Legion - Subtlety discussion

[Deleted]

With cheaper shadowstrikes + artifact talent I dont basically use any energy during shadow dances. This happens during lust+shadow blades: because ill pool 2 SD charges for nuke, and all extra energy is useless since im not backstabbing to maximise nuke, energy use is 0. Using deeper stratagem seems to remove this overflow. Is there any site discussing relics and legendaries? There ses to be 0 guides in this topic

Can you post your artifact tree?

[Deleted]

Can you post your artifact tree?

http://www.wowhead.com/artifact-calc...NeATYQE2IBVFAQ

If link doesnt work basically to shadow nova and then to improved evis/nigthbalde and after to last gold trait (didnt look guides, just, did quick math that this was fastest way to get all 3 gold traits).

[Deleted]

http://www.wowhead.com/artifact-calc...NeATYQE2IBVFAQ

If link doesnt work basically to shadow nova and then to improved evis/nigthbalde and after to last gold trait (didnt look guides, just, did quick math that this was fastest way to get all 3 gold traits).

Really hard to tell with your chosen tree if Vigor is better than Deeper Stratagem. Choose Deeper Stratagem if you dont have energy problems as you said, but choosing Vigor AFTER getting Akkari Soul has merit since it dramatically improves your ShadowStrike.

[Soisoisoi]

With cheaper shadowstrikes + artifact talent I dont basically use any energy during shadow dances. This happens during lust+shadow blades: because ill pool 2 SD charges for nuke, and all extra energy is useless since im not backstabbing to maximise nuke, energy use is 0. Using deeper stratagem seems to remove this overflow. Is there any site discussing relics and legendaries? There ses to be 0 guides in this topic

You could always sim it. AMR has batch simulations for finding how much DPS gain/loss each relic will give you; last I checked, Demon's kiss (AKA Nightblade+5%) x3 was the best. You can also do a batch for talents. Shouldn't be too hard.

[madmossy]

Energy regen seems to be a massive issue, even with energetic stabbing im constantly waiting for it to regen just to get off one back stab or to do my next shadow strike.

Slows the whole thing down substantially.

[Kurtwood]

I try simming my sub spec with recommended talents and same gear as outlaw. I sim 70K DPS lower with sub than with outlaw. Why? My weapon is a bit behind, but when fetching a link from the artifact calculator at WoWhead, with 3 more ranks AND better relics, I still sim 65K lower? Any ideas what I am doing wrong with the sims?

Character Gankstab@Defias Brotherhood

[Soisoisoi]

I try simming my sub spec with recommended talents and same gear as outlaw. I sim 70K DPS lower with sub than with outlaw. Why? My weapon is a bit behind, but when fetching a link from the artifact calculator at WoWhead, with 3 more ranks AND better relics, I still sim 65K lower? Any ideas what I am doing wrong with the sims?

Character Gankstab@Defias Brotherhood

Using Outlaw gear is likely a large part of it. Sub focuses on Mastery>Versa>Crit, Outlaw Versa>Crit>Mastery (roughly).

[Snorlaxi]

Using Outlaw gear is likely a large part of it. Sub focuses on Mastery>Versa>Crit, Outlaw Versa>Crit>Mastery (roughly).

Should sub enchant, gem and food for mastery as general rule? Icy veins still says to just go full versatility.

[Celfydd]

Should sub enchant, gem and food for mastery as general rule? Icy veins still says to just go full versatility.

Versatility and mastery have basically exactly the same weighting for sub.

[Deleted]

Versatility and mastery have basically exactly the same weighting for sub.

Depends on the individual gear. My current stat weights are: Mastery 7.41, Versa 6.73
So i'm going better with mastery food ;-)

[Soisoisoi]

Should sub enchant, gem and food for mastery as general rule? Icy veins still says to just go full versatility.

You're always best off simming it, but for me, Mastery is higher than Versa, and has been for a while (even with Mastery-everything gear).

[Deleted]

You're always best off simming it, but for me, Mastery is higher than Versa, and has been for a while (even with Mastery-everything gear).

Can anybody tell me what the best way to sim your character is?

I've tried exporting my profile using the in-game addon, as well as importing my character directly from armory. These two seem to differ by a lot, since the armory-profile seems to include a lot of actions, while the in-game addon only exports gear, traits etc?

Which one is the correct one to follow?

[Snorlaxi]

Is there a reliable way to hit x4 shadowstrike in one shadowdance when running deeper stratagem?

I find that even if I let my energy pool sit at a 100 before activating shadowdance, it still seems to be entirely rng based if I will be able to do x2 shadowstrike > evisc > x2 shadowstrike before shadowdance expires. Not to mention if I have to refresh symbols then it all goes to crap.

Can anybody tell me what the best way to sim your character is?

I've tried exporting my profile using the in-game addon, as well as importing my character directly from armory. These two seem to differ by a lot, since the armory-profile seems to include a lot of actions, while the in-game addon only exports gear, traits etc?

Which one is the correct one to follow?

I hear mr.robot is good enough.

[Deleted]

Is finally the worst gold trait? Cause fml I went for that first

[shaunika123]

Is there a reliable way to hit x4 shadowstrike in one shadowdance when running deeper stratagem?

I find that even if I let my energy pool sit at a 100 before activating shadowdance, it still seems to be entirely rng based if I will be able to do x2 shadowstrike > evisc > x2 shadowstrike before shadowdance expires. Not to mention if I have to refresh symbols then it all goes to crap.


I hear mr.robot is good enough.

try to use vanish/sprint to refresh symbols

if you're bloodelf you can just use arcane torrent when energetic stabbing doesnt proc

or get the necklace from arcway, the extra 5% energy is just enough if you have around 10% haste

or be gnome

[Snorlaxi]

try to use vanish/sprint to refresh symbols

if you're bloodelf you can just use arcane torrent when energetic stabbing doesnt proc

I'm already doing both these things. It just bothers me that I have to rely on a 1.5m cd racial or RNG to be able to nail x4 shadowstrike.

I'm looking at some logs and top sub rogues get x4 every time, even the ones without the energy regen legendary. I feel like I'm missing something, but I have no idea what since even if I purposely cap energy, it STILL seems to come out based on RNG.

[Deleted]

I'm already doing both these things. It just bothers me that I have to rely on a 1.5m cd racial or RNG to be able to nail x4 shadowstrike.

I'm looking at some logs and top sub rogues get x4 every time, even the ones without the energy regen legendary. I feel like I'm missing something, but I have no idea what since even if I purposely cap energy, it STILL seems to come out based on RNG.

Dunno... I'm pooling energy till 65-70 before casting shadow dance. This way I'm able to use 4x shadowstrike incl. 1x finisher

€: with refreshing symbol I do 2x shadowstrike, 1x finisher, 1x shadowstrike, 1x symbol

[shaunika123]

Dunno... I'm pooling energy till 65-70 before casting shadow dance. This way I'm able to use 4x shadowstrike incl. 1x finisher

if none of your strikes proc stabbing you wont have enough energy unless you have a lot of haste

most of the time you do but like 1 out of 10 it doesnt proc

[Deleted]

if none of your strikes proc stabbing you wont have enough energy unless you have a lot of haste

most of the time you do but like 1 out of 10 it doesnt proc

9% haste atm. I'm doing 4x shadowstrike every single time if I dont fail and use shadow dance before 70 energy

[shaunika123]

9% haste atm. I'm doing 4x shadowstrike every single time if I dont fail and use shadow dance before 70 energy

dunno ive been hitting the dummy for like 7 minutes and it does happen when i get no stabbing procs

and i got 12% haste