[Guardian] 7.2.5 Legion Guardian Guide by Pumps

[Pumpsm8]

A question about the suggested neck enchants? Both Icy Veins and AskMrRobot suggests Mark of Heavy Hide while Pumps suggest Mark of the Claw? What do I fail to see here, I suck at theorycrafting so this no1 suprises me.

good spot, something i changed in the google doc but forgot to update here.

Currently Mark of the Heavy Hide defensively and Mark of the Hidden Satyr Offensively.
Also Changed Potion of the Old War > Deadly Grace.

If anyone is keen for some Guardian PoV in EN now that prog is over for us, i'll be posting all my videos for Mythic EN today/tomorrow, Australian upload speed is the worst.

[Dreyen]

How amazing is the darkmoon card? Using two vers trinkets and the RNG proc scares me

Really amazing. The extra armor works with ironfur so it's like double value for bears.

[spda242]

good spot, something i changed in the google doc but forgot to update here.

Currently Mark of the Heavy Hide defensively and Mark of the Hidden Satyr Offensively.
Also Changed Potion of the Old War > Deadly Grace.

If anyone is keen for some Guardian PoV in EN now that prog is over for us, i'll be posting all my videos for Mythic EN today/tomorrow, Australian upload speed is the worst.

Ahh, I understand
Will watch the uploads, never could resist some furry action

[roflwaffle]

did they hotfix the size of lunar beam? seems massive

[Seditian]

did they hotfix the size of lunar beam? seems massive

Any chance you accidentally picked Balance Affinity? Because the 5 yards range also increases Lunar Beam's radius.

[roflwaffle]

Any chance you accidentally picked Balance Affinity? Because the 5 yards range also increases Lunar Beam's radius.

ohhhhh, yeah thats it lol

[Deleted]

I've been playing balance for as long as I can remember and recently picked Guardian as my off spec, mainly for normal mythics. I would appreciate if you guys could share some info on how the bear is doing in the +5 and above mythics. Are guardian as a whole, a desirable tank or are we disregarded like balance is in pugs?

[Selerian]

Is earthwarden good for ursoc?

[Bearygood]

So what dictactes when an item with not top stats but higher ilvl is better than a lower ilvl item with best stats?

Have an 850 belt with vers/mastery but got an 865 belt in mythic plus with crit/mastery

[Nevcairiel]

So what dictactes when an item with not top stats but higher ilvl is better than a lower ilvl item with best stats?

Have an 850 belt with vers/mastery but got an 865 belt in mythic plus with crit/mastery

15 ilvl is plenty to take the other belt, I would generally take them as of 10 ilvl, maybe with 5 if at least one of the stats is ok and the one with higher value.

[Deleted]

anyone have stat weights? its not in OP and im not going to read through 20 pages. Thanks.

[videnfost]

anyone have stat weights? its not in OP and im not going to read through 20 pages. Thanks.

Your stat weights will vary wildly depending on your current gear level and secondary stats available to you. However, at 872 ilevel with Grotesque Statuette and Darkmoon Deck: Immortality, I've been following the weights SimC spit out at me for TMI and I'm happy with the result:

Armor: 12.47
Stam: 1.69
Vers: 0.74
Mastery: 0.70
Leech: 0.51
Haste: 0.47
Crit: 0.28
Agility: 0.19

Bear in mind this is skewed a bit due SimC being unreliable, as well as most of my gear being picked for ilevel so the stat choices aren't ideal. I'm currently sitting at 7824 Mastery, 4300 Crit, 4045 Haste, 3617 Vers and would obviously prefer Vers if it was an option. Still, the higher ilevel for armor and stamina usually wins. As you get more gear with Vers on it, the value of Mastery will drop in comparison.

[Deleted]

I have serious threat problems in Emeral Nightmare, and i wonder what do you think about. Does the game changed, am i doing something very wrong, or something is unbalanced.
I have an 851 item level bear, focusing more on survival gear than dps, but my items are mixed as i found them, usually mastery+something. I am using relics for defense. My co-tank is a demon hunter. The DH is similar item level as me. However, at Nythendra heroic his damage taken is +40%, and at Ursoc heroic he usually dies with 4 armor debuffs, while i have no problems with 5.

At Ursoc heroic every time when i am not in range, i auto-lose the aggro. When Ursoc charge away, on the charge endpoint he pick up the DH as target, even if he went away from me. If i am tanking when have to pull out from the purple stuff, and i begin to move out, the boss often just stay there and keep attacking the DH instead coming out.
At the Emerald Dragons normal the dragon change is a pain. A simple taunt is not enough, i have to go there hit a mangle into it, and then carry back. Otherwise they turn back on half way.
At Cenarius normal if i tank the adds, it's pretty difficult to pick them up, as soon as they spawn, their target is the DH, and if they arrive, no way i can get them down. Even if the DH doesn't hit them. In the previous 10 years the new adds always headed to our druid healer. Now they go to the DH.
At Renferal normal is same. When the small spiders spawns, it's pretty difficult to pick them up and tank them away from the boss (and the DH).

I am tanking with bear 10 years ago, and i can solve this situations, i know the workarounds: to taunt nonstop at Ursoc, and change role at the other two bosses. But i feel this not right. There is a reason why i pick up the adds, and why the co-tank doin' the static tanking. There is something wrong with the DH tanks? I feel not right his threat and damage taken is much higher (the damage done is same).


I am not sure we can help on this situation, other than obey of the situation and the new class, but i have so much frustration, i had to share, i wonder if others experience the same.

[Nevcairiel]

I co-tank with a DH as well, and a simple answer for the add problem is of course to let the DH tank the adds. Their healing aggro is much better suited to grab freshly spawned adds anyway. No matter how much threat our abilities do, we would still have to walk there and hit them with something, or moonfire them one-by-one.

The DH will keep healing himself and thus he'll have initial threat on new adds, and unless you can get a thrash on them, they'll walk to the DH.
Healing tanks have always had this "advantage" for adds. Use it. On top of that DH tanks are by far the most mobile tanks, which plays well with tanking adds.

I didn't have any single-target threat problems against him however, and dragon switch is usually taunt and moonfire, and mangle as soon as he gets in range.

Damage taken being higher is normal, since its a self-healing tank. They take more damage, but heal some of it away themself.

[Ausr]

They do kinda need to do something about threat. Little bullshit when I work on a mob for like a minute and a paladin or DH can come by and instantly snap it from me ( I have an addon that warns about taunts and it doesn't proc when this happens). I dunno. Either increase our threat gen or maybe have Moonfire have threat in bear form?

[Sar-]

I'm 848 atm, and haven't had any threat issues with similarly geared co-tanks (Warrior & DH).

I'll normally out-dps them as well.

[Selerian]

There is a threat issue of which you can work around though with some proper communication with your co-tank. It's not game breaking but surely annoying af.

[Dreyen]

The only time i tanked with a DH they did take threat from me pretty easily. You have to understand the class has a lot of burst cleave damage when a pull starts and it takes awhile to catchup... if ever if dps is equal between both of you.

Also, you said "taunt nonstop on ursoc" but thats how the fight works? Due to mechanics you almost taunt on CD. You said you lost threat when ursoc charged away but when ursoc charges theres a taunt swap that needs to be done right there...

Best i can say is read every guide and make sure you are doing your dps rotation optimally. Also it's impossible for the DH to "not hit" adds becuase all except 1 button of their rotaton is aoe. Just go stand in the middle and moonfire the mobs repeatedly until they get in your range: if the DH is getting threat on them while they spawn across the room it means you absolutely did nothing before they reached him, or hes getting misdirected...

[Bearygood]

So I tried the spider boss today on heroic. Does web of pain count as magical or physical damage. Seemed to hurt quite hard when I was grabbing adds around the place.

Is a third tank required for this or is there something that can be done?

[Valkon]

Keep in mind that DH generate a lot of healing aggro. Guardian FR generates 0 threat, which can be a frustrating aggro problem when two classes have similar DPS but one has additional threat on their heals.

- - - Updated - - -

So I tried the spider boss today on heroic. Does web of pain count as magical or physical damage. Seemed to hurt quite hard when I was grabbing adds around the place.

Is a third tank required for this or is there something that can be done?

Web of pain (AFAIK) can't be mitigated on the receiving end. Heroic can be two-tanked. Mythic can be as well, but strongly recommend going 3 tank, it massively simplifies the fight and hugely reduces tank spike damage.