Wow needs to become much much harder

[Glorious Leader]

We were here before and it didnt end well..

[tehdef]

Out of curiosity, how many subscribers do you think WoW would have if it was tuned so that the top guilds in the world found it extremely difficult?

As many as Wildstar had.

[Vetis]

WoW pre-BC was "difficult" because gear either sucked at stats or it was really hard to get, actually both, not because the game was difficult.

this. difficult does not = merely time consuming. Gearing up 40 people with so few ways to get gear and then multiple sets for different resistances it just sucked. Highest I got to in PVP was Sergeant Major and the grind felt soul sucking.

[Vampiregenesis]

The top guild in the world. 99.9% of guilds haven't even got close to finishing it

I mean you saw the instance and the story..... do you like to kill the same thing several times? i mean ok challenge and strategy are ok but there is also the story... the mystery... all the magic is not there.

[iamthedevil]

Wear old armor. Problem solved for you.

[A dot Ham]

I think blizzard overestimate the competetion element and totally ignore the storyline/fun element , i really dont know how many truly play this game just to see themselves first on wow-progress , to me at least it sounds ridiculous because you are playing against bots , if you put enough effort (play everyday) and you are decent then you are gonna make it obviously, i think most even hardcore raiders play this game for the fun and story element.

Now we are stuck with emerald nightmare for several months , this is a terrible mistake from blizzard , this is NOT a single player game , we cant just see the story in a single day , its ridiculous , the story is a big part behind the motivation of the raider , emerald nightmare is also terribly designed , blizzard treats wow like a single player game where you can see the story in different difficulties and extremely fast , it also gives the option to everyone to have great loot , loot and gold these days are totally meaningless.


Some say vanilla wasnt that hard and i may agree with them but there were other things that made it very hard to raid and achieve fast progress , some bosses took ages to die , casuals and hardcores werent so separated.


In my opinion there should be only one difficulty with a big size requirement 30+people and that difficulty should be harder than current mythic raiding and also the adventure's guide should be burned at hell , people shouldnt ever be spoiled or know anything at all about future bosses and even more so about their mechanics and strategy so it would be a mystery. That way the best guilds would have killed like 1 or 2 at most bosses right now , that way the current content would endure and keep people interested for several months until the release of nighthold.


If they want to make the most out of casuals they dont need to make wow so easy , they can simply do as i said above and increase the size of a raid by aton so a guild would have to take casuals to succeed in its goals , this would also decrease the number of guilds per server and create interesting rivalries , wow right now is a complete shit.

You're talking about cannon fodder!

I can get behind this... or in front of it I guess.

Instead self/active mitigation and/or spell shielding... physical shielding... bodies. Jump in front of the tank... and take that massive hit... you die, but hey man you did your job.

[Orange Joe]

I mean you saw the instance and the story..... do you like to kill the same thing several times? i mean ok challenge and strategy are ok but there is also the story... the mystery... all the magic is not there.

IF you don't you are playing the wrong game. I recommend a single player RPG. You don't kill bosses more than once in those.

[Aeula]

I'd rather they completely removed story content from raids and made them their own little standalone thing with generic bosses that have no baring on lore again once they're dead.

Raids are a horrible way to tell a story.

[Sansnom]

In my opinion there should be only one difficulty with a big size requirement 30+people and that difficulty should be harder than current mythic raiding and also the adventure's guide should be burned at hell , people shouldnt ever be spoiled or know anything at all about future bosses and even more so about their mechanics and strategy so it would be a mystery. That way the best guilds would have killed like 1 or 2 at most bosses right now , that way the current content would endure and keep people interested for several months until the release of nighthold.

I think Blizzards knows a lot a more about its customers than you. There use to be 40 man raids before. There isn't now. Think for a bit and ask yourself why this is the case.

[Ravex]

I think blizzard overestimate the competetion element and totally ignore the storyline/fun element , i really dont know how many truly play this game just to see themselves first on wow-progress , to me at least it sounds ridiculous because you are playing against bots , if you put enough effort (play everyday) and you are decent then you are gonna make it obviously, i think most even hardcore raiders play this game for the fun and story element.

Now we are stuck with emerald nightmare for several months , this is a terrible mistake from blizzard , this is NOT a single player game , we cant just see the story in a single day , its ridiculous , the story is a big part behind the motivation of the raider , emerald nightmare is also terribly designed , blizzard treats wow like a single player game where you can see the story in different difficulties and extremely fast , it also gives the option to everyone to have great loot , loot and gold these days are totally meaningless.


Some say vanilla wasnt that hard and i may agree with them but there were other things that made it very hard to raid and achieve fast progress , some bosses took ages to die , casuals and hardcores werent so separated.


In my opinion there should be only one difficulty with a big size requirement 30+people and that difficulty should be harder than current mythic raiding and also the adventure's guide should be burned at hell , people shouldnt ever be spoiled or know anything at all about future bosses and even more so about their mechanics and strategy so it would be a mystery. That way the best guilds would have killed like 1 or 2 at most bosses right now , that way the current content would endure and keep people interested for several months until the release of nighthold.


If they want to make the most out of casuals they dont need to make wow so easy , they can simply do as i said above and increase the size of a raid by aton so a guild would have to take casuals to succeed in its goals , this would also decrease the number of guilds per server and create interesting rivalries , wow right now is a complete shit.

Hey check out how wildstar did.

Yep.

[Ryzael]

As many as Wildstar had.

Wildstar didn't fail because it was difficult.

Adding difficulty to the game also does not mean that ALL the content has to be difficult. Good games get progressively more difficult. WoW's difficulty is flatter than a pancake.

[Awyee]

I'd rather they completely removed story content from raids and made them their own little standalone thing with generic bosses that have no baring on lore again once they're dead.

Raids are a horrible way to tell a story.

I completely disagree. Compare World of Warcraft with its spiritual successor: Dungeons and Dragons. In D&D (for the most part) you do not solve major plot points by standing around the town and handing in fetch quests, you delve deep into a dungeon or catacomb or the basement of a forgotten library or whatever, defeat whatever monster is lurking there and retrieve the item that your party needs in order to progress. It is the same concept in WoW: you do things in the world, oh no a massive monster is causing trouble we need you to go into his lair and defeat him once and for all and bring back x item.

If you do not like being asked to do some of the easiest content (LFR) in order to earn some of the lore, you do not deserve to see it. Simple as that. At worst you can watch the cutscenes/RP on youtube. Anything harder than LFR is not there for lore, but because there is a significant proportion of WoW's population that thoroughly enjoy that type of content.

[Ravex]

Wildstar didn't fail because it was difficult.

Adding difficulty to the game also does not mean that ALL the content has to be difficult. Good games get progressively more difficult. WoW's difficulty is flatter than a pancake.

Sure it didn't

[Awsyme]

Given how few people have cleared mythics or, say, the higher level of mythic + - I think its balanced just fine. My personal wishes are 'stop with the 4 raid difficulties' by at least merging normal and heroic, and balance the classes better.

[Traveler Voltin]

Wildstar didn't fail because it was difficult.

Adding difficulty to the game also does not mean that ALL the content has to be difficult. Good games get progressively more difficult. WoW's difficulty is flatter than a pancake.

yes it did.
also the 90 step attunement for raids didnt help either.

[A Chozo]

It's horribly difficult to have a hard game with a focus on group content against A.I. AND interaction with random anonymous players. Most MMO-Champion users probably could clear every single raid if it was a one-man challenge. The trick is coordinating with 9-29 other shmugs with variable skill levels.

[Ryzael]

yes it did.
also the 90 step attunement for raids didnt help either.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MMORPG/comm...nh&sh=bef61efc

This post gives a good overview of why wildstar sucked. None of it is "The game was just so dang challenging!"

[Deleted]

The beauty of blizzard games is the diversity of player skill required to fully enjoy the game.
That's why we need 4 raid and 4 dungeons difficulties, so nobody gets left behind.
Wow is as hard as it should be.

If you think Emerald Nightware is easy, think again, only 105 guilds so far cleared the content.

[Traveler Voltin]

https://www.reddit.com/r/MMORPG/comm...nh&sh=bef61efc

This post gives a good overview of why wildstar sucked. None of it is "The game was just so dang challenging!"

lol reddit.
yeah not touching it.

[Mojo03]

You sound like a smart guy

Said no one ever