Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Kyanion]

CRZ is an illusion that does nothing to help what's left of our communities, does it benefit our economies, does it add recruitable players for our guilds does it deal with the issue of our low pops still being low pops? The answer to all of the above is no, Blizzard used to try and deal with this kind of stuff from Vanilla > Wrath, now they don't.

Meeting other players isn't a bad thing but meeting players who have restrictions are, what sort of MMO tries to push you into a mega server while at the same time keeping the silly restrictions? Is it so hard for them to think " Maybe just maybe we should connect more realms, we haven't since MoP " evidently though they'd rather turn on CRZ in current content, the one last place our realms could still have some sense of community.

And what good is trade chat if hardly anyone uses it because our populations become a ghost town? Blizzard's neglect is at fault here, laziness wins out over proper planning and actions they never used to be like that, they used to care once upon a time, now they don't.

*shrugs* CRZ benefited my guild, we recruited some puggers via group finder to fill in some raid slots and ended up finding good people to invite each week until a couple of them moved to our realm. If they didn't move they could have stayed on their realm and still raided with us. So for you to say it is an 'illusion' that you can't find recruitable players I laugh my ass off at it. Now that you can use group finder as a raid finding tool it gives people on smaller realms options to play in raids that fit their schedule easier than trying to find a guild on a smaller realm.

Merging realms isn't a great answer always either, some people LIKE being on small unmerged realms. You think everyone WANTS to be smashed together with some realm? No. Some do, some don't. CRZ is a decent enough alternative. Paid transfers are another. Perhaps they should go back to offering some free transfers to smaller realms again, might get some people to move.

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That would be the people that are used to Retails instant gratification. Most of us know what we're getting ourselves into, and i've met people on vanilla servers that started in Cata-Wod and got stuck in Vanilla because of the amazing experience that it is in a lot of peoples eyes. Some people likes MMORPGS that are immersive, and some people likes quick MMO-Hack&slash games.

Some people wants to put in time and be rewarded for that time, some want to play a couple of hours a day and have everything that everybody else has. And that's fine imo, I'd just wish there was a legal way for us to play Vanilla.

Yeah no, stop speaking as if every Vanilla loving person is a like minded drone. You keep forgetting that most of the playerbase in Vanilla WAS casual as well and did NOT hit max level nor did most of them raid. It has nothing to do with instant gratification. Some people like having more OPTIONS of things to do and Vanilla would not provide that...unless you realllllly love slow grinding levels, woo.

[Vash The Stampede]

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. However I seriously doubt that Nost. have a case against Blizzard and even if they did Blizzard would be able to sustain a costly legal battle far longer than them.

Most likely, Nostalrius will just reopen their server in a different country, and like most pirate servers they will just ignore Blizzards cease and desist messages. Would be cool if they kept everyones characters. Lawyers are only useful if you live in a country that cares about US law.

Give Legion 3-6 more months and people will consider it just as bad as WoD

That's my prediction as well. I was thinking patch 7.1 was going to delay it, but considering how pathetic a 5 man raid is going to be, it's going to be 3-6 months.

People were considering WOD bad already after 3-6 weeks, not 3-6 months. So you are already wrong about your statement. But as any game it will become boring, just like people found vanilla and tbc boring and had a break during the no-content spans.

It was 3-6 weeks due to network issues, and 3-6 months because the game sucked. Apparently, Legion doesn't have network issues. I guess Blizzard stopped hiring monkeys to run their servers and paid for cheap quality foreign labor, like everyone else.

From what I remember, everyone was saying WoD was the best version of WoW ever. It was so nice, they had to play it twice. Turns out they lack foresight.

[Kyanion]

That's my prediction as well. I was thinking patch 7.1 was going to delay it, but considering how pathetic a 5 man raid is going to be, it's going to be 3-6 months.

Yet again you have no idea what you are talking about. You don't even play Legion yet you sure love to toss out statements as if you did. Kara is a 5 man MYTHIC DUNGEON...not a raid. There is a raid with 3 bosses coming in meant for 10-30 and will have a Mythic20 version.

[Eleccybubb]

Most likely, Nostalrius will just reopen their server in a different country, and like most pirate servers they will just ignore Blizzards cease and desist messages. Would be cool if they kept everyones characters. Lawyers are only useful if you live in a country that cares about US law.


That's my prediction as well. I was thinking patch 7.1 was going to delay it, but considering how pathetic a 5 man raid is going to be, it's going to be 3-6 months.



It was 3-6 weeks due to network issues, and 3-6 months because the game sucked. Apparently, Legion doesn't have network issues. I guess Blizzard stopped hiring monkeys to run their servers and paid for cheap quality foreign labor, like everyone else.

From what I remember, everyone was saying WoD was the best version of WoW ever. It was so nice, they had to play it twice. Turns out they lack foresight.

So you are happy to bash a game you have absolutely no knowledge about nor have played. Makes sense.

[Kyanion]

It was 3-6 weeks due to network issues, and 3-6 months because the game sucked. Apparently, Legion doesn't have network issues. I guess Blizzard stopped hiring monkeys to run their servers and paid for cheap quality foreign labor, like everyone else.

Again you don't know what you are talking about. WoD had a poor launch with a few days of really spotty service for some players. It was not 3-6 weeks of network issues.

But I'm sure if we ask about Nost you'll tell us it was rainbows and kittens and had no server connection issues, no crashes, etc.

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So you are happy to bash a game you have absolutely no knowledge about nor have played. Makes sense.

He's done it the entire thread and I've called him on it many many times. It is plain as day that he is trying to find second hand knowledge of WoD and Legion to try and make things look better for his cause.

[Derpleton]

Honestly, I'm becoming increasingly disappointed with Legion to the point where I don't really bother logging in more. I simply do not have the time to play the game as much as I did when I was younger and so when I want to login I want to have something meaningful to do, something that will push me closer towards some goal. Legion doesn't have that because Blizzard has basically made Queueable Content irrelevant. There is no reason for me to do LFR or Heroic dungeons since I'm already sitting at around ilvl 850 from world quests. So now I'm becoming interested in Vanilla again. Leveling in Vanilla takes a long time and everytime I log in even if only for 30 minutes I can get some quests done and feel like I accomplished something. Legion is just a bucket list of chores (I.E. World Quests) and irrelevant group content unless you have the time to commit to a raid team or friends who are willing and able to accommodate your time schedule if it happens to be tight. But if you're like me and you have neither than basically you're stuck having to find a decent chunk of time to get a Mythic Group going and then to go clear the dungeon and... for what? Most of the Mythic dungeons don't have a quest attached and my gear is good enough to where base level mythics don't do much for me, and I simply do not have the time to be grinding away on Keystone runs. Whereas in Vanilla that extra chunk of time in which I could do non-queueable content if I do a dungeon I'll likely get 4 or 5 quests done and maybe even get a decent upgrade to my gear since epics and legendaries aren't handed out like candy in Vanilla.

I feel like gear is really the problem here I'm not even that interested in Karazhan since it drops base level ilvl 850 and thats not much better than what I have on, I feel like it'd be a marginal increase in stats most of the time unless RNGesus shines down upon me. And most importantly I feel like when I do get good loot it simply is not exciting because it's just a die roll. One of my favorite memories of WoW was when I got Quel'Delar back in Wrath, it was rare and I had to go on a quest and work for it so that moment where I finally got to equip the sword and was ready for ICC was amazing. I got my first Legion legandary a week ago. I was like "Wow! Thats neat' equipped it and then forgot it existed since it was a ring without any significant cosmetic appearance or game changing effect for me.

[deniter]

Yeah no, stop speaking as if every Vanilla loving person is a like minded drone. You keep forgetting that most of the playerbase in Vanilla WAS casual as well and did NOT hit max level nor did most of them raid. It has nothing to do with instant gratification. Some people like having more OPTIONS of things to do and Vanilla would not provide that...unless you realllllly love slow grinding levels, woo.

And for this reason, among the other things, vanilla was such amazing experience for a casual gamer - (s)he always had new, unexplored content and new dungeons to experience. Today, even the most casual player consume all the content in few months, then quits.

[Zephre]

*shrugs* CRZ benefited my guild, we recruited some puggers via group finder to fill in some raid slots and ended up finding good people to invite each week until a couple of them moved to our realm. If they didn't move they could have stayed on their realm and still raided with us. So for you to say it is an 'illusion' that you can't find recruitable players I laugh my ass off at it. Now that you can use group finder as a raid finding tool it gives people on smaller realms options to play in raids that fit their schedule easier than trying to find a guild on a smaller realm. .

I'll have to quote you in future and use this as an example for a poor comeback. So finding players in group finder somehow helps our economy? A handful of players here and there won't make a low pop jump to a medium, WoW isn't exactly rocking the same subscribers it had years ago and I highly doubt it ever will again, the numbers they gained from legion will die off soon enough and we'll start deteriorating again along with many of the current realms unfortunate enough not to be high pops.

Tell me exactly how CRZ will solve that issue? My issue with CRZ is that it's not an effective solution to combat this kind of thing yet it's the most common solution Blizzard repeatedly keep turning to as for the rest of what you said. Some people like being on small low pop realms? And why is that do you think, to avoid zones being overpopulated simulating a high pop realm without actually being on a high pop realm?

Because that will be Legion in a few months CRZ has already been confirmed in current content by Orynx, what good is playing on a low pop realm now that CRZ will just simulate a high pop realm but still leave the rest of your realm in shambles? Do you think players who like playing on low pop realms will be happy to see every zone being overcrowded? They might as well be playing on a high pop in that case.

[stomination]

Exactly this, vanilla is not about completing everything in the game, it's about having a journey and enjoying the time you play.

The game never changed from that. Its just the community that did.

[Kyanion]

And for this reason, among the other things, vanilla was such amazing experience for a casual gamer - (s)he always had new, unexplored content and new dungeons to experience. Today, even the most casual player consume all the content in few months, then quits.

And try and have players play Vanilla over again. This is not 12 years ago, the results will be different..

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The game never changed from that. Its just the community that did.

Shhh you are ruining his wonderful story!

[Zandalarian Paladin]

Hey, you guys know that Blizzcon murlocs are always related to what's coming up next, right? Murkidan, Gromlok, Murkalot -- All precursors of things to come in either wow or Diablo...

And this year we have Horde/Alliance murlocs?

And this?

According to the discussion we had since our official meeting at their headquarters, they now have everything in their hands to fulfil the large community request for Legacy servers, solving all the previous technical issues they highlighted during the feedback they provided.

Source^ http://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44399

Yeah, honestly, Vanilla pretty much confirmed.

[Kyanion]

I'll have to quote you in future and use this as an example for a poor comeback. So finding players in group finder somehow helps our economy? A handful of players here and there won't make a low pop jump to a medium, WoW isn't exactly rocking the same subscribers it had years ago and I highly doubt it ever will again, the numbers they gained from legion will die off soon enough and we'll start deteriorating again along with many of the current realms unfortunate enough not to be high pops.

Tell me exactly how CRZ will solve that issue? My issue with CRZ is that it's not an effective solution to combat this kind of thing yet it's the most common solution Blizzard repeatedly keep turning to as for the rest of what you said. Some people like being on small low pop realms? And why is that do you think, to avoid zones being overpopulated simulating a high pop realm without actually being on a high pop realm?

Because that will be Legion in a few months CRZ has already been confirmed in current content by Orynx, what good is playing on a low pop realm now that CRZ will just simulate a high pop realm but still leave the rest of your realm in shambles? Do you think players who like playing on low pop realms will be happy to see every zone being overcrowded? They might as well be playing on a high pop in that case.

Your quote was "CRZ is an illusion that does nothing to help what's left of our communities, does it benefit our economies, does it add recruitable players for our guilds does it deal with the issue of our low pops still being low pops? The answer to all of the above is no" Does CRZ benefit the economy? No. Does it add recruitable players for your guilds? Yes. Does it deal with the issue of low pops still being low pops? Yes it does that as well.

Gee I dunno, as some realms shrink there will be other players out in the world still doing quests and content and you'll be able to do things with them. A forced server merge does not mean all of a sudden there will be players in the same zone as you.

[Jastall]

I understand his point. Blizzard is a faceless, soul-sucking corporation accountable to shareholders, so the passion of their most dedicated players takes a back seat to milking the lowest denomination of their subscriber base through loot pinatas, facerolls and microtransactions.

I get it.

The point that you missed is that it doesn't matter how difficult Mythic raiding is, it's lazy and kills immersion to have multiple dungeon difficulties rather than sticking to the progression/attunement model which, by the way, enjoyed more subscribers than today.

Man, I missed all those attunements back when I played Wrath. Guess being able to just enter almost every dungeon/raid was a figment of my imagination.

I also loved when dungeons didn't have multiple difficulties, like in TBC. Everything definitely had 1 difficulty.

[Kyanion]

Yeah, honestly, Vanilla pretty much confirmed.

Hahahahaha! I knew you'd come back with such a pointless comment! Thank you, I needed that laugh!

[stomination]

And for this reason, among the other things, vanilla was such amazing experience for a casual gamer - (s)he always had new, unexplored content and new dungeons to experience. Today, even the most casual player consume all the content in few months, then quits.

That's how most game expansions go. Plus with how much stuff is on the internet to tell you what to do how to do it it's no doubt that people will consume content faster.

[Kyanion]

I like how people bitch about how there is nothing to do in Legion, without ever stepping foot in a heroic or normal and then want to go back to vanilla and do the same boring shit over and over again. Its really mind boggling.

Or the 'journey' to slowly leveling to max with so many pointless filler quests of collecting bear asses. Good lord just thinking about Vanilla dungeons and raids with their lack of mechanics and challenge makes me cringe. All that long grind for such a weak payoff. No thank you. Was fine 12 years ago but the game evolved.

[Zephre]

Your quote was "CRZ is an illusion that does nothing to help what's left of our communities, does it benefit our economies, does it add recruitable players for our guilds does it deal with the issue of our low pops still being low pops? The answer to all of the above is no" Does CRZ benefit the economy? No. Does it add recruitable players for your guilds? Yes. Does it deal with the issue of low pops still being low pops? Yes it does that as well.

Gee I dunno, as some realms shrink there will be other players out in the world still doing quests and content and you'll be able to do things with them. A forced server merge does not mean all of a sudden there will be players in the same zone as you.

You like going in circles don't you? Read your previous responses instead of playing the fool and answer my damn question, how does CRZ benefit economies of low pop realms, it had no significant impact on recruitment, a few here and there wont help us, see I can go in circles as well, want to keep at it?

Realm connections are not merges either, Blizzard ruled out merges because it would result in people having to change their names they might of had for years it basically takes low pop realms and adds them to higher realms, I've seen it with SWTOR before, connections on the other hand allow the realms to remain in tact so people do not have to change their names.

Connections are the answer, not merges, not CRZ. Your argument thus far has been trying to compare a river to an ocean, CRZ doesn't add significant recruitment opportunities compared to connections which can add as many realms as Blizzard desires to the potential recruitment pool without the restrictions CRZ brings, it boosts the economies, it adds players, it breaths some life into the realms and your argument against that is " some people like playing on a low pop realm " and " I've recruited some people to raids through group finder "

[stomination]

Hey, you guys know that Blizzcon murlocs are always related to what's coming up next, right? Murkidan, Gromlok, Murkalot -- All precursors of things to come in either wow or Diablo...

And this year we have Horde/Alliance murlocs?

And this?



Source^ http://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44399

Yeah, honestly, Vanilla pretty much confirmed.

300,000 ppl will supposingly pay for a sub.

only 200+ bought a t shirt.

And then they use a veiled threat towards blizzard if they don't comply.

[Zephre]

300,000 ppl will supposingly pay for a sub.

only 200+ bought a t shirt.

And then they use a veiled threat towards blizzard if they don't comply.

Yes the same thought ran through my head, i cringed when I watched Mark Kern's video awhile back talking about legacy realms adding a million players to the game, short term maybe, long term? Absolutely not at this point nostralius are clutching at straws as is Mark Kern in his desire to remain relevant and sell copies of whatever game he's trying to make providing he doesn't change his mind.

The only thing I miss about Vanilla was Blizzard's approach to solving realm issues and the crazy ass community we used to have.

[Kyanion]

You like going in circles don't you? Read your previous responses instead of playing the fool and answer my damn question, how does CRZ benefit economies of low pop realms, it had no significant impact on recruitment, a few here and there wont help us, see I can go in circles as well, want to keep at it?

I said it does not impact economies, however it DOES impact recruitment and the ability to group up and raid. I don't care if you don't like the answer. You said 'no' it does not help and I disagree with you.

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Yes the same thought ran through my head, i cringed when I watched Mark Kern's video awhile back talking about legacy realms adding a million players to the game, short term maybe, long term? Absolutely not at this point nostralius are clutching at straws as is Mark Kern in his desire to remain relevant and sell copies of whatever game he's trying to make providing he doesn't change his mind.

The only thing I miss about Vanilla was Blizzard's approach to solving realm issues and the crazy ass community we used to have.

I mean I get what you are saying about the 'crazy ass community' but while some Private Servers may have recreated some of the old magic I doubt it would be the case in Blizzard realms as you'd have more people trying it out that weren't aware of it and it would likely ruin the first few months for the 'die hard' Vanilla people. Then people would leave in droves as they are wont to do with most games these days and go to other things until more 'content' is out.

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300,000 ppl will supposingly pay for a sub.

only 200+ bought a t shirt.

And then they use a veiled threat towards blizzard if they don't comply.

I love the veiled threat part. I really want to see what they'll try and do if Blizzcon comes and goes with no announcement of Legacy realms.