DHs around the world, make your voices heard!

[Deleted]

I will keep this post short and concise, it is time that the DHs in Europe raises their voices about the current state of the class.

"A post made about 3 days ago in General Discussion voicing concerns about Havoc DH issues in a cohesive manner that opened the table for intelligent discussion has reached its thread cap. I'd like for the discussion to continue in hopes of an official acknowledgement as there are clearly some strong feelings on the matter (500 posts and a lot of consensus among demon hunters).

Here is a link to the original thread and post which mainly focused on PVE issues."

"Should be a link here."


Current state of DH ST dps. We are on 18th place out of 24 in mythic raiding. Out of all the classes ingame we are the worst ST dps class since all other classes has other speccs that perform better. This is the logs that show us it is true and can't be argued with.

"Should be a link here."


Current state of DH PvP. We are sadly underperforming even more in the PvP enviroment than the PvE enviroment where less than 3% of the community plays DH. Out of all classes DH represent 1.9% of the players that are above 2k rating in 3v3 while shaman represent 15.5%. Here is the info to back this up.

"Should be a link here."

Here is a post from the perspective of a high ranked arena DH which explains it all.

"Should be a link here."


Please community, raise your voices. Make us heard. Together we are strong!

This is a repost on what I posted on the EU forums and what I want to post on the US forums but sadly can't. Please make sure to upvote the posts I mentioned. This is my EU post. MMO-champion didn't let me post links so search on "DHs in Europe, make your voices heard!" in the europe dh forum to see full post with links.

MMO-Champion doesn't let me post links.

[Deleted]

On mmo-champion.com forums I thought most ppl agree that we're 'fine' atm.
We could be frost dks (well they'll get another buff from what I can read out of the blue posts) but so will we some time after 7.1

[madskizzles]

Dhs damage looks fine to me. What logs are you looking at?

[Jyggalag]

Current state of DH ST dps. We are on 18th place out of 24 in mythic raiding. Out of all the classes ingame we are the worst ST dps class since all other classes has other speccs that perform better. This is the logs that show us it is true and can't be argued with.

Don't know how you've managed to pull this out of your ass. If you're referring to Simcraft @865 ilvl on the front page DH are still a better ST option than both monk and deathknight DPS specs. They've a low skill cap considering how few abilities they have - making them one of the top performing specs would make rerolling and stacking them in guilds one of the most efficient way to clear mythic emerald nightmare (even though most top guilds took 2-3 in the first few world clears anyway).
They have insane, on-demand AoE through talents and are top tier in mythic+.

Poorly formed bias/opinion does not make anything you've said above true. DHs are in a great place and will continue to be throughout the expansion.

[Deleted]

Don't know how you've managed to pull this out of your ass. If you're referring to Simcraft @865 ilvl on the front page then you're ignoring the fact that DH get a flat 10% damage bonus when fighting demons, which a large portion of bosses are/will be in this demon-themed expansion. Any boss that's a demon would put DH just behind rets (who were massively worse off than DH for the best part of the expansion so far), warriors, ferals and 1 warlock spec (also largely neglected during the world first race by top guilds).

If you refer to non-demonic bosses then DH are still a better ST option than both monk and deathknight DPS specs. They've a low skill cap considering how few abilities they have - making them one of the top performing specs would make rerolling and stacking them in guilds one of the most efficient way to clear mythic emerald nightmare (even though most top guilds took 2-3 in the first few world clears anyway).
They have insane, on-demand AoE through talents and are top tier in mythic+.

Poorly formed bias/opinion does not make anything you've said above true. DHs are in a great place and will continue to be throughout the expansion.

I hope you are joking with the 10% dmg buff

[Slagge]

Current state of DH ST dps. We are on 18th place out of 24 in mythic raiding. Out of all the classes ingame we are the worst ST dps class since all other classes has other speccs that perform better. This is the logs that show us it is true and can't be argued with.

I really dont know what logs you are looking at but both on Nythendra & Ursoc (two classic ST-fights) DH´s seems to do quite good. I can easily name at least five other specs in bigger need of a ST-buff than DH´s.

Oh, and for the last part, DK´s says hai!

[Deleted]

Don't know how you've managed to pull this out of your ass. If you're referring to Simcraft @865 ilvl on the front page then you're ignoring the fact that DH get a flat 10% damage bonus when fighting demons, which a large portion of bosses are/will be in this demon-themed expansion. Any boss that's a demon would put DH just behind rets (who were massively worse off than DH for the best part of the expansion so far), warriors, ferals and 1 warlock spec (also largely neglected during the world first race by top guilds).

If you refer to non-demonic bosses then DH are still a better ST option than both monk and deathknight DPS specs. They've a low skill cap considering how few abilities they have - making them one of the top performing specs would make rerolling and stacking them in guilds one of the most efficient way to clear mythic emerald nightmare (even though most top guilds took 2-3 in the first few world clears anyway).
They have insane, on-demand AoE through talents and are top tier in mythic+.

Poorly formed bias/opinion does not make anything you've said above true. DHs are in a great place and will continue to be throughout the expansion.

I agree with some of your points and would say we are in a decent place, but coming here making those claims without backing them up makes you look like an asshole.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...7&difficulty=4
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...7&difficulty=4

This is our current single target performance. Our skill cap isn't higher or lower than other classes, we have less buttons to press but the momentum playstyle requires effort and thinking just like other specs do. In some situations, for example small hitboxes or dangerous environmental effects it requires even more effort or isn't even possible to properly pull of which is a very frustrating experience.

And please tell us where you pulled your 10% damage buff fantasy out of.

[Deleted]

They've a low skill cap considering how few abilities they have - making them one of the top performing specs would make rerolling and stacking them in guilds one of the most efficient way to clear mythic emerald nightmare (even though most top guilds took 2-3 in the first few world clears anyway).

It's always funny to read this nonsense from people who clearly never played a DH above level 100. I've been playing wow since vanilla and havoc DH is by faaaaaar the hardest specc I've ever played. Being forced to reposition yourself every few seconds can't even be compared to hitting 2 or 3 more buttons in your rotation.
Oh, and this 10% against demons...well, you just made it up, doesn't exist

[Fayolynn]

This is our current single target performance. Our skill cap isn't higher or lower than other classes, we have less buttons to press but the momentum playstyle requires effort and thinking just like other specs do. In some situations, for example small hitboxes or dangerous environmental effects it requires even more effort or isn't even possible to properly pull of which is a very frustrating experience.

Not saying you are wrong. Can you provide examples?

[Deleted]

Not saying you are wrong. Can you provide examples?

Well you rush out of range all the time on small mobs if you don't use some sort of macro or you cannot rush because certain mechanics prevent it, like fire all over the place, having to be at a certain range to your fellow players,..

[Jyggalag]

And please tell us where you pulled your 10% damage buff fantasy out of.

My bad - was mistakenly referring to the 20% damage buff from killing a demon. Doesn't take away from the fact that DH are still better off than monks and DKs atm. Demon Blades performs better than Prepared currently so your point about having to risk survival for DPS isn't as big as you make it out to be. Most classes are jealous of the insane mobility which they see as a fair trade off.

[Fayolynn]

Well you rush out of range all the time on small mobs if you don't use some sort of macro or you cannot rush because certain mechanics prevent it, like fire all over the place, having to be at a certain range to your fellow players...

I'm just trying to picture any specific boss fight where it would be impossible to use rush.

[Jyggalag]

It's always funny to read this nonsense from people who clearly never played a DH above level 100. I've been playing wow since vanilla and havoc DH is by faaaaaar the hardest specc I've ever played. Being forced to reposition yourself every few seconds can't even be compared to hitting 2 or 3 more buttons in your rotation.
Oh, and this 10% against demons...well, you just made it up, doesn't exist

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...rkanz/advanced

Nothing to write home about but as you can see i have definitely played a DH above 100. Saying DH is the most difficult DPS spec is the most hilarious thing I'll read today.

[Underverse]

Sounds like more whining and self-entitlement. DHs are fine. You don't need to organize a protest every time you see a DH doing 50 less dps than the next guy.

[Traxex9080]

It's always funny to read this nonsense from people who clearly never played a DH above level 100. I've been playing wow since vanilla and havoc DH is by faaaaaar the hardest specc I've ever played. Being forced to reposition yourself every few seconds can't even be compared to hitting 2 or 3 more buttons in your rotation.
Oh, and this 10% against demons...well, you just made it up, doesn't exist

This 100%. I've played shamans, hunters, rogues, paladins, DKs, and priests all at max level in old heroic/mythic raiding and Demon Hunters by far have been the most challenging just because of Momentum. The constant repositioning and awareness of everything going on in the fight so you don't rush into something that kills you makes up for the fact that we have only 4 main buttons. People underestimate the difficulty of positioning for min/maxing damage while also managing momentum buff. But to be honest, no class in the game is "hard" anymore. The only thing I consider "hard" is the constant pressure and stress of healing.

For now, demon hunters are a glorified mythic + class along with DKs. I'll leave the raiding up to the spriests shamans monks hunters and mages since there's no reason to take a demon hunters over these classes :^)

[Deleted]

I'm just trying to picture any specific boss fight where it would be impossible to use rush.

Mythic+ bosses.

[jayinjersey]

Here we go again.
I main a DH and I cannot get behind saying since we don't have another dps spec to switch to in order to do more damage, our single dps spec has to be the best and that's the only logical conclusion to your "they can just switch" argument

[Deleted]

Most classes are jealous of the insane mobility which they see as a fair trade off.

Playing a demon hunter I actually agree, but maybe give us a talent choice to trade in some mobility or tone it down so we don't have to suffer in other aspects as much.

[Fayolynn]

Mythic+ bosses.

All of them?

[kaelleria]

Mythic+ bosses.

I haven't really found any M+ bosses that prevent you from fel rushing... You just need to know the fights.