics is.

I'm pointing out how ridiculous that is. If she makes 50,000 brownies for her school fair, and keeps her price point the same, she isn't going to magically sell more brownies, just because she's got a lot more waiting in the minivan outside. That's not how markets work. Demand drives markets, not production. This is like first day of Economics 101 level stuff.

They drive each other actually.

[Breccia]

I explicitly said that if demand truly is capped (rarer than you are giving credit for) then you invest in OTHER markets.

Yes, but what if other markets are also closed? If, for example, you piss off your trade partners like China, the EU, and Mexico?

[Endus]

Markets work by increasing demand, by buying more material she is increasing demand in the system.

No, the market is the class fair. Don't change the example. Her buying more materials does not affect the number of people in her class fair who will buy brownies at the price she's been selling them at.

We're specifically narrowing this down to a small market to make the issue more clear. In the greater national consumer market, the same principle holds true; consumer demand does not increase just because production went up. It stays right where it was. If you were already meeting market demand, you're going to end up with unsellable stock.

[mvaliz]

...MSNBC just cut over.

Hey Hooked - Hillary isn't going home to bed. She's actually doing a rally live... RIGHT NOW ^_^

[Kellhound]

wish i would make 17$ an hour. would be able to afford to eat more than the measly amount i do now. i'm constantly starving. i would kill for 17$ an hour.

That is pretty cheap for a hit person, I will have to keep that in mind......

I assume you either live in a low demand area or have low demand skills. The downside to the service based economy, most good jobs are gone now.

[Deleted]

Markets work by increasing demand, by buying more material she is increasing demand in the system.

This makes no sense. Why would demand increase just because you buy more materials? People don't suddenly buy more brownies just because the store has more of them. Unless you sell them cheaper?

[Endus]

What? No, you guys made up the ridiculous brownin example. I explicitly said that if demand truly is capped (rarer than you are giving credit for) then you invest in OTHER markets. You can't just give the girl 30,000 and tell her she cant use the money on anything other than brownies, thats not reality.

And that's you changing the example, which was a deliberate oversimplification.

Those other markets are also saturated. If Apple made 30 times as many iPhones as they usually make, they wouldn't sell all those iPhones at the current price point. They'd hit a level of market saturation, and then nobody would want one any more, and they'd be left with a mountain of unsold stock, while still continuing to produce more. They could drop the price way down, and make way less per unit, but that's not making them more money, so they have little reason to want to do so.

You can't just create demand by stepping up production. You keep trying to claim that's true, and it's a ridiculous and obviously wrong idea. If it WERE true, then I could sell my fingernail clippings by just straight-up clipping them more, because by increasing production, I'm generating demand. That's obviously not true (and gross). There needs to be a demand first.

[Felya]

...MSNBC just cut over.

Hey Hooked - Hillary isn't going home to bed. She's actually doing a rally live... RIGHT NOW ^_^

I've heard rumors that there have been ghostly figures spotted around her campaign, that look remarkably like Marie Catherine Laveau. Can the walking dead be called live?

[Breccia]

This makes no sense. Why would demand increase just because you buy more materials? People don't suddenly buy more brownies just because the store has more of them. Unless you sell them cheaper?

I think he meant, that she would buy loads more flour and cocoa, driving those markets.

To make $29,990 worth of brownies that rot on the shelves.

It's not a great example.

[Kellhound]

No, the market is the class fair. Don't change the example. Her buying more materials does not affect the number of people in her class fair who will buy brownies at the price she's been selling them at.

We're specifically narrowing this down to a small market to make the issue more clear. In the greater national consumer market, the same principle holds true; consumer demand does not increase just because production went up. It stays right where it was. If you were already meeting market demand, you're going to end up with unsellable stock.

You do not know if the demand will go up or not because you do not know what the effect of the increased material purchase will have on the people going to the fair.

[Zervek]

Why do Dump supporters just seem to post these oddball empty bot-like rhetoric posts instead of, you know, contributing to the thread discussing the actual debate?

...oh who am i kidding! you know this is just a guy bot-spamming his rhetoric :P

Is it wrong to praise the one I like? Trump is objectively the best president our country could ever have.

[Endus]

You do not know if the demand will go up or not because you do not know what the effect of the increased material purchase will have on the people going to the fair.

You're being utterly ridiculous, to avoid dealing with a pretty damned simple example.

[breadisfunny]

That is pretty cheap for a hit person, I will have to keep that in mind......

I assume you either live in a low demand area or have low demand skills. The downside to the service based economy, most good jobs are gone now.

can't afford to go to school.
also i thought the debate was tomorrow night...
what channel is it on?

[Felya]

Markets work by increasing demand, by buying more material she is increasing demand in the system.

Are you suggesting overstock creates demand? I think you are confusing the demand to move product and the demand by the consumer.

[alexw]

And you clearly aren't listening to a word I'm saying. I'm telling you the reason for France's economic problems is because they started super taxing the rich back in 2010, your using a completely separate issue to pinpoint the problem and completely ignoring the actual problem. Please don't me to learn something about economics again when you are just clearly not listening.

No that is absolute rubbish. You can make this claim as much as you want but it has nothing to do with what is going on.

Please read some economics. You can start here -
http://www.economist.com/blogs/freee.../11/imbalances

Note where it says -

Germany’s anemic pace of domestic demand growth and dependence on exports have hampered rebalancing at a time when many other euro-area countries have been under severe pressure to curb demand and compress imports in order to promote adjustment. The net result has been a deflationary bias for the euro area, as well as for the world economy.