Blizzard is a game developer, not a licensed medical professional.

[HumbleDuck]

Blizzard is making the game for you as much as it's making it for those who you claim to be mentally unstable.
If there is a demand by a large portion of the player base, meeting that demand is only the logical step to take by the developer. The reasons behind said demand being created is irrelevant to blizzard because as you put it, blizzard is not a licensed medical professional. ( And I can assume neither are you)
Now I personally think all content should have at least one queable difficulty. Locking people out of 3 dungeons is not a smart move imo.

[Deleted]

There's absolutely no good reason to have mythic dungeons (not mythic+) off the dungeon finder. Hell, even the most used comeback when people are complaining about it not being on the dungeon finder is that you should just use the group finder.

Absolutely no good reason not to have them in the dungeon finder.

[Snuffleupagus]

There's absolutely no good reason to have mythic dungeons (not mythic+) off the dungeon finder. Hell, even the most used comeback when people are complaining about it not being on the dungeon finder is that you should just use the group finder.

Absolutely no good reason not to have them in the dungeon finder.

Blizzard would rather not deal with people crying that their group sucks and they can't clear Mythic0.

Auto-group = People see Blizzard as responsible for failure (QQ LFD put me with bad healer even though I stand in fire)
Player-made group = Players are responsible (Wow, I had to carry these retards nver grouping with them again)

[Deleted]

Blizzard would rather not deal with people crying that their group sucks and they can't clear Mythic0.

Oh so all those millions of people who have said millions of times that mythics in Legion are no harder than heroics in WoD were lying?

[kary]

This belief comes from past events. Cata 5-man heroics, for example. They were difficult and the community heavily complained. They were queuable content, and the playerbase expected to be able to complete it and a vocal enough group of them ended up getting things changed.
Personal experience? The content wasn't hard. It just required coordination -- CC, mainly. But so many people couldn't handle this... and they raged!

So, yeah, that's where that belief comes from.



No, I'm not. Check the first line in that quote. "... not all people who use matchmaking have enough skill for...". I'm not saying that it's everyone. One would expect that heroic and mythic raiders use matchmaking as much as solo players or the lower-middle range players.

But there is a large amount of low-end players that rely on matchmaking for content that they can complete. The dynamic exists for a reason. Harder content requires a very slightly larger amount of effort to access. It's a natural barrier, and it works perfectly.

I remember solo farming cata heroics as a blood DK.
As a class inherently allergic to CC, it made things easier since you never relied on CC.

.....learned to kite though!

[TITAN308]

Why would a tank or healer join your 830 group when they can get 3 860+ dps within 5 seconds? That is the real hurdle people face. Mythics are a buyers market.

Then... again... create your own and find like minded people.

Or heaven forbid... use General chat... O_o

[Snuffleupagus]

Oh so all those millions of people who have said millions of times that mythics in Legion are no harder than heroics in WoD were lying?

What millions of people? The ones you made up, or the handful of people who want to stroke their own cocks about how "skilled" they are?

Mythics in Legion are like Mythics in WoD. Outgearing the damn thing in less than two weeks is why people think it's easy.

Go into one now with Heroic 5 man gear (820?) and tell me it's anything like a WoD heroic.

[Katchii]

Then... again... create your own and find like minded people.

Or heaven forbid... use General chat... O_o

My line of thinking goes like this: WoW is a game, I play games for fun, and there are more games than WoW out there for me to play and I find many of them just as entertaining as WoW. I do not have some hugely vested interest in WoW, I just want to play. Other games have ways to get into the vast majority of their content using a LFG tool, no premade groups required. The content where a pre-made is required is just the more difficult version of the regular stuff. Currently, WoW is locking a large portion of the end-game behind a pre-made requirement (Mythic Dungeons primarily).

Getting into or creating a pre-made requires effort (I know...oh the humanity....), but when I honestly just see this as a game (and other games already HAVE this option), any level of effort beyond pressing a button to get into a queue...that would also be filled with like minded people, is more than I'm willing to do. Actually that's not entirely accurate, because other games make it easier to get into their content and I like playing them, when WoW puts up a barrier, I'll just go somewhere else, because again, I don't HAVE to play WoW, I'd just like to because I enjoy it. I'm not asking for the content to be any easier than it is now...I just want an easier way to get into the content. Applying to 10+ groups or babysitting a self made group for 40+ minutes without being able to actually play the game in the meantime, is not fun.

[Hctaz]

If everyone makes their own group there would be no groups. Bad argument is bad.

Are... you serious? If somebody is tired of the absurd ilvl requirements then they make their own group. The other people with 835 ilvl CAN JUST JOIN THAT GROUP LOL

[TITAN308]

My line of thinking goes like this: WoW is a game, I play games for fun, and there are more games than WoW out there for me to play and I find many of them just as entertaining as WoW. I do not have some hugely vested interest in WoW, I just want to play. Other games have ways to get into the vast majority of their content using a LFG tool, no premade groups required. The content where a pre-made is required is just the more difficult version of the regular stuff. Currently, WoW is locking a large portion of the end-game behind a pre-made requirement (Mythic Dungeons primarily).

Getting into or creating a pre-made requires effort (I know...oh the humanity....), but when I honestly just see this as a game (and other games already HAVE this option), any level of effort beyond pressing a button to get into a queue...that would also be filled with like minded people, is more than I'm willing to do. Actually that's not entirely accurate, because other games make it easier to get into their content and I like playing them, when WoW puts up a barrier, I'll just go somewhere else, because again, I don't HAVE to play WoW, I'd just like to because I enjoy it. I'm not asking for the content to be any easier than it is now...I just want an easier way to get into the content. Applying to 10+ groups or babysitting a self made group for 40+ minutes without being able to actually play the game in the meantime, is not fun.

And that is fine.

I don't like brussels sprouts, so I don't eat them.

However I don' go around demanding companies make brussel sprouts taste like chocolate instead.

The problem with your argument is that running mythics is not some grand task in psycology. You are making it one.

That is your fault, not Blizzards.

Yea there is a fine line between wanting something as a customer and then being as lazy as humanly possible and then wanting a game company to program based on your faults.

[Katchii]

Are... you serious? If somebody is tired of the absurd ilvl requirements then they make their own group. The other people with 835 ilvl CAN JUST JOIN THAT GROUP LOL

I think he's taking it to the extreme. If literally EVERYONE made their own group, you'd have no people to join your group...because they'd all be making their own. It's a totally unrealistic argument about an extremely unlikely scenario, but it is a true statement.

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And that is fine.

I don't like brussels sprouts, so I don't eat them.

However I don' go around demanding companies make brussel sprouts taste like chocolate instead.

The problem with your argument is that running mythics is not some grand task in psycology. You are making it one.

That is your fault, not Blizzards.

Yea there is a fine line between wanting something as a customer and then being as lazy as humanly possible and then wanting a game company to program based on your faults.

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for all content, but especially Mythics (Not Mythic +'s) since Blizzard is pushing so hard on them, to be in the Dungeon Finder. I'm not asking to change the difficulty, just let me get into it easier..... I mean that's practically what I'm already TRYING to do by going to the GROUP FINDER and hitting a dozen buttons, several times, in the hope of getting accepted into a group. Putting it into the Dungeon Finder would make it so I just had to hit one and then wait....

I'm not asking them to "change the flavor" I just want easier access to the flavors that are already there.

I don't understand what you're trying to say about the whole Mythics being a grand task in Psychology. It's just a dungeon, it's just a game...I get it. My problem is that I want to experience them, have applied to literally hundreds of groups and been denied or ignored by 100% of them, and am only interest in having FUN in this game. Getting denied by 100s of Group Finder groups is absolutely not fun, and making my own takes a level of time and effort I just don't care to invest...I've been there done that, in this game before LFG was implemented and in several others. Other games that I also enjoy let me play all the content I want to play in a manner
I like. I like WoW, and would sometimes rather be playing it, but as I said, if it's too much "work" I'll just go play another game equally entertaining that doesn't make just getting to the content a chore.

It was Blizzards choice to implement Mythics in this way, so that's on them, not me.

[TITAN308]

I think he's taking it to the extreme. If literally EVERYONE made their own group, you'd have no people to join your group...because they'd all be making their own. It's a totally unrealistic argument about an extremely unlikely scenario, but it is a true statement.

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I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for all content, but especially Mythics (Not Mythic +'s) since Blizzard is pushing so hard on them, to be in the Dungeon Finder. I'm not asking to change the difficulty, just let me get into it easier..... I mean that's practically what I'm already TRYING to do by going to the GROUP FINDER and hitting a dozen buttons, several times, in the hope of getting accepted into a group. Putting it into the Dungeon Finder would make it so I just had to hit one and then wait....

I'm not asking them to "change the flavor" I just want easier access to the flavors that are already there.

I don't understand what you're trying to say about the whole Mythics being a grand task in Psychology. It's just a dungeon, it's just a game...I get it. My problem is that I want to experience them, have applied to literally hundreds of groups and been denied or ignored by 100% of them, and am only interest in having FUN in this game. Getting denied by 100s of Group Finder groups is absolutely not fun, and making my own takes a level of time and effort I just don't care to invest...I've been there done that, in this game before LFG was implemented and in several others. Other games that I also enjoy let me play all the content I want to play in a manner
I like. I like WoW, and would sometimes rather be playing it, but as I said, if it's too much "work" I'll just go play another game equally entertaining that doesn't make just getting to the content a chore.

It was Blizzards choice to implement Mythics in this way, so that's on them, not me.

Access is already easy, so that is where you argument falls a part.

You don't want easy. You want automated.

[Deleted]

What millions of people? The ones you made up, or the handful of people who want to stroke their own cocks about how "skilled" they are?

Yeah, I guess all the results when searching for people complaining about how mythics are easy or comparing mythics to WoD heroics, on pretty much any WoW-related forum, and in videos, are "made up" or "cock strokers". Fair enough.

You want automated.

What's the point in having mythics be "easy" on the group finder instead of having them "automated" on the dungeon finder? Could you please explain what the actual point there is?

Aside from the elitism and ilvl discrimination, of course.

[kary]

Yeah, I guess all the results when searching for people complaining about how mythics are easy or comparing mythics to WoD heroics, on pretty much any WoW-related forum, and in videos, are "made up" or "cock strokers". Fair enough.



What's the point in having mythics be "easy" on the group finder instead of having them "automated" on the dungeon finder? Could you please explain what the actual point there is?

Aside from the elitism and ilvl discrimination, of course.

It's almost like there's something stopping you from making a group with your peers.

[TITAN308]

It's almost like there's something stopping you from making a group with your peers.

Excuses. That is what all the arguments are at their core.

"I don't want to because..."

"I can't because..."

One is a personal choice, the other is a lie.

Again, Blizzard are game programmers, not therapists.

[Tackhisis]

There is no purpose in manual grouping tools in MMOs. Every player should have a fair selection of opportunities for his skill and gear level, and those should be provided by automatic, anonymous, grouping tool. Players of the same roles should not compete with each other.

[TITAN308]

There is no purpose in manual grouping tools in MMOs. Every player should have a fair selection of opportunities for his skill and gear level, and those should be provided by automatic, anonymous, grouping tool. Players of the same roles should not compete with each other.

What if I don't want to carry you?

You are literally wanting them to find a way to program "skill" into an automated tool. Impossible.

[Snuffleupagus]

There is no purpose in manual grouping tools in MMOs. Every player should have a fair selection of opportunities for his skill and gear level, and those should be provided by automatic, anonymous, grouping tool. Players of the same roles should not compete with each other.

Blizzard has a stellar track record with MMR. Just look at Overwatch. SC2.

Everyone already has a fair selection of opportunities for their skill and gear level. It's called making a group or queueing up for easy modes. If I want to kick the mage doing 30k dps, then that's my right as the person starting the group. If I think the ilvl should be set 30 levels above the rewards from the dungeon, then fuck it - that's my right.

Blizzard has plenty of experience with their playbase to know that auto-queue = nerf so any shitty player can complete. Cata Heroics were made queueable, and the backlash from the carebear brigade was so harsh that it had to be nerfed.

If people hadn't abused the slippery slope, maybe we'd have queueable Mythics, but that bridge was burned a long tine ago.

At this point, any queueable PvE content must be completable by the widest range of players. Anything else just invites backlash from bads.

[ls-]

Blizzard has a stellar track record with MMR. Just look at Overwatch. SC2.

Everyone already has a fair selection of opportunities for their skill and gear level. It's called making a group or queueing up for easy modes. If I want to kick the mage doing 30k dps, then that's my right as the person starting the group. If I think the ilvl should be set 30 levels above the rewards from the dungeon, then fuck it - that's my right.

Blizzard has plenty of experience with their playbase to know that auto-queue = nerf so any shitty player can complete. Cata Heroics were made queueable, and the backlash from the carebear brigade was so harsh that it had to be nerfed.

If people hadn't abused the slippery slope, maybe we'd have queueable Mythics, but that bridge was burned a long tine ago.

At this point, any queueable PvE content must be completable by the widest range of players. Anything else just invites backlash from bads.

There's no need to go back as far as Cata. In recent history we had LFR Archi that originally was hard, sorta, he didn't last long though, instead of overcoming the difficulty, people came to the forums demanding to nerf him ASAP, and that's what Blizz did, LFR Archi became a complete joke.

Majority of players do not expect challenge in queueable content, challenge causes frustration.

[Deleted]

If everyone makes their own group there would be no groups. Bad argument is bad.

So the solution is to just sit on your hands and go "Oh woe is me, I can never get a group... and I can't make my own group, cos if everyone would do it, there would be no groups ! " .. makes sense.