Absentee ballots burned in the NC GOP office fire

[Provenance]

Voting in this country should require an ID, period. Any argument contrary to that is just complete and total bullshit. All voter ID cards should be subsidized at both the Federal and State level. Every person that is 18 and a certified American citizen should be able to obtain a Voter ID card free of charge from their state election board. Period, end of story, not open for debate.

How dare you suggest we make it "harder" to vote for the "disenfranchised"?!

[kaelleria]

Well, that's the point, so working as intended.

Except for the fact that the majority of voter ID laws took effect more than halfway through the time period studied....

[Provenance]

There's very little fraud anywhere... Most of the supposed "fraud" is actually clerical errors. When you're looking at 35 known cases in 834 million you're talking about .0000042% of votes cast.

If anything voter ID laws have actually suppressed turnout.
http://www.gao.gov/assets/670/665966.pdf

Let me fix that for you.

[Endus]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

[kaelleria]

Let me fix that for you.

Actually that was credible cases. If you go over the list of cases that the Trump campaign has cited in terms of voter fraud, they're actually very easy to discredit with a simple google search.

[Daelak]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

I love it, the token conservatives literally de-railed 2nd post.

[petej0]

Finger Printing ballots.

[GennGreymane]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

UUuuuhhh.... I wonder who started the fire now.

[Kantalope]

As an NC resident (from the same county as this occured in, even), you send a filled out form request for absentee ballots directly to the Board of Elections. They then mail you the ballot and you mail it directly back to them. I see no way that the GOP office would be able to obtain completed absentee ballots.

The only "legitimate" source I've found that mentions the absentee ballots in the GOP office is NBC and has since been redacted. Every other "source" is some bat shit crazy left wing propaganda site, like the ones linked in this thread. They're about as valid as anything David Wolfe has to say about health and medicine.

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31 cases of fraud in a billion votes is preferable over a single person that wants to vote but cannot vote because he cannot obtain voter ID.

The people you speak of that have a difficult time obtaining identifications tend to be the type of people that don't move around the country or even the state. They have had literally YEARS to find the time to procure one, and still don't manage?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

The original article was still there and found and archived so that info isn't gone.

[AndaliteBandit]

As an NC resident (from the same county as this occured in, even), you send a filled out form request for absentee ballots directly to the Board of Elections. They then mail you the ballot and you mail it directly back to them. I see no way that the GOP office would be able to obtain completed absentee ballots.

The only "legitimate" source I've found that mentions the absentee ballots in the GOP office is NBC and has since been redacted. Every other "source" is some bat shit crazy left wing propaganda site, like the ones linked in this thread. They're about as valid as anything David Wolfe has to say about health and medicine.

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The people you speak of that have a difficult time obtaining identifications tend to be the type of people that don't move around the country or even the state. They have had literally YEARS to find the time to procure one, and still don't manage?

As a NC resident, what is your opinion of your state's voter ID law and why it was struck down?

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/ar...-black-voters/

North Carolina’s bill extended beyond requiring a state-issued photo ID at the polls. The law cut early voting days and banned same-day voter registration, eliminated straight-ticket voting, which allows voters to choose all candidates from a single party by checking one box; and introduced more restrictions on casting provisional ballots. It prohibited pre-registration for 16- and 17-year-olds, who previously were allowed to indicate their intent to vote when applying for a driver’s license. The law also allowed for more poll watchers and made it easier to challenge voters or their ballots.

The court said that in crafting the law, the Republican-controlled general assembly requested and received data on voters’ use of various voting practices by race. It found that African American voters in North Carolina are more likely to vote early, use same-day voter registration and straight-ticket voting. They were also disproportionately less likely to have an ID, more likely to cast a provisional ballot and take advantage of pre-registration.

Then, the court, said, lawmakers restricted all of these voting options, and further narrowed the list of acceptable voter IDs. “… [W]ith race data in hand, the legislature amended the bill to exclude many of the alternative photo IDs used by African Americans. As amended, the bill retained only the kinds of IDs that white North Carolinians were more likely to possess.”

[Annoying]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

I'm not even sure how they had completed absentee ballots there. Here every part of that process is done through the mail, and I don't know how they could go from the post office to a GOP office. Even looking at NC, everything goes through their county board of elections.

[breadisfunny]

All of what you posted should NOT be allowed. There should be agreed upon NATIONAL standards. I love state rights, but voting should fall under the guidance of the Federal govt. just like Passports do.

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Sure there is - the entire issue is workable. You don't let the states dictate the rules. You use federal guidance. You force the states to adhere to that. The states could still determine such things as early voting, but ALL voting would require an ID with a specific ID number (just like a passport). That way you could still have absentee ballots, mail-in ballots, etc.

i agree voting should be a non issue in terms of corruption and voter fraud and voter i.d. if implemented properly and correctly is one potential solution but dismissing all other potential solutions because you don't agree is childish.

[Kantalope]

As a NC resident, what is your opinion of your state's voter ID law and why it was struck down?

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/ar...-black-voters/

North Carolina’s bill extended beyond requiring a state-issued photo ID at the polls. The law cut early voting days and banned same-day voter registration, eliminated straight-ticket voting, which allows voters to choose all candidates from a single party by checking one box; and introduced more restrictions on casting provisional ballots. It prohibited pre-registration for 16- and 17-year-olds, who previously were allowed to indicate their intent to vote when applying for a driver’s license. The law also allowed for more poll watchers and made it easier to challenge voters or their ballots.

The court said that in crafting the law, the Republican-controlled general assembly requested and received data on voters’ use of various voting practices by race. It found that African American voters in North Carolina are more likely to vote early, use same-day voter registration and straight-ticket voting. They were also disproportionately less likely to have an ID, more likely to cast a provisional ballot and take advantage of pre-registration.

Then, the court, said, lawmakers restricted all of these voting options, and further narrowed the list of acceptable voter IDs. “… [W]ith race data in hand, the legislature amended the bill to exclude many of the alternative photo IDs used by African Americans. As amended, the bill retained only the kinds of IDs that white North Carolinians were more likely to possess.”

There should be identification required to vote. But the way they attempted to implement the law was blatantly discriminatory by virtue of everything else tacked on.

You have a constitutional right to own a firearm. Try purchasing one (legally) without any ID and see how far that gets you.

I also don't live in the rural, sister fucking area of NC. I'm a graduate student who lives in a college town. This area of the state is quite blue, whereas anywhere outside the city is very red, and where the type of people that clearly don't want minorities voting live.

[cubby]

Wrong - it is the Democrats and the illegal vote.

Wrong - it's the GOP disenfranchising minorities.

No use in going back and forth on this, this should NOT be a partisan issue. This is something that this entire country, regardless of political affiliation, should DEMAND of their elected representatives.

(BTW - I send a letter 2x a year to my US senators demanding this type of legislation.)

It shouldn't - but the solution (even though evidence tells us we don't need one) has to one in which everyone can get a card. And the devil is in the details. It's why a state issued ID card isn't required because, for many people, it's difficult to get.

[starlord]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

GOP committing voter fraud while crying about a different form of voter fraud, can't say i'm surprised.
the whole situation is very bizarre though. there is probably a lot more to this story we have yet to uncover.

[cubby]

Not sure why we're talking about voter ID to begin with, here.

The story is how Emily Weeks seemingly admitted that the GOP were breaking federal law by keeping completed absentee ballots in the office, something they'd almost certainly have no reason to do unless they were committing voter fraud. The kind that voter ID would do nothing to prevent.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/10/1...iding-ballots/

Interesting. If they were blank, then why did they have them. And if they were completed, then why aren't we arresting them.

Good point, however, that voter ID would do nothing to prevent this kind of ballot fraud.

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This is bullshit. There should be no special ID for voting. Your driver license should be enough.

And other forms of ID, as stipulated by the states.

[Vargur]

Voting in this country should require an ID, period. Any argument contrary to that is just complete and total bullshit. All voter ID cards should be subsidized at both the Federal and State level. Every person that is 18 and a certified American citizen should be able to obtain a Voter ID card free of charge from their state election board. Period, end of story, not open for debate.

Well what are you guys using to vote? Here you must have an ID on you and to be listed to your respective location of voting, usually schools.

[Xar226]

Why is it that folks like you automatically think "minorities" are fucking idiots and incapable of doing anything? Why is it that only "whites" are smart enough to figure out how to do things? BTW - you left out the elderly. I always hear how it disenfranchises them as well. /rolleyes

It has nothing to do with being an idiot. Don't put words in my mouth.

It takes literally two seconds on Google to find article after article, expert after expert, about the disproportionate affects of voter ID laws on minorities. The fact that you don't want to find it and have to resort to strawman arguments has exactly one conclusion: You know it blows your argument to shit, so you don't want to see the facts.

Does "la la la la can't hear you" usually work pretty well in your life?

And you're right, I did forget the elderly who have mobility/transportation issues. If you think that makes your argument better, you're not paying attention.

(For anybody whose entire strategy does not revolve around sticking their head in the sand, here is one such article, including links to other articles, studies and legal documents: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/ar...y-about-fraud/. It was chosen at random. It's not hard to find others.)

i never claimed I had found THE solution - I was just offering a possibility. All YOU offered was complete negativity and and "it will never work" rhetoric.

Because it won't. And frankly I already proved it to anybody paying attention, but I'll go ahead and break it down further for you.

We could not do better to help people get an ID than the work we do every ten years for the Census. It literally has hundreds of thousands of people going door-to-door, which eliminates any possible concerns about travel, ability to get off work, etc. US population is about 320 million. African Americans are about 10% of the population: 32,000,000. The Census' own estimate says they undercount black people by 2.1%. That's 672,000 people missing. And we haven't added in any other group which is undercounted, nor the fact that simply not being undercounted doesn't mean you, specifically, are counted -- which is kind of the point here, and which includes whites too, before you completely miss the point yet again and hurt yourself rolling your eyes like you have said anything insightful.

Oh, and it's actually worse than that, because simply using the Census undercounting metrics ignore the fact that access to the forms does not mean you get your ID. You still need paperwork that minorities disproportionately do not have, and estimates I have seen put the number of voters that would be disenfranchised higher.

But hey, we'll ignore that number for now and just go with the three quarters of a million even though it is a wild underestimate. How many cases of voter fraud have there been again? Hell, go on back to the 60s when we have some actual evidence of it and use that in your tally too. I'll wait.

You find me some plan that achieves better success than spending $18 billion dollars and going door to door and still missing well more than three quarters of a million people, I'll sign up. If we knew how we would already be doing it, so I'm not holding my breath.

The fact that the only thing you can do is pound your fist and CAPITALIZE THINGS because that must MEAN YOU'RE RIGHT would be another reason not to hold my breath.

Honestly, it is people like you that prevent things from getting done. You would rather sit around and complain than try to find solutions.

I told you exactly my position: You need to do the most good and the least harm. You have come absolutely nowhere close to a plan that does more good than harm, so you're right, I am actively trying to prevent you from "getting it done" and hurting people. I'm not particularly sorry about that.

[Annoying]

Well what are you guys using to vote? Here you must have an ID on you and to be listed to your respective location of voting, usually schools.

Our names. I literally walk up to the polling place and say "I'm <my name>, give me my ballot, please." And then they give it to me. The only stipulation is in registration. In my state, the first time you register to vote in that state, you do have to give ID and proof of residency.