Windwalker & Brewmaster, how happy are you currently?

[Deleted]

When I look at Firemage AOE Dps or Demonhunter I find it hard to say that SotW NEEDED the nerf.

The problem with SotW was that it did all that damage in 1 GCD, and it needed no special preparation. Everything else in the game that does as much or more (e.g. the SV hunter artifact ability beats SotW easily when specced into Mongoose CD reset) needs some preparation. And they balanced only looking at data from instances, i.e. nh, hc, mythic. Much data from mythic+ and raids wasn't even available yet. Only looking at that content, with everything being a burst aoe fest, the spell was too strong and NEEDED to be nerfed. If the spell would have been "50% damage of it instantly and 50% over 15 seconds", far fewer people would have complained, and possibly wouldn't have been a nerf. But our aoe is still strong, just the ability is uninteresting now, sadly.

[Doomchicken]

BrM sucks right now and everyone (except blizzard apparently) knows it. Just look at warcraft logs to see the tank representation from mythic nythendra. It's roughly 9 warrior tanks (highest represented class) to 1 monk tank (lowest represented class). I did a tally up before I went to bed 9 hours ago and 15 monk tanks had killed mythic nythendra versus 129 warrior tanks, 100 paladin tanks, 115 bear tanks, 67 dh tanks and 51 blood tanks. FIFTEEN fucking monk tanks. That's just....amazing in a whole new level of retarded balance.

[Interim]

BrM sucks right now and everyone (except blizzard apparently) knows it. Just look at warcraft logs to see the tank representation from mythic nythendra. It's roughly 9 warrior tanks (highest represented class) to 1 monk tank (lowest represented class). I did a tally up before I went to bed 9 hours ago and 15 monk tanks had killed mythic nythendra versus 129 warrior tanks, 100 paladin tanks, 115 bear tanks, 67 dh tanks and 51 blood tanks. FIFTEEN fucking monk tanks. That's just....amazing in a whole new level of retarded balance.

all the monk specs are in a worse place than they should be atm.

to answer hte OP, i was okay until the buffs/shuffling they did. latest sims have us near the bottom. unfortunately there are classes that do everything we do, but better.

that being said, monk is fun as hell always has been. its the only reason i can stomach our returning to our rightful place in the heirarchy :P

[Jaigar]

BrM sucks right now and everyone (except blizzard apparently) knows it. Just look at warcraft logs to see the tank representation from mythic nythendra. It's roughly 9 warrior tanks (highest represented class) to 1 monk tank (lowest represented class). I did a tally up before I went to bed 9 hours ago and 15 monk tanks had killed mythic nythendra versus 129 warrior tanks, 100 paladin tanks, 115 bear tanks, 67 dh tanks and 51 blood tanks. FIFTEEN fucking monk tanks. That's just....amazing in a whole new level of retarded balance.

I don't think this is a good image of BrM performance. Remember that people heard Prot warriors were godly with guard/ignore pain and swapped over. Its a self fulfilling prophecy.

Im interested in their actual performance.

[Mekkle]

As a Brewmaster, Rushing Jade Wind should be base line and the damage buffed. Also a bit squishy compared to other tanks so that needs a bit of work but I'm not gonna pretend to know where.

[AetherMcLoud]

I play all 3 specs but never played monk before Legion:

I LOVE everything about WW. The mastery is amazingly fun, the animations are great, a lot of talent rows offer real options instead of having 1 talent be always the best (besides the healing elixir row for all 3 specs), EASILY the most fun melee spec I've ever played in WoW (having played or tried them all one and off over the addons). Mobility from roll and FSK is sweet, and getting healed from teleport is really nice in pvp too. I REALLY hope they don't go through with the pvp talent nerfs though, especially the snare removal and charge on tiger palm.

I can definitely tell that Brewmaster has to work harder to get the same results (or maybe a bit less) than other tanks, but on the other hand (having tried the other tanks at 100) it's by far the most fun tank now, gameplay wise for me. I always tanked in WoW dungeons and raids and Brewmaster is the only tank in Legion where I feel I always have options to do a bit better here or there. I've been told a lot of times that's I'm far smoother to heal than other tanks (besides warrior maybe), though the lack of ANY utility for the party/raid definitely hurts. Guard as a normal talent instead of the PVP talent it now is would be nice. Just a shield for us and an ally on 45 sec cd.

Also, Zen Meditation is by far the most useless tank cooldown ever invented.

MW is also a really fun and extremely mobile healing spec. Love it for pvp healing, great talent choices, 2x roll + 2x teleport to player + swap teleport + tiger's freedom = most fun pvp healer.

[Doomchicken]

I don't think this is a good image of BrM performance. Remember that people heard Prot warriors were godly with guard/ignore pain and swapped over. Its a self fulfilling prophecy.

Im interested in their actual performance.

Well, to be fair, if they performed better they would be at least around the blood dk/vengeance dh level of representation instead of being so underrepresented that even against DK's which are the second lowest, they're still underrepresented on a 3.4:1 ratio. To me that screams there is something fundamentally wrong about the spec if it's driving everyone away to play something else instead.

[Yhcti]

I was very close to rerolling back to my Rogue last night as Assassination is viable again (I love DoTs!!) however I came across a few rares that had a ton of health and suddenly realized that my Touch of Death deals damage equal to my health so that mob died very quickly with ToD & Sotw... life is just easy ... The Rogue kills almost as quick (burst is not even close) and with the legendary (if you get it) feint heals you for 20% of max health so you get some survivability there. But Monk is just easy. Fun and easy.

[Statix]

It was too much for a single button press. SCK with stacks is better anyway and more engaging.

Sure, it was, but other classes still have buttons that are just as powerful. A lot of the burst is gone now. You can make use of SEF to quickly get stats for SCK, but without that, our AOE isn't all that special anymore.

[Tuskchi]

I'm maining WW, although I Tank and Heal more often in instances than DPS ... BrM and MW are 13 Artifact Level and I've tanked some Mythics ... Despite me investing so heavily into the WW Artifact ( near 19 soon ), I'm rly sick of all the stupid nerfs. Our ST sux, Cleave and AoE got nerfed.

So, right now, I prefer to BrM, at least it's fun, compared to pulling out lackluster DIPS ...

[Yhcti]

I'm maining WW, although I Tank and Heal more often in instances than DPS ... BrM and MW are 13 Artifact Level and I've tanked some Mythics ... Despite me investing so heavily into the WW Artifact ( near 19 soon ), I'm rly sick of all the stupid nerfs. Our ST sux, Cleave and AoE got nerfed.

So, right now, I prefer to BrM, at least it's fun, compared to pulling out lackluster DIPS ...

I don't understand where you get that answer from tbh. I'm level 108 and I absolutely destroy everyone on Cleave, AoE and ST is 50/50. I know a few top tier WW Monks who carry their raids on several bosses also..

WW seems great to me. I can't wait to hit 110 and gear it up... I do miss my Rogues playstyle however, Windwalker looks great. Mobile, has AoE AND ST (which is rare, most classes are either great ST or great AoE)

[Deleted]

I don't understand where you get that answer from tbh. I'm level 108 and I absolutely destroy everyone on Cleave, AoE and ST is 50/50. I know a few top tier WW Monks who carry their raids on several bosses also..

WW seems great to me. I can't wait to hit 110 and gear it up... I do miss my Rogues playstyle however, Windwalker looks great. Mobile, has AoE AND ST (which is rare, most classes are either great ST or great AoE)

Windwalker single target damage is not good at all at same gear lvls compared to other classes. Only DK is worse among melees and Survival/Demon Hunter very close.

Also I am pretty sure that no Monk "carries" a raid right unless there is a significant gear and skill level gap. There is no raid boss to really take advantage of sustained AOE capabilities. Other classes have better burst AOE now.

[Honik]

I'm maining WW and i don't know, outside of cooldowns rotation feels slow and bit boring, but dps wise it's awesome. Also I'm not happy about crackling jade lighting nerf which is coming since I'm using it as filler between Blackout Kicks.

About BrM.. I didn't like it but with more and more traits in weapon I'm finding it better and funnier, i miss guard tho

[goldfishie]

I tanked mythic Elerethe as BrM and it didnt feel bad at all. by the time i needed to self heal i had ~6-8 orbs saved up and just LoHd myself. had tanked the boss with several spider buffs and was able to heal/spam purify. tanked a m+10 EoA and was scary at times but wasnt toooo bad. as far as WW (my main spec) im very happy w/ it in raid and in m+ our aoe is top tier and our single target while not being the best, its still very strong. so all in all im very happy. nerf to sotw made me sad but was 100% needed, i do wish it was still useful on big aoe, like if it applied SCK buffs to all the targets or something.

[Yhcti]

Windwalker single target damage is not good at all at same gear lvls compared to other classes. Only DK is worse among melees and Survival/Demon Hunter very close.

Also I am pretty sure that no Monk "carries" a raid right unless there is a significant gear and skill level gap. There is no raid boss to really take advantage of sustained AOE capabilities. Other classes have better burst AOE now.

Name a class that does it better? just curious. I play both Havoc and Windwalker and personally have no trouble flying through the meters on AoE specific. Single Target I'm not ahead much unless it's a short fight as both classes have ridiculous burst DPS.. Sustained seems to be the only issue I've faced with either class. I can't get my head around my Mage or Rogue though, and they're definitely not as enjoyable to play. I'd take the slight nerf to damage over a fun spec any day of the week

[Julmara]

i basicly just played Brewmaster and stuff that annoyes me is
add pickup i have to skill RJW do properly pick up adds and sacrifice a lot of dmg (statue doesnt aggro adds fast enough)
we lack a lot in dmg specialy aoe dmg (my tank budy keeps yelling at me cause he got all the adds specialy on trash)
ineffektivity of PB i personaly am clearing when i got roughly 10 seconds on ISB left and got 100%/near 100% stagger these 2 have to be active or else PB is just not worth it in my opinion
a lot very bad Artefact traits stuff like the double firebreath is just not even remotly worth taking when there are normal traits that just suck less or brewastache that got about a 1% uptime which is still at least a very small defensive value even when the other tanks traits are just flat out better in alot of aspects
i hope i got everything tell me when there is something else that realy annoys you :3

all grammar errors are build in just to make you smile !

[Tuskchi]

I don't understand where you get that answer from tbh. I'm level 108 and I absolutely destroy everyone on Cleave, AoE and ST is 50/50. I know a few top tier WW Monks who carry their raids on several bosses also..

WW seems great to me. I can't wait to hit 110 and gear it up... I do miss my Rogues playstyle however, Windwalker looks great. Mobile, has AoE AND ST (which is rare, most classes are either great ST or great AoE)

Yeah, nice story bro ... I was destroying 110 mages in dungeons while I was level 102 ... Get max level, get equal gear, we will talk again ...

[Yhcti]

Yeah, nice story bro ... I was destroying 110 mages in dungeons while I was level 102 ... Get max level, get equal gear, we will talk again ...

Sure, I mean I watch several streams of guys farming Mythic+.. Verdisha, Rikh & Fragnance and the WW Monk is always top. Very rarely do they ever lose. And these guys run with Mages, Rogues, DK, DH etc... I dunno. I guess each to their own.

[Deleted]

Sure, I mean I watch several streams of guys farming Mythic+.. Verdisha, Rikh & Fragnance and the WW Monk is always top. Very rarely do they ever lose. And these guys run with Mages, Rogues, DK, DH etc... I dunno. I guess each to their own.

I can't really say much about raids from personal experience. But it seems all the top guilds were benching their WWs for the entirety of mythic progress. Sidenote: Not all kills are logged with 20 people on WoWprogress, so this may be inaccurate until the last few people are added in the lists.
Though I only looked through the top 3, further down there usually is still more variance. To me it seems WW is viable for more or less anything. But if one really wants to nitpick about the last few %, it doesn't seem to be at the same level of other classes/specs for raids.

[LoKSET]

95th percentile
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#dataset=95
Just sayin...