Sub for mythics+?

[Deleted]

Heyo,

I've been playing Outlaw this entire expansion but I plan on swapping to sub soon, currently lvl 19 in traits.

My goal is mainly to progress in mythics+, but it feels lackluster cleaving as sub at this point, compared to Outlaw, however single target seems like it would be fine in a few trait-levels.

Do you guys think sub is comparable to Outlaw in dungeons, or is it not an option if you want to progress in mythics+? :E

Btw, I don't have shadow nova yet, which probably would help a lot too.

[Kalador]

Heyo,

I've been playing Outlaw this entire expansion but I plan on swapping to sub soon, currently lvl 19 in traits.

My goal is mainly to progress in mythics+, but it feels lackluster cleaving as sub at this point, compared to Outlaw, however single target seems like it would be fine in a few trait-levels.

Do you guys think sub is comparable to Outlaw in dungeons, or is it not an option if you want to progress in mythics+? :E

Btw, I don't have shadow nova yet, which probably would help a lot too.

I think both outlaw and sub can progress in mythic+, for pure cleave outlaw will probably be on top, MfD + BF + RT is very very strong in M+. Rolling TB is also somthing that should not be underestimated in mythic plus as you can get a lot of reduction on major cd with MFD reset and have AR for many trash pull. Sub as good cleave on longer trash especialy on 3-4 target sweet spots, it's also very strong on boss and prio target. both have a role to play, if your group need pure AoE and Cleave dps i think outlaw is probably better, if you need a bit more prio target/boss dps than sub might be stronger.

You also need more AP in sub than in outlaw for max dmg, outlaw is fine with 18 points where sub need almost full artefact to show true power on AoE.

[Deleted]

I think both outlaw and sub can progress in mythic+, for pure cleave outlaw will probably be on top, MfD + BF + RT is very very strong in M+. Rolling TB is also somthing that should not be underestimated in mythic plus as you can get a lot of reduction on major cd with MFD reset and have AR for many trash pull. Sub as good cleave on longer trash especialy on 3-4 target sweet spots, it's also very strong on boss and prio target. both have a role to play, if your group need pure AoE and Cleave dps i think outlaw is probably better, if you need a bit more prio target/boss dps than sub might be stronger.

You also need more AP in sub than in outlaw for max dmg, outlaw is fine with 18 points where sub need almost full artefact to show true power on AoE.

How would you play Sub in a dungeon?

I was thinking Shadow Dance -> Shuriken Storm -> Nightblade 2-3 targets -> Shuriken Storm -> Eviscorate single target?

[philefluxx]

Outlaw is probably going to be easier to score high on AoE trash, but Sub can still do pretty well if you work for it.

I dont have Shadow Nova yet so I mainly SD+ShurikenStorm+NB combo on all targets and then start Shuriken+Evisc spam once all targets are dotted with NB. I am a casual player though so my philosophy is always that as long as I'm in the top 3 on damage meters and adds are going down fast enough that healers aren't stressing out and we are not running out of timers Im pretty happy with the performance.

[Kalador]

How would you play Sub in a dungeon?

I was thinking Shadow Dance -> Shuriken Storm -> Nightblade 2-3 targets -> Shuriken Storm -> Eviscorate single target?

Yeah its prty much as many NB on target with 10sec + to live, build with shuriken storm on 3 target + in ShD and 2 target + outside of shadow dance, you can use 4 cp finisher on 3-4 target packs.

[lolpve]

Sub AoE is fine. Outlaw AoE is better in situations where a huge pack will die quickly, sub is better aoe with medium size packs that take longer to kill, and it's very good against bosses that spawn adds like Hatecoil or Ymiron since it increases the ST damage against the boss whereas outlaw loses ST in order to aoe.

[synthetikv]

Anecdotal, I'm sure. But currently 19 points in sub - 18 points in outlaw. Have been playing both specs for years, although have preferred sub for the last few years. With the changes to outlaw even more so now.

In the same gear I'm doing better on trash packs and bosses in sub across the board. So yeah I'd say sub is viable in mythic+

[Ihazpaws]

I really wanna change to sub since I do pvp alot and I really don't like how Roll the Bones works. Getting same shitty attack speed buff or energy regen buff 2-6 times in row just makes it so damn useless skill, specially in pvp. But I am just bit scared that Sub won't be that good in dungeons and investing into the it could be waste in that case.

[lolpve]

I really wanna change to sub since I do pvp alot and I really don't like how Roll the Bones works. Getting same shitty attack speed buff or energy regen buff 2-6 times in row just makes it so damn useless skill, specially in pvp. But I am just bit scared that Sub won't be that good in dungeons and investing into the it could be waste in that case.

It's very good in dungeons, possibly the best spec of the 3 currently since sub's ST "burst" is way more reliable than outlaw and it can keep up on AoE situation-dependent. We just don't see many sub rogues with 24+ traits and brains.

[Ihazpaws]

It's very good in dungeons, possibly the best spec of the 3 currently since sub's ST "burst" is way more reliable than outlaw and it can keep up on AoE situation-dependent. We just don't see many sub rogues with 24+ traits and brains.

Tested Sub yesterday. It feels much more reliable and stable since there is no need for super luck to be able to do the best dps. I have shitty relics and pretty much 0 ap spend in the daggers but was able to keep somewhat similar dps in singletarget fights as I do with Outlaw (about 20-40k dps difference, but that is because of how random Outlaws dmg is). Aoe was several hundred thousand less but I really don't care for high aoe dps in random trash pulls, WW's and DH's can handle that and wave their ego on the others faces until they lose horribly in boss fights

[Celfydd]

Another advantage of sub in mythic+ is that the healer doesn't have to do as much patch healing and (depending on the specs of the other damage dealers) can potentially have some free time to do some damage of their own.

[Valentyn]

I tried it myself, but Sub is well behind my Outlaw spec. Mostly because my Outlaw has legendary Boots, and the Chrono Shard set as well, so the extra speed is a direct DPS increase.

I have to work my butt off with Sub and I do about half the AoE of my Outlaw spec, never mind if I happen to roll 3 or 6 rolls.

I'm sure it could work, and do so well, it's just my Outlaw not only out gears Sub significantly thanks to the legendary; even I doubt Sub will compete when there are over 5+ trash packs at a time; unless you horrible rolls on Outlaw.

Gouge is also fantastic at level 8+ Mythics, some you need a lot of CC in some dungeons. especially with certain modifiers. Halls of Valor with teeming last week was a mess after the first boss, as the big trash pack had 2 Runecarvers, and 2 Mystics, along with the Thundercallers and Champions.