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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    Right? I happen to think I'm quite good at the game, actually.

    I just don't have nine friends.

    That's the one thing these "LOL JUST RAID SCRUB" lot don't seem to get. Just because I have enough friends to fill up a Mythic+ run doesn't mean I have enough friends to fill a raid.
    And I want to play with friends. Not some squad of complete strangers.
    I was being sarcastic, as my last comment suggest.

    LFR has a place. It used to have a nice place in MoP. But some people wanted it removed, changed, reduced etc. Even though its present doesn't change the game for them. Just their ego.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by xzeve View Post
    LFR is tourist mode. You get an idea of what bosses are like, you get a little souvenir if you are lucky. And that is it.
    See? More example.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    Good. It now provides a reward commensurate with the effort going into it; zero.
    I haven't done LFR yet but I find it hard to imagine that it's too different from the lootpinatas we call "world bosses". So I guess they should scrap their gear drops aswell?

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Zmago View Post
    What is wrong with providing an in-game service in exchange for ingame-currency?
    The in-game service shouldn't be needed. At least, not for Balance of Power specifically.

    It's the first time since LFR's inclusion that we've been given a quest to go into raids that can't be done in LFR - albeit slowly. The first time. And it was so blatantly last-second... it was doable in LFR for all of the Beta, the quest log doesn't indicate a required difficulty, the "breaking news" on Blizz's own website only went up AFTER LFR opened up...
    And worse than all that... there's five-man content gated behind ten-man content. Sure you can work your ass off with your friends, getting to Mythic15 or doing Glory of the Legion Hero... but you don't get jack-squat for it because you just don't have enough people in your group to do the part that Blizzard just arbitrarily and suddenly decided you can't do in smaller guilds.
    Their justification of "We want to reward dedicated, organized play" is also total bullshit; Mythic15 requires WAY more dedication and organization than just buying Emerald Nightmare clears.
    And beyond even that, there's a skin for killing world bosses... you don't even NEED to be in a group to unlock that skin. Buuut you aren't gonna get it because, again, you have few friends and you step outside the Auction House now and then.


    LFRs have been made more pointless now than ever. And I don't mean the old "Oh but it's to see the story" thing... we have Youtube. People have never done LFR for the content (and more on that in a moment)
    People did LFR for gear. Admittedly bad gear, but the best they could get without full-time raiding. World Quests have rendered that moot.
    People did LFR quests... legendary rings and cloaks and the like. And that's not even possible right now, because the raiders aren't content with just their improved stats and their unique mounts and their better transmogs and their pets and achievements and trinkets... now they need to have their own Artifact skin as well. And not just a recolour, but an ENTIRE line of colours.
    Hell, people compare the Raid skin to the PvP skin, but you can still obtain the PvP skin through random matchmaking. The third Artifact row is inexplicably the only one that you can't get on your own or with the matchmaker.

    ... Honestly I'd be totally fine with that if the other colours (Unleashed Monstrosities and such) could be obtained without doing Balance of Power. I don't understand that restriction... "You gotta do 10man stuff to get the rewards from 5man or solo stuff!" Shouldn't it be the reverse?


    And finally... the "Oh but LFR is just so you can see the lore and the story and the content!" Okay... right.
    So why can't I see the lore and story and content pertaining to unlocking the 'true potential' of the Artifact Weapon? That seems like exactly what LFR was made for... so I could see the story and the quests without being in a raiding guild.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    If you don't want to spend four bajillion gold on an achievement, you are entirely free not to.

    If Blizzard didn't want to bugger their economy, they had every opportunity to not bugger their economy. Punishing players for Blizzard's incompetence would be utterly retarded.
    I'm not talking about punishing players. I'm talking about letting players use LFR for exactly what it was originally made - letting them experience the story/content/quests without making them seek out raid guilds or buy runs.

    Giving people the start of a story and then going "Nah you can't finish this story", when there's a system in place specifically for letting people finish the story... I just don't get it.
    Was there really that much demand for full-time raiders to have even MORE unique cosmetic rewards?

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by ophion1990 View Post
    I haven't done LFR yet but I find it hard to imagine that it's too different from the lootpinatas we call "world bosses". So I guess they should scrap their gear drops aswell?
    Or cracking nuts and picking up squirrels for BIS relics.

    The difference is that inside an LFR instance, you are isolated from the world. When you're fighting a world boss or doing a world quest, you're out in the world, interacting with the other faction, dynamically building groups rather than building automated groups. Instead of queuing and waiting, you just go to the worldboss/worldquest. If the game's going to have babymode content, put it in the open world.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    I'm not talking about punishing players.
    Then why would you suggest limiting their economic activities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    Giving people the start of a story and then going "Nah you can't finish this story", when there's a system in place specifically for letting people finish the story... I just don't get it.
    Which they've already said they'll be using for some of the quests. Some quests you'll need to go into big boy raids, some you can do in LFR.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    Was there really that much demand for full-time raiders to have even MORE unique cosmetic rewards?
    Quite a bit, considering weapons no longer drop from raids, which consumed a pretty significant portion of loot tables pre-legion. They're not even unique skins as they were in the past; you can get them from clearing m15 and Glory of the Legion Hero, unless you're utterly dead set on that color.
    Last edited by LilSaihah; 2016-09-30 at 12:44 PM.
    If you are particularly bold, you could use a Shiny Ditto. Do keep in mind though, this will infuriate your opponents due to Ditto's beauty. Please do not use Shiny Ditto. You have been warned.

  5. #205
    Good, picking up 10 piles of moose dung in stormheim is probably more challenging than LFR, so it's about right that it offers better gear. I've never liked LFR, I don't actually care what gear it drops at this point though but asking for it to drop better gear is just irritating; World quests rarely give me gear either, usually it's an 830 piece that I do just in case, in that 1/1000 chance, it upgrades like 20 item levels. I only really do world quests for gold and sometimes order resources, if you need gear from world quests then LFR is probably a good source of gear anyway.

    For the record, I was on holiday for the release of EN and mythics + and didn't get on until the Tuesday after at about 5pm. I had one solid session that night where I created the raid and cleared it. There is no reason that a casual player can't do normal, I literally googled some tactics on my phone, made a group with a few friends (3) and pugs, and went and cleared it in 5ish hours. Hell, once you get 'rift of aln' you can just join other peoples groups as it's worth more than ilvl to a lot of people.

    I understand that a 5 hour play session may seem a bit unrealistic to a lot of people, and I get that as well, but you could still easily just make 2-3 raids over the course of the week. Easily.
    Last edited by DechCJC; 2016-09-30 at 12:53 PM.

  6. #206
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    The in-game service shouldn't be needed. At least, not for Balance of Power specifically.
    It really is not. The raid itself is not hard.

    And even if it is; come the next patch/tier you will be able to zerg it down with randoms. So yes, even if by some weird way you are not competent enough to do EN now (2 weeks after it was released), you should be able to complete it within some months without any trouble.
    Remember how hard HM normal was in baleful gear?

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    Then why would you suggest limiting their economic activities?
    I'm just saying that restricting quests to normal+ is only encouraging a problem that Blizz has actively expressed interest in trying to combat - gold bloat.

    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    Which they've already said they'll be using for some of the quests. Some quests you'll need to go into big boy raids, some you can do in LFR.
    They only said that after they quietly added the restriction and pushed it out the door.
    And that doesn't change the fact that LFR's entire purpose in the first place is letting the non-raiders "experience the story". Well, now there's an entire storyline I can't experience in the mode that was made just for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    Quite a bit, considering weapons no longer drop from raids, which consumed a pretty significant portion of loot tables pre-legion.
    Then give them unique colour pallets for various skins. Don't lock an ENTIRE row of models (one of which can be obtained by any braindead gibbon running around on his own tapping world bosses) behind content that isn't even all that challenging.
    It's not a matter of difficulty, it's a matter of numbers. You can't get rewards for doing the super hard content (Mythic15+) because you don't have enough friends to faceroll your way to victory in Emerald Nightmare on normal? That's ass-backwards.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zmago View Post
    It really is not. The raid itself is not hard.

    And even if it is; come the next patch/tier you will be able to zerg it down with randoms. So yes, even if by some weird way you are not competent enough to do EN now (2 weeks after it was released), you should be able to complete it within some months without any trouble.
    Remember how hard HM normal was in baleful gear?
    I never once said Emerald Nightmare is hard.

    It's not, it's a piss-up. I just don't have enough friends to do it. I can fill a Keystone team; but I can't five-man a dang raid.

  8. #208
    LFR is only for 9 year olds whos parents wont let them into their raid so they can still feel like they killed bosses. so unless youre 9, why are you in LFR?
    The most trusted and reliable mainstream republican website: http://Dailystormer.com

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    It's not a matter of difficulty, it's a matter of numbers. You can't get rewards for doing the super hard content (Mythic15+) because you don't have enough friends to faceroll your way to victory in Emerald Nightmare on normal? That's ass-backwards.
    To the best of my knowledge, right-side skins are not limited by whether you have left-side skins.
    If you are particularly bold, you could use a Shiny Ditto. Do keep in mind though, this will infuriate your opponents due to Ditto's beauty. Please do not use Shiny Ditto. You have been warned.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    To the best of my knowledge, right-side skins are not limited by whether you have left-side skins.
    If that's true, then fuck me and everything I've said since I got here. And I would really like for it to be true.

    But everything I've heard claims otherwise; that you can't unlock the alternate colours for a weapon skin unless you've already earned the left-most version of that skin.
    Again, I'd love to be wrong about that.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by PuppetShowJustice View Post
    What exactly is the point of LFR right now for someone who does higher raid difficulties? Do LFR bosses drop a decent amount of AP? Can I just safely ignore LFR completely and basically not be missing anything?
    Augment Runes, like 1K AP per boss (if it drops) atm and selling gear you don't need to people from your server

  12. #212
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Motorman View Post
    Blizzard seems to be caving in to their own need for more money via token sales and it seems that the money is so good that they are willing to let the atrocity of boost sales and boost exchanges for keystones to continue.

    Then 1 year later blizzard will question itself "why didnt our best expansion deliver as we expected it would" and they will still evade the answer "because we put a dick in every sense of community once existed".

    The expansion itself is fantastic. Letting it be diminished into yet another boostfest and so early (not even a full month) into it is a problem that should be addressed right away.

    They should kill boosting in every way possible. Good for their pockets and good for the longevity of the ga,e.
    How exactly would a bann on boosting help things?

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by kinneer View Post
    MoP had LFR which had a certain challenge. Wipe could happen and. Tier gears dropped. Trinklet dropped.

    Then some people complained. LFR gear were too good. Even though it was still inferior to Normal raid. Trinklet were too good. People felt compelled to run LFR as mandatory to supplement their weekly gear loot drop fix. People complained about wiping in LFR. How unorganized it was. About Durumu the raid killer etc.

    What was once, in my opinion, a good starting position to start introducing LFR and make slight adjustment to it, either adjust the rewards, the difficult etc. Instead it was chopped, quartered, diced into a form no one now likes.

    LFR in MoP was in my opinion a good start. A few refinements were needed. Instead. Blizzard listened and changed it.

    So Blizzard changed it because enough people made a loud enough noise for them to change it. The change was, in my, opinion, heavily influenced by the players.
    I see your point. I only played MoP for the first month, so the only experience I had with it was WoD. Hopefully it has a little challenge.. what I saw in WoD was people flat out AFK while standing in fire, while like 4-5 people actually kill the boss. Maybe this is just my bad experience, I don't know. It appears to me though, that the core difference is that 5 man dungeon content (Mythic and Mythic +) surpasses LFR gear wise. This is a way for the developers to keep 5 man content relevant.. but I do see how it will drive people away from LFR. People may do LFR 1-2 times to see it, and maybe get the gear for transmog... but after that it would be done. I personally do not have an issue with this.. however, that is just me and all I can do is share my opinion.

  14. #214
    Guess it's one step on the road to removing that abomination.

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    To the best of my knowledge, right-side skins are not limited by whether you have left-side skins.
    I would very much love a confirmation about this. I can kill all the World bosses, I can get Glory of the Legion Hero... But I have almost no interest in the Emerald Nightmare Raid (normal +).

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixxy Scratch View Post
    If that's true, then fuck me and everything I've said since I got here. And I would really like for it to be true.

    But everything I've heard claims otherwise; that you can't unlock the alternate colours for a weapon skin unless you've already earned the left-most version of that skin.
    Again, I'd love to be wrong about that.
    Quote Originally Posted by A Chozo View Post
    I would very much love a confirmation about this. I can kill all the World bosses, I can get Glory of the Legion Hero... But I have almost no interest in the Emerald Nightmare Raid (normal +).
    I don't have confirmation on it but I would be extremely surprised if it were the case. There is no particularly good reason for these skins to be locked behind the first; this is especially the case for the M15 weapon as it would likely be explicitly implemented for players pushing M15 and not raiders.

    Rumors to the contrary are likely a conflation of practically always getting the leftmost skin first (base weapon, upgraded weapon) or of the weapons being in sequence and actually being impossible to unlock without earning prior versions (PvP, hidden). However, that doesn't speak to any hard-coded rule.
    If you are particularly bold, you could use a Shiny Ditto. Do keep in mind though, this will infuriate your opponents due to Ditto's beauty. Please do not use Shiny Ditto. You have been warned.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    I don't have confirmation on it but I would be extremely surprised if it were the case. There is no particularly good reason for these skins to be locked behind the first; this is especially the case for the M15 weapon as it would likely be explicitly implemented for players pushing M15 and not raiders.

    Rumors to the contrary are likely a conflation of practically always getting the leftmost skin first (base weapon, upgraded weapon) or of the weapons being in sequence and actually being impossible to unlock without earning prior versions (PvP, hidden). However, that doesn't speak to any hard-coded rule.
    Fingers crossed, then. I'll open a ticket and ask, but I dunno how reliable an answer I'll get - the GM's are bloody useless these days. Just reply with copy-pastes from WoWhead.

  18. #218
    LFR is killing guilds left and right it is too successful, blizzard could have immediately put an end on the complain of feeling forced to do it by implementing a shared lockout with the other difficulties, but that would have only pushed more peoples outside organized raiding.

    Peoples hate lfr because it absorb the vast majority of new players and left very few interested of entering a guild or wasting time doing pug; blizzard cannot flat out remove it so they are doing this gradually, first they purged any cosmetic reward from it, then made the gear it drop redundant and even trivial, this xpack they are trying to make non automatic matchmaking dungeons using karazhan as a bait and i'm sure that if not in legion next xpack we will see a raid without it's lfr version.
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Obviously this issue doesn't affect me however unlike some raiders I don't see the point in taking satisfaction in this injustice, it's wrong, just because it doesn't hurt me doesn't stop it being wrong, the player base should stand together when Blizzard do stupid shit like this not laugh at the ones being victimised.

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by SkagenRora View Post
    Why not save those for if you ever do normal/heroic or mythic+? Seems like a waste on LFR
    Mostly because I don't do normal, heroic, or mythic+

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSaihah View Post
    I don't have confirmation on it but I would be extremely surprised if it were the case. There is no particularly good reason for these skins to be locked behind the first; this is especially the case for the M15 weapon as it would likely be explicitly implemented for players pushing M15 and not raiders.

    Rumors to the contrary are likely a conflation of practically always getting the leftmost skin first (base weapon, upgraded weapon) or of the weapons being in sequence and actually being impossible to unlock without earning prior versions (PvP, hidden). However, that doesn't speak to any hard-coded rule.
    the first skin unlock the appearance the others only the color, the entire row is supposed to be a gift for organized raiding culminating with the legion hero achievement.
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Obviously this issue doesn't affect me however unlike some raiders I don't see the point in taking satisfaction in this injustice, it's wrong, just because it doesn't hurt me doesn't stop it being wrong, the player base should stand together when Blizzard do stupid shit like this not laugh at the ones being victimised.

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