1. #13861
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    I understand this is the metric the Obama administration and Clinton use to communicate the health of our system.

    Do you think having insurance is the same thing as having access to health care? Because while the difference may be subtle to some, I think the effect is quite large in reality.
    Why do I think this isn't going to be about planned parenthood offices being shut down?
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
    Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
    The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
    No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi

  2. #13862
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    So can you at least make a point here? Are you saying YOUR costs haven't increased? Well, you're a special snowflake then, since everyone else's did. Are we arguing statistics here? Or are you really just trying to catch me in a "gotcha!" based on some nonsense anecdotal shit with nothing to back it up?
    Yeah, the point is that 100% is a false number if even one person doesn't fit.

    Why the fuck do you think scientists never say something is 100% certain? You can't really be this thick can you?

    If you don't want to get ripped into for your choice of words then try to be less hyperbolic in the future.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Because fuck you, that's why.

  3. #13863
    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    Do you think having insurance is the same thing as having access to health care? Because while the difference may be subtle to some, I think the effect is quite large in reality.
    Many doctors, especially specialists, will outright refuse to see anyone uninsured. Cost is still an issue, but access is much less of one now. That is undeniable.

  4. #13864
    Old God Captain N's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    You're the one making a claim without any evidence to back it up, sir. My claim that costs have risen is simply fact that you're attempting to ignore to make some irrelevant point. Goodluck.
    Would you like me to link your very own post claiming that 100% of people were affected by rising costs and deductibles. That onus is on you. When you say 100% are affected you need to prove 100% are affected. Now prove that...go on...we'll wait...because you won't do it.

  5. #13865
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    Do you think having insurance is the same thing as having access to health care?
    When in doubt, move goalposts.

  6. #13866
    Banned JohnBrown1917's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garnier Fructis View Post
    If you're bothered by not being able to afford a new TV because your health costs rose a bit to cover someone who previously couldn't get healthcare, consider that you might be a piece of shit.
    Oh shit, don't let the libertarians of MMO hear that!

  7. #13867
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain N View Post
    Would you like me to link your very own post claiming that 100% of people were affected by rising costs and deductibles. That onus is on you. When you say 100% are affected you need to prove 100% are affected. Now prove that...go on...we'll wait...because you won't do it.
    No, I want you to link your proof that you weren't affected by the ACA. I asked you to prove your claim, not mine.

  8. #13868
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    It's hard to argue with 10 bots at the same time. Either the argument is costs didn't go up, or costs didn't go up because of the ACA. Goalposts are shifting all over the place.
    Pot, kettle.

    It really doesn't matter in either case. The US' stupid private-centric system is stupid, we all know this.

  9. #13869
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    When in doubt, move goalposts.
    When was having 100% health insurance coverage the goal for anyone other than health insurance companies?

    You guys are the ones trying to move the goalposts, not me.

  10. #13870
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    No, I want you to link your proof that you weren't affected by the ACA. I asked you to prove your claim, not mine.
    You initially claimed 100% of people are affected, which puts the onus on you for burden of proof.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Because fuck you, that's why.

  11. #13871
    The Undying
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Here's the kicker. Trumpets are very likely to support legislation that bans transsexual people from using the bathroom not of their birth gender.
    Lol, totally. Trumpers are the most ridiculous voting base in perhaps the entire history of the United States. Dumber than a sack of hair, and more vocally annoying than an untrained parrot.

  12. #13872
    Quote Originally Posted by jackofwind View Post
    You initially claimed 100% of people are affected, which puts the onus on you for burden of proof.
    And then you made the claim that you were not one of those people, so prove it.

  13. #13873
    Old God Captain N's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    No, I want you to link your proof that you weren't affected by the ACA. I asked you to prove your claim, not mine.
    See that's the thing -- You need to prove 100% like you claimed. I could surely produce a check stub showing the $200/month charge I pay for insurance both in 2008 and again from last week. Can you produce any evidence that shows 100% of the population has been effected by these increases?

  14. #13874
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    And then you made the claim that you were not one of those people, so prove it.
    No I didn't. Can you even keep track of this conversation?

    For hilarity's sake, take a look at my location tag for proof.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Because fuck you, that's why.

  15. #13875
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain N View Post
    See that's the thing -- You need to prove 100% like you claimed. I could surely produce a check stub showing the $200/month charge I pay for insurance both in 2008 and again from last week. Can you produce any evidence that shows 100% of the population has been effected by these increases?
    The question wasn't whether your 200$/month changed when the ACA was implemented, it's whether your coverage changed.

    And the answer is yes, yes it did. Now, prove otherwise.

  16. #13876
    Herald of the Titans DocSavageFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaserSharkDFB View Post
    Oh, I never lie. I'm not good at it. I'm occasionally wrong, but I never lie. 'Peasant' was not stated but was implicit in your words, which is okay since I wasn't directly quoting. The 'exact words' defense is lame, I always feel.
    OK...I'll accept that.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaserSharkDFB View Post
    And, okay, I will admit I misinterpreted your statement about not disputing Clinton does better with the educated. My bad. Here's the thing, though: your point was that Clinton does better with the lower education crowd, which overall is marginally true; she's up 7 points. But that same survey also shows Trump does much better with whites with lower education, up by 21 points. Given Clinton's overwhelming advantage among blacks and hispanics, who are also traditionally overrepresented in the lower education category, it's most likely that those 7 points are better explained by racial tendencies than educational ones. So, your point is a bad one and poorly supported.
    All of this is moot to me and I don't understand its relevance in your mind. Not trying to trivialize here, but my point was based on the Pew Research numbers sans mental gymnastics.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaserSharkDFB View Post
    Now, we could have avoided this whole intervening mess if, when I asked you - very politely, I might add - 'please tell me what you think your link was supposed to prove,' you had just made yourself clear instead of dragging it out and thinking 'shining a light on bad logic' counts as a good explanation.
    Here's our initial exchange below. You clearly did not understand what I said initially and I honestly felt that you would if you just reread what I posted...specifically that I was referring to the fact that a majority of lower educated voters support Hillary over Trump as well (I wasn't referring to highly educated voters as you apparently assumed)...and hopefully at that point start to understand what I actually said and what I was doing. I'm sorry if asking to reread what I said somehow put you off. I don't get why it would...but hey, everybody is different.

    LaserSharkDFB: I know we've done this before, so please tell me what you think your link was supposed to prove. DW said Hillary has the advantage with the educated, especially women, and your link seems to confirm that.

    DocSavageFan: Please reread the posts in question in order from the beginning. I have faith in you.
    As for your second post (which I won't quote), it was a tad snarky and I replied in like kind....snark is my specialty.

    Peace.
    Last edited by DocSavageFan; 2016-10-13 at 09:56 PM.

  17. #13877
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    I agree, Brexit was as stupid a decision as voting for Trump.
    it was the single best thing they could have done.

  18. #13878
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    So Trump thinks that the largest conspiracy in the history of mankind is going on and it's against him. According to Trump, everyone and the dog catcher are in on this grand scheme.

    But if the country is so united against Trump, all willing to take part in this conspiracy, then what does that say about Trump?Why would the country be so united to bring around just one guy? Might it be that no one wants him within 10 miles of the White House? In that case, what makes him think that he could ever win the election?

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  19. #13879
    Quote Originally Posted by pacox View Post
    So Trump thinks that the largest conspiracy in the history of mankind is going on and it's against him.
    I thought that was Clinton, since everything bad ever written or said about her was made up by the vast right-wing conspiracy.

  20. #13880
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daerio View Post
    The question wasn't whether your 200$/month changed when the ACA was implemented, it's whether your coverage changed.

    And the answer is yes, yes it did. Now, prove otherwise.
    No, prove that 100% of people were affected. You said it first. Prove it.

    What you're doing here is literally an appeal to ignorance, which is a basic logical fallacy. Your debate skills are severely lacking.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Because fuck you, that's why.

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