[Legion - 7.2] Not's Demonology Guide

[davidorion]

Regarding the "imaginary" plateaus....

sim result with patchwerk 1 target 10000 iterations:


Simcraft import doesn't import weapon ilevel, and doesn't import relics, so I put it in manually.

I'm running with 2 WQ haste trinkets, 850 haste and 835 haste with socket.

profile below:

artifact=37:0:0:0:0:1170:1:1171:3:1173:3:1174:3:1176:4:1177:5:1178:3:1179:2:1180:1:1181:1: 1182:1:1183:1:1185:1:1354:1
spec=demonology

# This default action priority list is automatically created based on your character.
# It is a attempt to provide you with a action list that is both simple and practicable,
# while resulting in a meaningful and good simulation. It may not result in the absolutely highest possible dps.
# Feel free to edit, adapt and improve it to your own needs.
# SimulationCraft is always looking for updates and improvements to the default action lists.

# Executed before combat begins. Accepts non-harmful actions only.
actions.precombat=flask,type=whispered_pact
actions.precombat+=/food,type=azshari_salad
actions.precombat+=/summon_pet,if=!talent.grimoire_of_supremacy.enabled&(!talent.grimoire_of_sacrifice.enabled |buff.demonic_power.down)
actions.precombat+=/summon_infernal,if=talent.grimoire_of_supremacy.enabled&artifact.lord_of_flames.rank>0
actions.precombat+=/summon_infernal,if=talent.grimoire_of_supremacy.enabled&active_enemies>=3
actions.precombat+=/summon_doomguard,if=talent.grimoire_of_supremacy.enabled&active_enemies<3&artifact.lord_of _flames.rank=0
actions.precombat+=/augmentation,type=defiled
actions.precombat+=/snapshot_stats
actions.precombat+=/potion,name=deadly_grace
actions.precombat+=/demonic_empowerment
actions.precombat+=/demonbolt,if=talent.demonbolt.enabled
actions.precombat+=/shadow_bolt,if=!talent.demonbolt.enabled

# Executed every time the actor is available.
actions=implosion,if=wild_imp_remaining_duration<=action.shadow_bolt.execute_time&buff.dem onic_synergy.remains
actions+=/implosion,if=prev_gcd.hand_of_guldan&wild_imp_remaining_duration<=3&buff.demonic_synergy.r emains
actions+=/implosion,if=wild_imp_count<=4&wild_imp_remaining_duration<=action.shadow_bolt.execute_tim e&spell_targets.implosion>1
actions+=/implosion,if=prev_gcd.hand_of_guldan&wild_imp_remaining_duration<=4&spell_targets.implosio n>2
actions+=/shadowflame,if=debuff.shadowflame.stack>0&remains<action.shadow_bolt.cast_time+travel_time
actions+=/service_pet,if=cooldown.summon_doomguard.remains<=gcd&soul_shard>=2
actions+=/service_pet,if=cooldown.summon_doomguard.remains>25
actions+=/summon_doomguard,if=talent.grimoire_of_service.enabled&prev.service_felguard&spell_targets .infernal_awakening<3
actions+=/summon_doomguard,if=talent.grimoire_of_synergy.enabled&spell_targets.infernal_awakening<3
actions+=/summon_infernal,if=talent.grimoire_of_service.enabled&prev.service_felguard&spell_targets. infernal_awakening>=3
actions+=/summon_infernal,if=talent.grimoire_of_synergy.enabled&spell_targets.infernal_awakening>=3
actions+=/call_dreadstalkers,if=!talent.summon_darkglare.enabled&(spell_targets.implosion<3|!talent. implosion.enabled)
actions+=/hand_of_guldan,if=soul_shard>=4&!talent.summon_darkglare.enabled
actions+=/summon_darkglare,if=prev_gcd.hand_of_guldan
actions+=/summon_darkglare,if=prev_gcd.call_dreadstalkers
actions+=/summon_darkglare,if=cooldown.call_dreadstalkers.remains>5&soul_shard<3
actions+=/summon_darkglare,if=cooldown.call_dreadstalkers.remains<=action.summon_darkglare.cast_time &soul_shard>=3
actions+=/summon_darkglare,if=cooldown.call_dreadstalkers.remains<=action.summon_darkglare.cast_time &soul_shard>=1&buff.demonic_calling.react
actions+=/call_dreadstalkers,if=talent.summon_darkglare.enabled&(spell_targets.implosion<3|!talent.i mplosion.enabled)&cooldown.summon_darkglare.remains>2
actions+=/call_dreadstalkers,if=talent.summon_darkglare.enabled&(spell_targets.implosion<3|!talent.i mplosion.enabled)&prev_gcd.summon_darkglare
actions+=/call_dreadstalkers,if=talent.summon_darkglare.enabled&(spell_targets.implosion<3|!talent.i mplosion.enabled)&cooldown.summon_darkglare.remains<=action.call_dreadstalkers.cast_time&s oul_shard>=3
actions+=/call_dreadstalkers,if=talent.summon_darkglare.enabled&(spell_targets.implosion<3|!talent.i mplosion.enabled)&cooldown.summon_darkglare.remains<=action.call_dreadstalkers.cast_time&s oul_shard>=1&buff.demonic_calling.react
actions+=/hand_of_guldan,if=soul_shard>=3&prev_gcd.call_dreadstalkers
actions+=/hand_of_guldan,if=soul_shard>=5&cooldown.summon_darkglare.remains<=action.hand_of_guldan.c ast_time
actions+=/hand_of_guldan,if=soul_shard>=4&cooldown.summon_darkglare.remains>2
actions+=/demonic_empowerment,if=wild_imp_no_de>3|prev_gcd.hand_of_guldan
actions+=/demonic_empowerment,if=dreadstalker_no_de>0|darkglare_no_de>0|doomguard_no_de>0|infernal_n o_de>0|service_no_de>0
actions+=/felguard:felstorm
actions+=/doom,cycle_targets=1,if=!talent.hand_of_doom.enabled&target.time_to_die>duration&(!ticking |remains<duration*0.3)
actions+=/arcane_torrent
actions+=/berserking
actions+=/blood_fury
actions+=/soul_harvest
actions+=/potion,name=deadly_grace,if=buff.soul_harvest.remains|target.time_to_die<=45|trinket.proc. any.react
actions+=/shadowflame,if=charges=2
actions+=/thalkiels_consumption,if=(dreadstalker_remaining_duration>execute_time|talent.implosion.en abled&spell_targets.implosion>=3)&wild_imp_count>3&wild_imp_remaining_duration>execute_tim e
actions+=/life_tap,if=mana.pct<=30
actions+=/demonwrath,chain=1,interrupt=1,if=spell_targets.demonwrath>=3
actions+=/demonwrath,moving=1,chain=1,interrupt=1
actions+=/demonbolt
actions+=/shadow_bolt
actions+=/life_tap

head=celestially_aligned_hood,id=139188,bonus_id=1805/1487
neck=pendant_of_the_watchful_eye,id=137536,bonus_id=3411/1512/3337,enchant=mark_of_the_hidden_satyr
shoulders=slipstream_shoulderpads,id=137309,bonus_id=1727/1808/1492/1813,gems=150haste
back=evergreen_vinewrap_drape,id=139248,bonus_id=1805/1487,enchant=200int
chest=fluxflow_robes,id=134413,bonus_id=3414/1512/3336
wrists=imbued_silkweave_bracers,id=127002,bonus_id=689/1696/3408/601/669
hands=inksmudged_handwraps,id=134421,bonus_id=3413/1808/1502/1813,gems=150haste
waist=roggthread_cord,id=134171,bonus_id=1727/40/1502/1813
legs=riverrider_legwraps,id=134427,bonus_id=3414/1507/1813
feet=mistbound_helarjar_footwraps,id=133608,bonus_id=1727/1808/41/1492/1813,gems=150haste
finger1=wilfreds_sigil_of_superior_summoning,id=132369,bonus_id=1811,gems=150haste,enchant =150haste
finger2=frans_intractable_loop,id=141582,bonus_id=1808/1497,gems=150haste,enchant=150haste
trinket1=huge_roggstone,id=134160,bonus_id=3397/604/1512/3337
trinket2=nightmare_bloom,id=121311,bonus_id=3397/1808/604/1492/1675,gems=150haste
main_hand=spine_of_thalkiel,id=137246,ilevel=888
off_hand=skull_of_the_manari,id=128943,bonus_id=748,relic_id=3416:1522:3336/1727:1492:1813/3415:1522:3337/0,ilevel=888

# Gear Summary
# gear_ilvl=856.94
# gear_stamina=20776
# gear_intellect=13761
# gear_spell_power=10587
# gear_crit_rating=2276
# gear_haste_rating=12873
# gear_mastery_rating=4268
# gear_versatility_rating=269
# gear_leech_rating=404
# gear_avoidance_rating=404
# gear_armor=1641
default_pet=felguard

so you can see all is in order.
if I swap out even 1 trinket and replace it with 840 Chronoshard then haste gets above INT with value 12.xx

so there is an "imaginary" plateau and for me it's around 40% haste.

Zumba, when you pasted the data it somehow added some spaces here and there that caused an error. I went through and fixed the problems and ran a simulation. I got similar results to you using SimCraft 703-04 and showed that Haste was your lowest stat.

I noticed that your Mastery is high at 36.34% and your Crit is low at 11.50%. When I import Not's character using SimCraft, his Mastery is 21.91% and Crit is 18.10%. Perhaps high Mastery/low Crit is somehow affecting the Haste stat when Haste gets above 40%?

Interestingly, when I do a test and add 2,000 of any secondary stat to your character it goes against what SimCraft is saying for your Stat weights. Adding 2,000 does the following: Haste increases your DPS by 18K, Crit by 14K, Vers by 14K, and a negative 6K for Mastery. Except for the DPS loss with Mastery, these figures are more in line with the original Stat weights that Woz posted in the guide.

So the question is, why is SimCraft showing a low Haste Stat when Mastery is high and Crit is low once Haste is around 40%? Furthermore, why do those odd Stat weights not hold true when adding additional secondary Stats to your profile as a test?

[Deleted]

Zumba, when you pasted the data it somehow added some spaces here and there that caused an error. I went through and fixed the problems and ran a simulation. I got similar results to you using SimCraft 703-04 and showed that Haste was your lowest stat.

I noticed that your Mastery is high at 36.34% and your Crit is low at 11.50%. When I import Not's character using SimCraft, his Mastery is 21.91% and Crit is 18.10%. Perhaps high Mastery/low Crit is somehow affecting the Haste stat when Haste gets above 40%?

Interestingly, when I do a test and add 2,000 of any secondary stat to your character it goes against what SimCraft is saying for your Stat weights. Adding 2,000 does the following: Haste increases your DPS by 18K, Crit by 14K, Vers by 14K, and a negative 6K for Mastery. Except for the DPS loss with Mastery, these figures are more in line with the original Stat weights that Woz posted in the guide.

So the question is, why is SimCraft showing a low Haste Stat when Mastery is high and Crit is low once Haste is around 40%? Furthermore, why do those odd Stat weights not hold true when adding additional secondary Stats to your profile as a test?

It seems Simcraft is doing something wrong with mastery, I got a head and relic wich changed my stats to 15% crit and 31% mastery and now I simed my char again and got different results:

http://imgur.com/a/1Mn7t

now haste even though is higher than before came back to first place. Something strange is happening and I would really love to get to the bottom of this.

this is what changed in my profile:

head=mana_scavengers_mask,id=141449,bonus_id=1808/1472,gems=150haste
neck=pendant_of_the_watchful_eye,id=137536,bonus_id=3411/1512/3337,enchant=mark_of_the_hidden_satyr
shoulders=slipstream_shoulderpads,id=137309,bonus_id=1727/1808/1492/1813,gems=150haste
back=evergreen_vinewrap_drape,id=139248,bonus_id=1805/1487,enchant=200int
chest=fluxflow_robes,id=134413,bonus_id=3414/1512/3336
wrists=imbued_silkweave_bracers,id=127002,bonus_id=689/1696/3408/601/669
hands=inksmudged_handwraps,id=134421,bonus_id=3413/1808/1502/1813,gems=150haste
waist=roggthread_cord,id=134171,bonus_id=1727/40/1502/1813
legs=riverrider_legwraps,id=134427,bonus_id=3414/1507/1813
feet=mistbound_helarjar_footwraps,id=133608,bonus_id=1727/1808/41/1492/1813,gems=150haste
finger1=wilfreds_sigil_of_superior_summoning,id=132369,bonus_id=1811,gems=150haste,enchant =150haste
finger2=frans_intractable_loop,id=141582,bonus_id=1808/1497,gems=150haste,enchant=150haste
trinket1=huge_roggstone,id=134160,bonus_id=3397/604/1512/3337
trinket2=nightmare_bloom,id=121311,bonus_id=3397/1808/604/1492/1675,gems=150haste
main_hand=spine_of_thalkiel,id=137246,ilevel=891
off_hand=skull_of_the_manari,id=128943,bonus_id=748,relic_id=3416:1522:3336/1727:1492:1813/3415:1522:3337/0,ilevel=891

# Gear Summary
# gear_ilvl=857.00
# gear_stamina=20753
# gear_intellect=13746
# gear_spell_power=10887
# gear_crit_rating=3132
# gear_haste_rating=13140
# gear_mastery_rating=3289
# gear_versatility_rating=269
# gear_leech_rating=404
# gear_avoidance_rating=404
# gear_armor=1637
default_pet=felguard

so less mastery, more crit, more haste and 300 spellpower more and haste is on top again....

[Mongosaurus]

I'm having issues with simc and need to look at why. It sims me lower than numbers I can easily pull self buffed. I'm so confused lately as to what simc is giving me.

[Deleted]

So, are you exporting from the Simulationcraft addon? Cause we already established that the import function doesn't work. It doesn't do your artifact weapon correctly, basically.

No matter what parameters I use, haste is always the #1 stat. As long as you have a correct simulation to begin with. Which atm requires the export string from the simcraft addon.

Edit: I saw that you spoke about entering it manually, yet I don't see the full string from the addon there. Try pasting everything from the addon in a New simulation. You don't need the actions etc apparently, it's added automatically in the background. I tried.

[Woz]

head=celestially_aligned_hood,id=139188,bonus_id=1805/1487
neck=pendant_of_the_watchful_eye,id=137536,bonus_id=3411/1512/3337,enchant=mark_of_the_hidden_satyr
shoulders=slipstream_shoulderpads,id=137309,bonus_id=1727/1808/1492/1813,gems=150haste
back=evergreen_vinewrap_drape,id=139248,bonus_id=1805/1487,enchant=200int
chest=fluxflow_robes,id=134413,bonus_id=3414/1512/3336
wrists=imbued_silkweave_bracers,id=127002,bonus_id=689/1696/3408/601/669
hands=inksmudged_handwraps,id=134421,bonus_id=3413/1808/1502/1813,gems=150haste
waist=roggthread_cord,id=134171,bonus_id=1727/40/1502/1813
legs=riverrider_legwraps,id=134427,bonus_id=3414/1507/1813
feet=mistbound_helarjar_footwraps,id=133608,bonus_id=1727/1808/41/1492/1813,gems=150haste
finger1=wilfreds_sigil_of_superior_summoning,id=132369,bonus_id=1811,gems=150haste,enchant =150haste
finger2=frans_intractable_loop,id=141582,bonus_id=1808/1497,gems=150haste,enchant=150haste
trinket1=huge_roggstone,id=134160,bonus_id=3397/604/1512/3337
trinket2=nightmare_bloom,id=121311,bonus_id=3397/1808/604/1492/1675,gems=150haste
main_hand=spine_of_thalkiel,id=137246,ilevel=888
off_hand=skull_of_the_manari,id=128943,bonus_id=748,relic_id=3416:1522:3336/1727:1492:1813/3415:1522:3337/0,ilevel=888

Considering your gems and enchants aren't even input correctly -- I'd say that not everything is "all in order".

After fixing all the errors in what you posted and then running the sim;



And just to show you that you're wrong about this imaginary plateau;



Edit:

Using your new gear;



So......*shrug*....Using nightly build from last night.

- - - Updated - - -

Hi Woz

Just wanted to say - i switched to implosion a couple of weeks ago and it's just batshit insane - both single target and aoe. I feel like it just doesn't compare to before - at the loss of 1 GCD i am dealing massive damage now in any situation, burst and sustained. Just wanted to let you know and maybe try to adjust the guide somehow ? I don't know - i feel like too few people know about this and are still complaining about our DPS. Which can be amazing - i know mine is.

It's not worth using Single Target.

[Deleted]

Considering your gems and enchants aren't even input correctly -- I'd say that not everything is "all in order".

After fixing all the errors in what you posted and then running the sim;



And just to show you that you're wrong about this imaginary plateau;



Edit:

Using your new gear;



So......*shrug*....Using nightly build from last night.

- - - Updated - - -



It's not worth using Single Target.

gems and enchants in simcraft profile are fine, they only mess up when I copy paste here. Look the report I have done just now:

https://gyazo.com/ec967c14e42864c4162ab66f88bb0dc1

https://gyazo.com/e7af3b7c0aeaa2f91301cd5024a92f3b

I have no idea how on earth you get haste value of 21.69 , it has never went past 12

this is sim with chronoshard but I'm doing another one with WQ trinket to see what will happen.

edit: downloaded last build that was uploaded like 15 mins ago, simmed and same thing haste is on 12....no way for it to have relative value of 26 , something is wrong on your side or you are not using patchwerk on 300seconds.

Only time haste drops down is when I increase mastery and drop crit, then it drops on last position with value around 6.

[Woz]

gems and enchants in simcraft profile are fine, they only mess up when I copy paste here. Look the report I have done just now:

https://gyazo.com/ec967c14e42864c4162ab66f88bb0dc1

https://gyazo.com/e7af3b7c0aeaa2f91301cd5024a92f3b

I have no idea how on earth you get haste value of 21.69 , it has never went past 12

this is sim with chronoshard but I'm doing another one with WQ trinket to see what will happen.

edit: downloaded last build that was uploaded like 15 mins ago, simmed and same thing haste is on 12....no way for it to have relative value of 26 , something is wrong on your side or you are not using patchwerk on 300seconds.

Only time haste drops down is when I increase mastery and drop crit, then it drops on last position with value around 6.

You're right...had it at 200s - redid the sim (Patchwerk, 300s)...

You no Chrono Shard:



You with Chrono Shard:



My gear:



So.....it's still always haste.

[Rorixis]

yea I'm not sure whats going on either, haste values change from 13 to 10 based on 1 item switch, I guess I should just inflate the weights a bit for now to ensure i get the proper haste pieces equipped.
http://i.imgur.com/s7d8B52.jpg?1

[Woz]

Stat weights are really not that important.

There is no cap on Haste and it is the best stat, period.
Crit is the second best stat to get because of it scaling better than Mastery on 2+ targets.
Vers is the third best stat for the same reason as Crit.
Mastery is the 'worst' because of it not scaling well 2+ targets.

Ultimately; get an item with Haste and whatever secondary stat and you'll be fine. The only time stat weights come into question is when it's like 20 item level differences and the Int is a massive gain.

[Deleted]

You're right...had it at 200s - redid the sim (Patchwerk, 300s)...

You no Chrono Shard:



You with Chrono Shard:



My gear:



So.....it's still always haste.

I presume you don't use BL in sim?

[Woz]

I presume you don't use BL in sim?

Yes, Bloodlust is used. Not using Bloodlust would increase the Haste value.

[Rorixis]

Stat weights are really not that important.

There is no cap on Haste and it is the best stat, period.
Crit is the second best stat to get because of it scaling better than Mastery on 2+ targets.
Vers is the third best stat for the same reason as Crit.
Mastery is the 'worst' because of it not scaling well 2+ targets.

Ultimately; get an item with Haste and whatever secondary stat and you'll be fine. The only time stat weights come into question is when it's like 20 item level differences and the Int is a massive gain.

Well thats exactly the point of it, to compare a 840 haste item with 860 non-haste item.

[Woz]

Well thats exactly the point of it, to compare a 840 haste item with 860 non-haste item.

Then use balanced stat weights at say 865 ilvl (which is Heroic EN gear);

Haste: 1.23
Int: 1
Crit: 0.82
Vers: 0.82
Mastery: 0.78

[Kncvasdlsfui]

Why does having pursuit on autocast make it cast on any target I am in combat with and what is the best way to deal with that.

[Bridius]

Why does having pursuit on autocast make it cast on any target I am in combat with and what is the best way to deal with that.

It's not pursuit he would switch targets either way. It's because of the new pet assist they added.

/petattack
/petdefensive

This will make your pet attack just what you tell him too, no switching even if you switch targets. But you need to remember to use this macro every time you want him to attack any specific target.

[DesireKT]

It's not pursuit he would switch targets either way. It's because of the new pet assist they added.

/petattack
/petdefensive

This will make your pet attack just what you tell him too, no switching even if you switch targets. But you need to remember to use this macro every time you want him to attack any specific target.

No, it is Pursuit, if it's off CD and another target is in range he will charge it and then go back to the original target (unless you have attacked the new target enough), but it's just part of the AI having Pursuit off CD

[Bridius]

Woops sorry I thought it just had to do with him switching targets and then casting pursuit. I guess there's no way around it other than taking pursuit off auto-cast and binding it to your /petattack

[Lucrece]

Hi Woz

Just wanted to say - i switched to implosion a couple of weeks ago and it's just batshit insane - both single target and aoe. I feel like it just doesn't compare to before - at the loss of 1 GCD i am dealing massive damage now in any situation, burst and sustained. Just wanted to let you know and maybe try to adjust the guide somehow ? I don't know - i feel like too few people know about this and are still complaining about our DPS. Which can be amazing - i know mine is.

No. Don't mistake burst for sustained. Implosion's function is as a delayed aoe or burst aoe (costing you the sustained dps of the imps you sacrificed early) tool.

It's also a pain in the ass for sustained single target since you want to time the explosion at after the last volley of firebolt is done, which can clash with your rotation.

It's wonderful for questing, mythic+, and 5 man dungeons, but for raids I'll still take the alternative since there's not that many burst aoe fights in which the aoe is actually not padding (il'gynoth makes demonhunters look really good when in fact it's a ton of wasted damage on oozes that were going to explode anyways).

- - - Updated - - -

Demo lock would have so much more mobility if they trimmed Demonic Empowerment out or just made it a buff targeted on the warlock with a longer duration to not be wasting so many casts on what is essentially a maintenance buff. Less DE would also lead to less Life Tap.

[Deleted]

Does the BiS list change it at all with mythic EN drops as the list currently is based on Ilvl 865 gear.

[Deleted]

Why does having pursuit on autocast make it cast on any target I am in combat with and what is the best way to deal with that.

Hi, turn autocast off and make a macro on your petattack keybind to use pursuit when you tell your felguard to attack. like
/petattack
/cast Pursuit (Special Ability)

You can open your pet spelllbook and shift+clic the abilities you want, while having the macro tab open.

That way whenever you hit attack button felguard will use pursuit if its a)off cd b)Ouside of the minimum range of charge. Its good to get used to it too, because the random gcd from pursuit can mess up your stun timing too.