Rome is literally America or why Sargon of Akkad should not be taken seriously

[Wildtree]

3. Welfare defined by the Romans is considerably different to what welfare is in the US. In Rome "welfare" was the rich giving stuff to the poor in order to gather sympathy from them and achieve their political ambitions. The key difference between both is that the Roman "welfare" was private whereas in the US welfare is managed publicly by the goverment and you are recieving it regardless of the political ambitions of an individual or a group and no longer has the same effect.

Inaccurate...
First of all, Rome what? The empire in it's entirety? Rome the capital of the empire?
Let's talk about welfare of Rome for a moment, the city...
Fresh running water for about one million citizen, provided by the government.
Various entertainment (the largest venue being the Colosseum) and social improvements (bath houses / pools) for the citizens of Rome.
Even brothels were provided.
Of course, people conquered somewhere in some remote province of another country did not receive the same welfare, but that only points to the complexity of the matter and how it cannot be answered with a couple sentences. Starts already with the different tiers/classes of Roman citizenship.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

When dealing with intellectuals and even psuedo-intellectuals it important to understand the motivation and foundation of motivation. The origin of thought. Why do they feel the way they do? Why do they think the way they do?

What I have garnered from your post, and your reaction to his post is that you feel some sort of need to dominate, to claim superiority in the same way this youtuber feels that putting himself on a platform and gandstanding will soothe his ego. This most ancient of balms is in fact actually vitriol.

Before you react, before you post, before you flame and troll ask yourself, "Why am I doing this?" If you believe you are making the world a better place by posting, flaming, or even trolling then by all means proceed. If you proceed out of spite or to boost your ego then please just stop.

The only thing worse than the inevitable intellectual circle jerk that will ensue is the people who post out of fear, whose entire lives are defined and forged by fear, who typically cling to some god or other form of idolatry. Finally, beware of comparisons between Rome and really any empire, America I can assure you is neither it is in fact an Ironic Empire. A farce, a masquerade, a show that can be cancelled at any moment and because of this difference between modern day and antiquity it should be taken even more seriously.

TLDR:Blowhards blow harder.

[Lady Dragonheart]

The comparison really only works in the shallowest sense that,

We, like all civilizations before us, are ultimately doomed.

The ability to draw parallels with Rome is purely because Rome has a lot of first hand documentation and looms large among the Western Imagination.

But really the comparisons are only illustratively useful.

That's like saying "Everyone dies, therefore life is pointless and you should focus on your inevitable death for the duration of your life."

[starlord]

people have been making this comparison since forever, the barbarian hordes havent overwhelmed us yet.


also, random people on youtube are serious buisness.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

That's like saying "Everyone dies, therefore life is pointless and you should focus on your inevitable death for the duration of your life."

Sounds incredibly depressing. I have enough of that in my life, don't need more. >.>

[Lady Dragonheart]

Sounds incredibly depressing. I have enough of that in my life, don't need more. >.>

Agreed. It's a very nihilistic way to look at things, which is very bland and gloomy to begin with.

[jimboa24]

By total coincidence, Fox News had an opinion piece that covered the same idea, except its conclusions were (surprisingly) far more reasonable. Here's a choice pull quote:

We are nowhere near that point. The barbarians are not at the gate. Whoever wins the election, the country will go on to debate its differences peacefully and politically. The loser will get a TV show or a foundation and the winner is likely to face a Congress reawakened to the exercise of its powers. And before you know it, we’ll be handicapping the midterm elections of 2018.

[Rizendragon]

4. More of Sargon of Akkad's belief in destiny. I'm assuming by economic reforms Sargon is refering to welfare or redistribution of wealth by that matter ,thus JFK according to Sargon of Akkad was killed . However if that was true then Roosevelt would've died since that guy passed a lot of wellfare-y stuff and I can't recall him dying while in power.

FDR died 1 month into his 4th term as US president. He was old and had several health issues by that point though. His death was sudden, but not really unexpected after everything he had been through.

[Fojos]

Oh we know, you love multiculturalism.

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people have been making this comparison since forever, the barbarian hordes havent overwhelmed us yet.


also, random people on youtube are serious buisness.

Say that to parts of Europe.

[NED funded]

FDR died 1 month into his 4th term as US president. He was old and had several health issues by that point though. His death was sudden, but not really unexpected after everything he had been through.

Thanks forgot that. I'll edit it right now.

[Logwyn]

noted intellectual Sargon of Akkad

Umm.. Who? First I've heard of this guy.

[StayTuned]

Sargon's not always technically correct on what he says, but he has never backed off when challenged in a constructive way. So if you guys feel like any of his ideas are wrong, write him on Twitter and he'll respond. Just as a hint to all people who want to discuss him and criticize him. This way you reach whom you address.

Anyway, as others have said. Personally I didn't agree with all points of his Rome video; however, I must say that most of what he said is quite correct. The grander comparison between Rome, as an empire which has failed, and the USA is quite spot on. Apart from a very few selected countries like North Korea, where didn't the USA meddle with? Or where do they not hold at least some sort of respectable power? Just as Rome, the USA has bitten off more than it can apparently chew.

Now, I do not believe that the USA will end up in the same spot as the Empire of Rome, but I think the direction we're taking globally is dangerous. There's so much BS going on right now, many of it coming from the USA directly, or by proxy.

And that's what basically Sargon is all about. Calling out BS wherever it comes from. Sometimes he sees things wrong, but more often than not quite right. Right now, Anti-SJW and America videos are trending, so it's natural that Sargon, The Amazing Atheist and others jump on the same bandwagon. Their subs and views have gone up drastically since then... that's how they make their living.

[Templar 331]

1. It's on the beginning of the video in which he states the "origins" of the Roman kingdom.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeneas...and_literature

That was the origin myth of the time. No where did he say he believed it. He is setting up the comparison from the point of view of the nations being compared.

2. "And both fullfiled their manifest destiny". He states it as a fact, meaning he believes that the USA was destined to conquer the continent.

Again, he is setting this up from the point of view of the ones being compared. Romans and Americans believed at their times that they should control certain parts of the world and both attained that goal.

3. Every politician claims to listen to the interests of the general public, the comparison has to be backed by something, in this case by policy. In addition in other videos he genuinely believes trump will cause a shift in power.

And he would be right. It wouldn't be a good shift but it would happen.

5. You literally taking my title too literally. I used hyperbole to make a catching title.

Which is disingenuous. Hence a straw man.

[Kraenen]

What I don't get is why a guy calling himself "Sargon of Akkad" would do nothing but make videos about the supremacy of Western civilization.

That's true - he should've named himself "super america happy cowboy patriot" in order to make "Western supremacist" videos (????)

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people have been making this comparison since forever, the barbarian hordes havent overwhelmed us yet.


also, random people on youtube are serious buisness.

You know about the barbarians in Rome being part of the empire right?

[Slybak]

LOL @ the idea of Trump being a modern Gaius Gracchus.

[NED funded]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeneas...and_literature

That was the origin myth of the time. No where did he say he believed it. He is setting up the comparison from the point of view of the nations being compared.




Again, he is setting this up from the point of view of the ones being compared. Romans and Americans believed at their times that they should control certain parts of the world and both attained that goal.



And he would be right. It wouldn't be a good shift but it would happen.




Which is disingenuous. Hence a straw man.

1. He is comparing a myth to reality?
2. Where does he say that? Or is it some subtext I'm missing?
3.he states a shift in power from oligarchy to a liberal democracy. The study he quotes to determine that the US is an oligarchy states the US is an oligarchy, because corporate interests and elite are much more effective in passing preferable policy. Trump's proposals as far as I know do not address this issue.

[waitwutt]

The last video I saw from him he was explaining why he's a liberal, this was a while ago. When did he drink the alt-right kool-aid?

he was pro Bernie. liberal in Europe is a bit different than liberal here

[Mister Cheese]

Bitching on a forum about him solves nothing. Debate him yourself.

[Theodarzna]

I concede point 1 since I really haven't read on labor disruption caused by technology in a while, but STEM should be a safe bet in terms of labor security.
On the second point I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying. The US is an oligarchy because corporate interests drives policy, the fact that this policy has popular support only makes the process easier. The corporate interests in the case of Trump are companies that benefit from not having to face competition and right now they are the ones drafting Trump's plan.

I think STEM jobs are not a panacea.

One is that their would exist a ton of bad STEM people only in it for the income. So we would have a lot useless "mathematicians," for example simply in it for income. More over we would not have solved the issue of chronic job insecurity, and indeed funneling displaced workers to STEM fields would be a false promise, for the more of them there are flooding that market the worse the pay and the worse the job security. The issue is not solved.

I understand that the US is an Oligarchy, I just disagree with this notion that that Oligarchy wants Donald Trump to be president. It is absolutely the case, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that every institutional structure of power from corporate interests, hedge funds, Wall Street, politicians, and commerce oriented power cliques both want Clinton but more importantly they actually want Free Trade, its the general public that is against it. If companies would benefit from Trump they certainly have put the chips on Clinton, and no I do not think it is out of some kindness or whatever.

Trump right now represents the victims of Globalization, even if he is a fraud.

[JohnBrown1917]

Oh we know, you love multiculturalism.

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Say that to parts of Europe.

What parts? And are you European?