I'm sorry but not being able to do the two Artifact Quests in LFR is bullshit.

[Flurryfang]

No matter if it's right or wrong, i'm considering giving up Legion sooner then expected when there's "normal+ raid only" stuff (except for epics).
I'm here for leveling, grinding reps and achievements and 5ppls which DO NOT require me to use the fucking voice chat. I just cannot afford speaking, cannot afford putting my headphones on so that i cannot hear what's going on around me at home.
It's like a month at best of things left to do for me and i unsubscribe untill the next patch.
Which is sad because even when it hits - i'm left behind the story and cannot progress to see what's the legion is about.

That makes every expansion last for like 3-4 month total at best for me, while otehrs play for 2 years.
I see no reason for blizzard to ever introduce anything aside epics of higher ilvl and unique looks to those raiding.

But would opening up 1 artifat skin in LFR really change anything for you? I like the way you play, its the way which all people should play, playing the content they like and unsubbing when they are done with that content. But having to do LFR 1 hour a week does not really seem like a reason for you to stay subbed.

Also, if you remove all reward from raiding, then why should people even raid? It is content which requires work, both in-game and often outside of the game. It also requires quite a lot of dedication, since you will often find alot more failures in raiding then the rest of the game. So there has to be an equal reward for the hard work being put into the content and gear/item lvl upgrades is simply not enough.

The large reason why many people does not go into mythic raiding, is because the reward for clearing an instance is gone, since you have to clear a raid on heroic before going into mythic. So in mythic, the only reward is the gear and a few unique gear pieces, which is simply not enough for people to that extra mile. If there was not a mount reward from killing Archimonde HC, then i would bet that the number of people who have cleared that place, would be much lower.

So the extra reward is needed. I would have understod the quest alot more, if it was actually only completable in heroic and mythic, but having it in normal is okay too

[Moggie]

But would opening up 1 artifat skin in LFR really change anything for you?

Psst... It's not just one skin, it's the entire row which is not raid dependent.

[Life-Binder]

Normal is so trivial anyone can pug and clear 7/7.

no

plenty of random casual groups out there can wipe in Normal EN


its amazing how half of MMO-C still cant understand that concept

[Deleted]

No, you can't have both. What's the point of giving different rewards to people of different skill levels then? What's the point of trying at all?

As another has pointed out, people would be more gratified by an actual reward that reflects their accomplishment, rather than only an achievement. Better rewards for more work put in is a reflection of how our society functions, so it makes sense. In the end, the third tier for artifact skins has been chosen for something a raider would unlock, just as the fourth is for pvp.

This would be true, if the Skin unlock would only require to kill the bosses, but there is also a farming quest with 30 fragments to collect. I got the quest item from Xavius last week because I was lucky with finding a PUG and it was also good enough in beating the boss in one try, with my humble contribution. I think I can manage to find a PUG for the other boss, eventually. But I cannot fathom if I will find enough time to PUG enough bosses to get 30 fragments, since these are no guaranteed drops (Xavius had none for me).

They could have at least let us collect the fragments in LFR.

[MisterBigglez]

no

plenty of random casual groups out there can wipe in Normal EN


its amazing how half of MMO-C still cant understand that concept

I never said that anyone could clear it "without" a wipe. Of course people will wipe, doesn't change the fact that EN normal is a piece of piss to complete.

[Blayze]

Hey, great point and I see what you are really saying, "get rid of LFR altogether - It's a pile of shit."
Excellent idea.

That would require Normal mode being made easier, to take its place as the introductory raid experience.
Either that or it would require raids to stop being produced, since it's a niche activity that only serves the most cancerous part of the playerbase... and the best of the best they desperately seek to emulate.

[CalamityHeart]

My biggest issue with this isnt that its bad per say, but rather, that its unethical.

During Mists and Warlords it was entirley possible to gear up the legendary cloak through LFR.

I myself prefer doing normal raiding anyway, but I could see for convinence reasons why doing it in LFR could be a thing.

It feels... forced, on the playerbase, considering that they gave everything else away, trying to limit people actually makes this a problem, it creates stigma.

Legion is rapidly becomming close to becomming the second comming of Warlords hiding in false promises of being a better expansion, like Warlords promised to be to Mists.

The difference between the legendary ring/cloak sagas from MoP/WoD and the Balance of Power quests in Legion is the fact that the Valorous skin in no way affects your character in terms of power level. The skin is a purely cosmetic reward, and as such, there's no reason to make obtaining it "convenient" by having LFR count toward obtaining it.

[Traveler Voltin]

lets put skins behind brick walls even though said skins will no longer be available after legion.

[CalamityHeart]

lets put skins behind brick walls even though said skins will no longer be available after legion.

What...? Do you think cosmetic rewards should be handed to you upfront without effort just because it will one day be outdated content? o_0

[Traveler Voltin]

What...? Do you think cosmetic rewards should be handed to you upfront without effort just because it will one day be outdated content? o_0

i said nothing about handed.
and you missed my point.

[Flurryfang]

Psst... It's not just one skin, it's the entire row which is not raid dependent.

Dude... Its 1 skin in 4 different colors... It does not change much m8!

- - - Updated - - -

no

plenty of random casual groups out there can wipe in Normal EN


its amazing how half of MMO-C still cant understand that concept

I think made a good point here. "Random casual groups". I think that is the group, which blizzard want to change and make non-casual with the reward of an item skin

[CalamityHeart]

i said nothing about handed.
and you missed my point.

It would help if you made that point a bit more clear. Care to elaborate?

[Traveler Voltin]

It would help if you made that point a bit more clear. Care to elaborate?

Now: Artifacts are the only weapon.
Past: multiple weapons

now assuming blizzard is going to power down artifacts at the end. that means the quests for skins and the colors will probably be removed from being able to be gotten.
unlike the in past were you could come back later and get what you wanted.

in my opinion. the skins should be easy to get. the colors on the other hand can be a verity of difficulties.
also that the quests should not removed.

[glorygores]

it rewards a skin that is specifically meant to reward organized raiding, QQ more OP?

- - - Updated - - -

lets put skins behind brick walls even though said skins will no longer be available after legion.

if you think normal raiding is a brick wall, are you sure you actually deserve a reward? WoW has always put rewards behind these "walls", it's pure speculation that the skins won't be available after legion or that Artifacts won't continue on.

God forbid 4 out of 20 some odd skins actually require you do something with other people in the game. Boo on Blizzard!

[Eleccybubb]

Didn't Blizzard say they wanted rewards gated behind organised raiding? By that logic LFR is either not organised, not raiding or both.

[glorygores]

My biggest issue with this isnt that its bad per say, but rather, that its unethical.

During Mists and Warlords it was entirley possible to gear up the legendary cloak through LFR.

I myself prefer doing normal raiding anyway, but I could see for convinence reasons why doing it in LFR could be a thing.

It feels... forced, on the playerbase, considering that they gave everything else away, trying to limit people actually makes this a problem, it creates stigma.

Legion is rapidly becomming close to becomming the second comming of Warlords hiding in false promises of being a better expansion, like Warlords promised to be to Mists.

Probably will get banned for this, but you're a fucking retard.

It's a fucking skin.
For God's Sake.
A. Fucking. Skin.
Legendary cloak/ring were REQUIRED PIECES OF GEAR THAT HUGELY AFFECTED PLAYER PROGRESSION/POWER.

[Traveler Voltin]

Didn't Blizzard say they wanted rewards gated behind organised raiding? By that logic LFR is either not organised, not raiding or both.

and that worked so well for WoD.

[Goldielocks]

and that worked so well for WoD.

Which then they offered other ways to gear up in Legion. This is not about player power level. It is a skin, an therefore, it's in a different league.

QQ MORE

[Sorrior]

What...? Do you think cosmetic rewards should be handed to you upfront without effort just because it will one day be outdated content? o_0

Ya know if anything a Lfr option would be ALOT grinder and take alot more time...Maybe not as much skill but far more time

[darklogrus]

Probably will get banned for this, but you're a fucking retard.

It's a fucking skin.
For God's Sake.
A. Fucking. Skin.
Legendary cloak/ring were REQUIRED PIECES OF GEAR THAT HUGELY AFFECTED PLAYER PROGRESSION/POWER.

I'm an "Organized" raider and I don't give a F$@% if the skins are in LFR. Because at the end of the day whether people like you want to admit it or not. Its someone elses "RAID."