Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Kul Tiras]

There is a rumor about that nost. was shut down by blizzard. trying to confirm, have you heard anything?

Take of 75% of your gear and go make a lvl 1. Upgrade one piece of your gear once every 10 levels, and once you hit lvl 60, once every month, at best. There you go, I've recreated your pre-bc experience. Enjoy.

[Deficineiron]

WoW Census has never claimed to be able to determine the total number of subs however it has proven itself time and time again to be accurate at predicting sub trends.

this is right, while over longer time its relative accuracy likely is part of some trend or set of trends separate from sub activity/levels, the short-term review of it is highly likely to reflect actual activity trends.

[Kul Tiras]

The question is why do people keep coming to this thread if they clearly have no interest in Vanilla? This is pretty much the only thread in this forum talking about this, you have the other 99.9% of the threads read about things that interest you. Unless modern wow isn't really all that interesting.

There is no modern WoW. WoW has made no progress in gameplay since pre-BC. The only difference now is that if I want to do a dungeon or a raid to see the new content I can do it much faster, without needing organized 40 man raids, 5 man dungeon teams and weeks and months of preparation just to down one boss.

I can just do my dailies or rep grinds then go see the content. Then I'm done. The difference between pre-BC and Legion is that in Legion it takes me 1-2 months to see that content, in pre-BC it would take me a year. Not because it was harder, but because everything took more time to prepare, and more (needless) organization. You can still do that today, it's called mythic raiding and dungeons.

[Deficineiron]

The question is why do people keep coming to this thread if they clearly have no interest in Vanilla? This is pretty much the only thread in this forum talking about this, you have the other 99.9% of the threads to read about things that interest you. Unless modern wow isn't really all that interesting.

I do find the 'I am threatened by the idea of blizzard working on making classic servers' mindset interesting. The art is made, the bosses are scripted, the talents are designed, the gear is designed the only thing left is some metadata work/updating. I think it is believed that the art department is the major backlog area for blizzard - no art needed here!

I would try to think out a poll to ask 'if you are threatened/angry/frightened of blizz classic server idea, why?' but some of the venom is so intense that I suspect many posters don't actually know the reason they are so threatened by it.

[Kul Tiras]

I do find the 'I am threatened by the idea of blizzard working on making classic servers' mindset interesting. The art is made, the bosses are scripted, the talents are designed, the gear is designed the only thing left is some metadata work/updating. I think it is believed that the art department is the major backlog area for blizzard - no art needed here!

I would try to think out a poll to ask 'if you are threatened/angry/frightened of blizz classic server idea, why?' but some of the venom is so intense that I suspect many posters don't actually know the reason they are so threatened by it.

Wow cupcake, did you enjoy making yourself feel victimized?

This is a forum, and when I see thread 1500 pages long I wonder "wtf are they talking about in there", then I look and go "wtf?", so I ask a question since you know, freedom of speech.

[Deficineiron]

There is no modern WoW. WoW has made no progress in gameplay since pre-BC. The only difference now is that if I want to do a dungeon or a raid to see the new content I can do it much faster, without needing organized 40 man raids, 5 man dungeon teams and weeks and months of preparation just to down one boss.

I can just do my dailies or rep grinds then go see the content. Then I'm done. The difference between pre-BC and Legion is that in Legion it takes me 1-2 months to see that content, in pre-BC it would take me a year. Not because it was harder, but because everything took more time to prepare, and more (needless) organization. You can still do that today, it's called mythic raiding and dungeons.

There is one crowd here that claims that 'math doesn't matter,' that the fact mobs in general did a high % of player health in damage per hit pre-2.3 is not important, and does not apply to difficulty. (one poster in particular proved it actually only increased Tedium, not difficulty). How do you feel about the concept of a mob hitting a player harder - does it change difficulty?

[Traveler Voltin]

That can change from person to person's friend list.

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My favorite part is it seems that thread is going very slow.

There was like 5 threads on the US official forums last night and people were acting like it was confirmed.

[Deficineiron]

Wow cupcake, did you enjoy making yourself feel victimized?

This is a forum, and when I see thread 1500 pages long I wonder "wtf are they talking about in there", then I look and go "wtf?", so I ask a question since you know, freedom of speech.

Formerly civics classes taught where the 1st amendment applied. Younger people don't have that benefit and want to impose it on private entities. However, we can chalk one up for 'why are you threatened by classic' to 'first amendment LOL,' if you like.

Who did you used to be on this forum? You write in a familiar way.

[Wildmoon]

I do find the 'I am threatened by the idea of blizzard working on making classic servers' mindset interesting. The art is made, the bosses are scripted, the talents are designed, the gear is designed the only thing left is some metadata work/updating. I think it is believed that the art department is the major backlog area for blizzard - no art needed here!

I would try to think out a poll to ask 'if you are threatened/angry/frightened of blizz classic server idea, why?' but some of the venom is so intense that I suspect many posters don't actually know the reason they are so threatened by it.

People don't have to feel threatened to share their opinions on the topic lol. No one should make a thread and expect everyone to share his/her view. Don't be overprotective of the idea.

[Kul Tiras]

There is one crowd here that claims that 'math doesn't matter,' that the fact mobs in general did a high % of player health in damage per hit pre-2.3 is not important, and does not apply to difficulty. (one poster in particular proved it actually only increased Tedium, not difficulty). How do you feel about the concept of a mob hitting a player harder - does it change difficulty?

It may be difficult the first time you fight them, until you learn their rotations, after that it becomes, yes, tedium or grind. They will never change their patterns of attack or tactics. You know what to expect, and that expectation is always fulfilled.

Taking 2 kobolds at a time as a mage used to be a challenge in pre-BC, while leveling. 3 almost impossible. Why? I didn't have the necessary tools to crowd control them enough, or protect myself enough, or heal myself enough. Did that make it hard? No, it just forced me to either:

a) pull one at a time, which was very easy, because I could use all my (limited) tools on that one kobold
b) group

This isn't difficulty. It doesn't challenge my intellect or my abilities. My character is simply limited in dealing with any threat beyond 2 enemies. My choice is run away and restart the fight or group.

Fast-forward Legion: I can pull a pack of 6-7 enemies, and through clever use of my CC, healing and damage abilities, take them all down. Sometimes I can't, even now, but in cases where I find myself in those situations, I actually have a third choice: fight. I can decide to sheep an enemy, freeze the other for 10 seconds, take one or 2 down by popping some CD, shielding myself, resetting my cool downs, and worst case scenario, blink away and invis.

That's choice. That's difficulty. Having to make a choice other than "reset the fight". And even now, at one point, it becomes tedious, because once again, the enemies don't change. Their tactics are static and repetitive. Learn their patterns and overcome them. That's Sun Tzu. If an enemy doesn't adapt to change, it ensures its defeat.

So an enemy can be made to hit me for 90% of my health. Ok. So in that case you're saying "I'm forcing you to group with a tank and healer". Yeah, that's called a dungeon or a raid boss, and it doesn't increase difficulty, it just decreases choices for an intelligent human to pick from.

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Who did you used to be on this forum? You write in a familiar way.

For you baby, I'll be whomever you want, I revel in forum drama and people keeping track of people gestapo-style.

[Kolvarg]

The game never changed from that. Its just the community that did.

It's not just the community. It did change a lot, but the changes to game mechanics and features also help. Sure, the "endgame is where the game starts" mentality is much more prevalent now than it was when everyone was still leveling up. The "I'm just exploring and experiencing this" attitude was much more prevalent back then than nowadays when people mostly just want to levelup and gear up as fast as possible.

But that's not just the community's fault. Part of it is just a side-effect of the game getting older (people are much more experienced and better at MMORPGs in general, and there's is boatloads of information and guides about everything), but many of the game's systems and features have been changed in a way that promotes these mentalities. I played a bit on Nostalrius while I was actively playing retail, and leveling up felt absolutely nothing like it did if I were to create a new character on retail.

Again, part of that is just the game's age showing, and I'm not saying these changes weren't made for a reason, they were, and in many ways they were positive and very likely allowed the game to survive longer than it would otherwise, but that doesn't change the fact that it did become a very different experience.

[Galax]

Man, I missed all those attunements back when I played Wrath. Guess being able to just enter almost every dungeon/raid was a figment of my imagination.

I also loved when dungeons didn't have multiple difficulties, like in TBC. Everything definitely had 1 difficulty.

I wasn't crazy about heroics in TBC, but it helped that they

a.) Had good loot tables with set items, unique gear models and epics you could roll on

b.) Were an integral part to getting to non-recycled content (Kara, etc.)

c.) Dropped unique patterns and recipes for professions and allowed you to earn a lot of faction rep (more goodies) making them replayable.

d.) Weren't made irrelevantly easy just because a patch came out.


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It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. However I seriously doubt that Nost. have a case against Blizzard and even if they did Blizzard would be able to sustain a costly legal battle far longer than them.

This is not how everyone wins.

Blizzard needs to set aside server space for their reboot servers, manage it themselves and hire a couple Nost guys as consultants. That's how everyone wins.

It's going to take work, but every year demand for this grows.

[Kul Tiras]

It's going to take work, but every year demand for this grows.

Just like how pandaren were once demanded as "the most wanted race in WoW by the majority of WoW players", yet they were the lowest played race since the end of panadaland, and have only now risen slightly above dwarves and goblins?

[papajohn4]

With one way or another we will have our quality legacy servers... Also <snip>

The only question is if Blizzard will benefit from Legacy servers or not.

DONT NAME PRIVATE SERVERS PLEASE.

[Kul Tiras]

^ the arrogance in that entire psa is asstounding: a petition which is unverifiable by how many individual players was signed, a survey which is the same, and an insult to blizzard's core values claiming their devs and admins have to please the vocal minority in what will surely be an escalating mountain of requests in content and bug fixing should this thing ever go live.

It's all about me me me with you people, isn't it?

[Holtzmann]

Just like how pandaren were once demanded as "the most wanted race in WoW by the majority of WoW players", yet they were the lowest played race since the end of panadaland, and have only now risen slightly above dwarves and goblins?

When did a new race actually put a dent on the racial balance chart in WoW? Blood Elves did so because they were the first and only "pretty" race the Horde got, and they were the only way the Horde could get Paladins at the time. This has nothing to do with demand.

[Sturmbringe]

@papajohn4: Advertising private servers is not allowed on this board, so edit out the name of the "quality" private server before a mod does it.

Recently, I bought a 1300 Euro gaming monitor, the Acer Predator X34. It is a 34 inch G-Sync 21:9 curved IPS monitor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16824009869

I have just finished my daily gaming session on a WoW Vanilla private server at 3440X1440, 21:9 aspect ratio.

I was thinking that original WoW Devs, like Mark Kern, should be very proud that their game, originally developed for 800X600 and 1024X768 PC's, now runs on 3440X1440 ultra expensive monitors 12 years after it was developed.

I wonder if anyone from the original team at Blizzard actually dreamed their game would actually go that far.

[Kul Tiras]

@papajohn4: Advertising private servers is not allowed on this board, so edit out the name of the "quality" private server before a mod does it.

Recently, I bought a 1300 Euro gaming monitor, the Acer Predator X34. It is a 34 inch G-Sync 21:9 curved IPS monitor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16824009869

I have just finished my daily gaming session on a WoW Vanilla private server at 3440X1440, 21:9 aspect ratio.

I was thinking that original WoW Devs, like Mark Kern, should be very proud that their game, originally developed for 800X600 and 1024X768 PC's, now runs on 3440X1440 ultra expensive monitors 12 years after it was developed.

I wonder if anyone from the original team at Blizzard actually dreamed their game would actually go that far.

Everquest 1 and CS 1.6 still run today, not sure why everyone glorifies WoW's being alive so much. Hell, even Doom is getting remade every year by some fan.

Mark Kern was a spoiled petulant child, he destroyed Firefall singlehandedly.

[Alydael]

These aren't people who want to play Legion or newer expansions anyway. They should just let the community do their own thing and stop trying to ruin fun for those that want to play WoW how it used to be. I get why legally they can, but it seems similar to Nintendo saying no one can stream their games.

I agree with this. If people want your games- and you do not want to stream them or produce them- then let someone else do it (just take some cash for it). Don't be greedy about it, throw your fans a bone. It was their money that got you to this point. It is OK to give a little back, everything doesn't always have to be so corporate and dollar focused.

[Tart]

I highly doubt the reason is because they are worried it would separate players or become more popular. If anything people would get bored of Legacy over time because even if it's a progressive server once the final raid such as Naxx for vanilla and Sunwell for TBC is out and people have spent time levelling alts and farming consistently then what? There would be a drop off eventually and resetting it won't help because after a few resets people will not want to do it all again. No matter what just like retail legacy would have a drop off of interest as well. It cannot be helped.

Good points but people drop off anyway. Legion has been out 2 month and that's even dropping in subs if certain reports are to be believed. I just really think blizzard are missing a trick by not putting a pvp and PVE server up.