MM and BM single target

[Deleted]

To be fair he does make a good point.

If you want to do Mythic progress, playing BM is just hurting your raid. My guild will be selecting it's mythic raiders soon and I'm ashamed to make a case for them picking me over our other MM hunters. My pets have issues moving around, I don't have the same sustain, I can only AoE clustered mobs.

MM hits just as hard as me, but it cleaves literally everything. So to compensate for me not being able to do what MM does, I'd have to bring some sort of utility, but I don't have any.

So really I'm never going to get picked for Mythic raiding. I'll only get to do it once it's on farm, which is a shame really and not even close to what Blizzard promised us.

Balance my arse, both BM and SV aren't viable for competitive Mythic raiding.

[Deleted]

I'm not even a hunter player and I haven't heard about azorth before.

I do however applause telling people off when they use sims wrong and link things like noxic or wol.

Fuck this this feelcrafting people are doing

[Fiftyonred]

Then why you are so triggered?

I ain't triggered, I'm wired, cuz.

[Deleted]

To be fair he does make a good point.

If you want to do Mythic progress, playing BM is just hurting your raid. My guild will be selecting it's mythic raiders soon and I'm ashamed to make a case for them picking me over our other MM hunters. My pets have issues moving around, I don't have the same sustain, I can only AoE clustered mobs.

MM hits just as hard as me, but it cleaves literally everything. So to compensate for me not being able to do what MM does, I'd have to bring some sort of utility, but I don't have any.

So really I'm never going to get picked for Mythic raiding. I'll only get to do it once it's on farm, which is a shame really and not even close to what Blizzard promised us.

Balance my arse, both BM and SV aren't viable for competitive Mythic raiding.

Im in the same boat, I refuse to play MM because the spec is horrible and I want to smash my face trough my screen when I play it.
BM won't be viable compared to the other MM hunters in my raid group, even with pots I was still 25k below the MM hunters ( I was third on dps most of the time behind the 2 MM hunters). I parsed in the 95% of BM hunters but I am still not viable for mythic progression.

I have stept down and will join when the guild has things on farm or BM has been buffed to a degree were I can actually pull my weight without wanting to shoot my self when playing a horrible shit spec like MM is now.

[Aldare]

Im in the same boat, I refuse to play MM because the spec is horrible and I want to smash my face trough my screen when I play it.
BM won't be viable compared to the other MM hunters in my raid group, even with pots I was still 25k below the MM hunters ( I was third on dps most of the time behind the 2 MM hunters). I parsed in the 95% of BM hunters but I am still not viable for mythic progression.

I have stept down and will join when the guild has things on farm or BM has been buffed to a degree were I can actually pull my weight without wanting to shoot my self when playing a horrible shit spec like MM is now.

A sucky situation to be in for sure, I'm lucky that MM is actually the only Hunter spec that I enjoy currently (I loved BM in WoD, but I just get bored out of my mind playing it now), and if BM was suddenly mandatory I'd probably be doing the same as you and giving raiding a break.

[Deleted]

A sucky situation to be in for sure, I'm lucky that MM is actually the only Hunter spec that I enjoy currently (I loved BM in WoD, but I just get bored out of my mind playing it now), and if BM was suddenly mandatory I'd probably be doing the same as you and giving raiding a break.

I was the same with BM at the start of the expansion but I am in 860 gear now and it feels a lot better, I don't feel like I am waiting for focus to much anymore and my up time on Bestial Wrath is getting higher and higher .

[Deleted]

I was the same with BM at the start of the expansion but I am in 860 gear now and it feels a lot better, I don't feel like I am waiting for focus to much anymore and my up time on Bestial Wrath is getting higher and higher .

It's not about numbers, but about mechanics. The numbers aren't that far behind and will only get closer, but all of the more technical fights favor MM. Heck MM even cleaves a decent amount of damage to Ill'gynoth while the eye is up, imagine having 3-4 MM hunters cleaving and hitting him with Barrage, heck you'd be doing a decent chunk of damage to him before even entering his room. And there are other fights where adds are too spread and BM pets have 0 mobility outside of Kill Command, it's just retarded looking at them chasing stuff around while the MM hunters are blasting Marked Shots at everything on screen without sacrificing damage on their primary target.

With that said, it's not that BM is a bad spec, compared to other classes it may even be a good spec, but MM is probably the best and most superior raiding spec of all classes in the game right now. For the same reason it's a bit sucky in dungeons, it's godly in raids, so it really makes no sense to take any other hunter spec for high end raiding.

[Deleted]

It's not about numbers, but about mechanics. The numbers aren't that far behind and will only get closer, but all of the more technical fights favor MM. Heck MM even cleaves a decent amount of damage to Ill'gynoth while the eye is up, imagine having 3-4 MM hunters cleaving and hitting him with Barrage, heck you'd be doing a decent chunk of damage to him before even entering his room. And there are other fights where adds are too spread and BM pets have 0 mobility outside of Kill Command, it's just retarded looking at them chasing stuff around while the MM hunters are blasting Marked Shots at everything on screen without sacrificing damage on their primary target.

With that said, it's not that BM is a bad spec, compared to other classes it may even be a good spec, but MM is probably the best and most superior raiding spec of all classes in the game right now. For the same reason it's a bit sucky in dungeons, it's godly in raids, so it really makes no sense to take any other hunter spec for high end raiding.

I know thats the reason I stept down from raiding.
Was just trying to say it doesn't "feel" to clunky (to me) at higher Ilvl as it did when I just dinged.

I agree with you that there is absolutely no reason to bring a BM hunter to a raid.

[Deleted]

To me BM is not clunky at all, I think it just lacks 1 more decent button to press and is a bit energy starved.

MM is clunky as fuck and if it wasn't for the fact SW is the most overpowered talent in the game, nobody would be playing it right now.

[Aldare]

To me BM is not clunky at all, I think it just lacks 1 more decent button to press and is a bit energy starved.

MM is clunky as fuck and if it wasn't for the fact SW is the most overpowered talent in the game, nobody would be playing it right now.

MM without Sidewinders and Patient Sniper is indeed super clunky, and its pretty clear they were put in as bandaids when Blizzard realized they screwed up with MM. It's also why they will probably be balanced to remain as the strongest talent choices until Blizzard have time to revamp Hunters again.

[Deleted]

This thread is my favorite thus far

This place has just gone to the dogs..
After reading this + various other threads in the Hunter section, my conclusion is : Get your dicks on the table and get the measuring tape out because the back and forth bullshit is getting nobody anywhere.

[Deleted]

The last part is your own fault. Blizzard has mentioned previously they'll try to keep the order of specs the same when hotfixing things. You chose to invest into a spec that Blizzard has indirectly said they'll try to keep the inferior spec for raiding.

Why should be my fault explain yourself
I just have 16 traits in my BM artefact like everyone else and raid was normal mode anyway

[Jdubwo]

And he never disappoints.

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And boom! One more for the road!

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I don't think he understands that. And I honestly do not get why everyone simply does mass ignore the dude. The level of insecure teen screaming for attention is just stunning!

You literally seem like the immature one. People are asking some really stupid questions constantly, and he answers perfectly well for the situation. Stop white knighting nancy.

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i know you are maybe one of the best hunters in the world but jesus christ how can you be such an ass?

Really dude? That is totally a fine response, the guy is using World of Logs, that has not been updated in years.

[Big Guy]

So I've been looking at other BM Hunters on warcraftlogs for single target fights like Ursoc, and I've noticed they're getting ~50 - 60 Kill Commands in with an average duration of 4 minutes per fight. Testing this myself on a training dummy, even with legendary boots which gives me a few more Kill Commands when I Dire Beast, I can only manage to get in ~40 in a 4 minute period while using Killer Cobra and using a BL pet for testing.

I'm pooling my Focus before each BW to get the max amount of Kill Commands off yet I can't even remotely dent the amount these guys are doing. I have no fucking idea how you could fit 50 - 60 Kill Commands in 4 minutes. The only conclusion I have is that I must be doing something wrong personally if other Hunters are pulling this off just fine.

I don't really know how logs work but I did the /combatlog command and recorded the 4 minute period: m(dot)uploadedit(dot)com/ba3s/147498938273.txt any advice at all would be greatly appreciated.

[kevsmart]

So I've been looking at other BM Hunters on warcraftlogs for single target fights like Ursoc, and I've noticed they're getting ~50 - 60 Kill Commands in with an average duration of 4 minutes per fight. Testing this myself on a training dummy, even with legendary boots which gives me a few more Kill Commands when I Dire Beast, I can only manage to get in ~40 in a 4 minute period while using Killer Cobra and using a BL pet for testing.

I'm pooling my Focus before each BW to get the max amount of Kill Commands off yet I can't even remotely dent the amount these guys are doing. I have no fucking idea how you could fit 50 - 60 Kill Commands in 4 minutes. The only conclusion I have is that I must be doing something wrong personally if other Hunters are pulling this off just fine.

I don't really know how logs work but I did the /combatlog command and recorded the 4 minute period: m(dot)uploadedit(dot)com/ba3s/147498938273.txt any advice at all would be greatly appreciated.

I checked my Ursoc log from last week and found that I had 42 KC over 4:05 without any legendaries. Maybe you aren't using Dire Beast enough (I had 46)?

[Big Guy]

I'm honestly not sure, I try to always use DB on CD as the legendary basically gives me a free Kill Command on every DB. The only time I'd maybe delay a DB for 1 or 2 seconds would be during Killer Cobra phase unless under Bloodlust since it makes Kill Command a 4 sec cooldown and using DB instead of Cobra Shot for reset saves focus for another Cobra reset after that.

[Fiftyonred]

You literally seem like the immature one. People are asking some really stupid questions constantly, and he answers perfectly well for the situation. Stop white knighting nancy.

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Really dude? That is totally a fine response, the guy is using World of Logs, that has not been updated in years.

Sure....go ahead. Be THAT fan.

[Sartuk]

world of logs, noxxic etc tell to just play what you want, blizzard will eventually balance things out. so stay comfy on your favorite ;-)

I mean, this isn't totally true. Warcraft Logs (because using World of Logs is silly at best) makes it quite clear that, even on the EN fights that one might think would favor BM over MM, MM is coming out ahead right now. On the fights where it makes sense that MM would win? It's CRUSHING BM. This is true at all item levels (even lower ones, where again BM would have more of an edge), and even true for people who are putting up low percentile performances (MM, being a slightly harder spec to play well, shouldn't be as good when people play it poorly).

There's no guarantee Blizz will ever perfectly balance the two specs. MM, by design, is going to crush encounters where there's quasi spread out cleave. Unless it gets nerfed to the ground (not gonna happen), BM wont be competitive with it in EN. Which, by the way, I think is a shame because I intrinsically like BM a lot more and did use it our first week of raiding (granted I'm in a casual, normal/heroic, 2 day a week raid group).

[Big Guy]

Speaking of world of logs, I did a Xavius normal run tonight and after the fight Skada showed I had 223k DPS, and came 4th in the raid just slightly behind my other guildies which the leader was chuffed about since we were a 4man pugging it with randoms and he was happy the 4 from our guild were top DPS, but then the world of logs log for the fight showed me as having 187k DPS and being 6th or 7th in total damage. Does WoL's work things out differently or something?

[Turtel]

I'm honestly not sure, I try to always use DB on CD as the legendary basically gives me a free Kill Command on every DB. The only time I'd maybe delay a DB for 1 or 2 seconds would be during Killer Cobra phase unless under Bloodlust since it makes Kill Command a 4 sec cooldown and using DB instead of Cobra Shot for reset saves focus for another Cobra reset after that.

Here's a couple of other things you haven't mentioned, which could result in a few more Kill Commands:

- Are you prioritising Kill Command over Dire Beast? Sometimes they both come off cooldown at the same time, and you should delay Dire Beast to use Kill Command.

- Are you always aligning your Aspect of the Wild with a Bestial Wrath? Aspect of the Wild gives a huge amount of extra focus which, when using the Killer Cobra talent, is the primary restriction on how many Kill Commands you'll be able to use during the BW window.

- Are you using the Dire Stable talent? This doubles the focus regen of Dire Beast, which should give you an extra Kill Command during some BW windows.

- It could also be your haste stat; the more haste you have, the more Kill Commands you'll be able to cast (since it lowers the cooldown). Haste also affects your global cooldown length, which (when Aspect of the Wild is up) could allow you to cast more Cobra Shot->Kill Command combos during each BW window.

- When you're GCD locked, it's also possible to waste GCDs during your BW windows with abilities like Murder of Crows. At the start of the fight you'd use Murder of Crows, then wait until the global cooldown finishes, then cast Bestial Wrath followed immediately by Kill Command. Murder of Crows still gets basically the full benefit of BW even though you didn't cast it during BW.