Hamburg teenagers walk free after gang-rape conviction

[Slant]

Racist =/= realist

Not sure what that has anything to do with what I said.

[Skulltaker]

Germany still has a rape and sexual assault crime ratio 3 times lower than the US, even if we include what happened in Cologne.

These stories are horrible of course and I'd have a serious hard time not wanting to see severe punishment for these perpetrators, but shit like this happens all over the world from time to time. It's inevitable.

Still to much. Since Cybran's sources are usually sketchy at best I'll go and look for some that are more dependable, but that story is somewhat troubling.

[Slant]

Germany still has a rape and sexual assault crime ratio 3 times lower than the US, even if we include what happened in Cologne.

These stories are horrible of course and I'd have a serious hard time not wanting to see severe punishment for these perpetrators, but shit like this happens all over the world from time to time. It's inevitable.

Population is becoming more bloodthirsty with each generation. They used to have law student first semesters evaluate a murder case and the punishment handed out is becoming more severe with each generation of law students. It's a conscious effort to reel the students back and remind them about objectivity. Good thing people on this forum usually don't have any say in important decisions, otherwise the world would go to shits faster than Jaylock gets banned.

[Skulltaker]

Not sure what that has anything to do with what I said.

"Face the truth. Wake up Sheeple. Trump for President. Islam is the religion of hate! Hurr Durr"

The line of reasoning behind it, at least that's my guess.

[Slant]

"Face the truth. Wake up Sheeple. Trump for President. Islam is the religion of hate! Hurr Durr"

The line of reasoning behind it, at least that's my guess.

Oh, I'm aware of that. Not letting him get away with calling himself a realist to escape the racist accusation that I planted, though.

[Deleted]

It's difficult for people outside of Europe to understand Europian law, same with US law. Not going to say anything more then this, they were underaged and you have no idea what has driven them to do something. Yesterday on Dr Phil I saw a young girl, who was clearly sick in her head, getting 50 years in prison for shooting her mother. Go fix your own system first.

[Trumpcat]

Just because "shit happens all over the world from time to time" doesn't mean it should be accepted as a given. A lot more "shit" was happening ages ago and in time the people have brought it down, because they were not okay with "shit happening". But somewhere in the recent 15-20 years we've seen a stop, instead of progress society is stagnant or regressing, people are lenient, apathetic. Instead of an ideal for freedom "liberal" is turning into carelessness, vulnerability, indecisiveness. People have become so convenient in the modern society, accepting everything as a given, feeling entitled to everything, that they can't be bothered to defend it.

[Slant]

It's difficult for people outside of Europe to understand Europian law, same with US law. Not going to say anything more then this, they were underaged and you have no idea what has driven them to do something. Yesterday on Dr Phil I saw a young girl, who was clearly sick in her head, getting 50 years in prison for shooting her mother. Go fix your own system first.

That's the thing, though. We give them shit for their justice system so often on this forum (or they do it themselves) that surely it must feel good to point out perceived justice problems we have in Europe. Try to understand, it probably is very frustrating to have arrogant Europeans tell you just how silly your country is. I don't mind them being ridiculous about this case. It's a sentiment many here share, even in Germany. It requires explanation, but I think once people think it through, they'll understand it.

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Just because "shit happens all over the world from time to time" doesn't mean it should be accepted as a given. A lot more "shit" was happening ages ago and in time the people have brought it down, because they were not okay with "shit happening". But somewhere in the recent 15-20 years we've seen a stop, instead of progress society is stagnant or regressing, people are lenient, apathetic. Instead of an ideal for freedom "liberal" is turning into carelessness, vulnerability, indecisiveness. People have become so convenient in the modern society, accepting everything as a given, feeling entitled to everything, that they can't be bothered to defend it.

Or perhaps it's that liberalism has stayed the same and people became less liberal. Oh, and they use liberal basically to insult anything that disagrees with them, like you did just now. See, this sentence doesn't have anything to do with liberalism and everything to do with progressive rehabilitation policy. Statistics show this way to be more successful than harsh punishments for youths at this age. But go ahead and tell me how you want to create career criminals and help society with that...

[Trumpcat]

... But go ahead and tell me how you want to create career criminals and help society with that...

Certainly I will tell you: by convicting and releasing repeatedly without consequence. Just like any other career criminal created by the bloated system that has a good number of registered crimes and goes around committing more. You've opted out of free society the moment you violated and killed individuals of said society.

[Slant]

Certainly I will tell you: by convicting and releasing repeatedly without consequence. Just like any other career criminal created by the bloated system that has a good number of registered crimes and goes around committing more. You've opted out of free society the moment you violated and killed individuals of said society.

You're wrong. On so many levels it isn't even funny.

[Trumpcat]

You're wrong. On so many levels it isn't even funny.

You're so comfortably laid back in your unshakable belief in being right that it's sad.

[May90]

Isn't Hawking still trying to make his one theory work? :P

Some scientists, even the good ones, are stubborn people...

Well, he is working on many theories, but he did admit once that he was wrong about something regarding black holes! Besides, Hawking is on the level of achievement at which he pretty much can say anything he wants without repercussions.

[Slant]

You're so comfortably laid back in your unshakable belief in being right that it's sad.

Not really. See, unlike you, I've actually talked to those crimologists and friends in the justice system. But please, tell me your expert opinion.

[Nehezbegar]

My solution, why the fuck i have to pay for them in prison? The solution below is cheaper.

http://image.sportsmansguide.com/adi...105729i_ts.jpg

Mod Note- Please refrain from posting extremely large images. -Jester Joe

[pateuvasiliu]

If u let 1000 criminals walk then more than 1 innovent will die.

No, not really. They could very well wisen up after narrowly escaping the law and not do it again.


I can't even begin to imagine what an innocent may being convicted of something he didn't do must feel like. The justice system failed them.

[Miyagie]

What has been noted by a crimologist, however, is that the thirst for revenge and harsher punishment has grown in German society. A fact that the media thankfully picks up to sell more copies by simply poking the finger in the drama wound that we all love. Our crime rates are pretty low. Despite popular belief, we are not overrun by criminals or terrorists. This case? Nobody really gives much of a fuck about the girl. All they want to see is blood. And that's the cold hard truth of it. None of you even know the girl. And if you have an ounce of brain, you know that no punishment can undo what they've done. The task here is not this girl, she's already the victim. The task here is to think of the next girl and make sure that these guys properly rehabilitate.

But we need harder punishments, i grew up with a Lebanes and with 16 years he had already 76 different charges
(burglary, assault, pickpocketing, drug selling, blackmail, damage of property and many many more)
and you know, when he told that some Roma guys, they made fun of him because all of them had already over 100 chargers.
Btw the Roma only had to do 1000-1500 hours of community service for that.

A friend of my brother got mugged and thrown infront of a train and the deliquent gets 1 year probation for murder.

The german law system is just a fucking joke.

[Testaxc]

Germany still has a rape and sexual assault crime ratio 3 times lower than the US, even if we include what happened in Cologne.

These stories are horrible of course and I'd have a serious hard time not wanting to see severe punishment for these perpetrators, but shit like this happens all over the world from time to time. It's inevitable.

Thats pretty much as far off topic as you can get. People love to reference the US for literally any topic of discussion.

[Nadiru]

What has been noted by a crimologist, however, is that the thirst for revenge and harsher punishment has grown in German society. A fact that the media thankfully picks up to sell more copies by simply poking the finger in the drama wound that we all love. Our crime rates are pretty low. Despite popular belief, we are not overrun by criminals or terrorists. This case? Nobody really gives much of a fuck about the girl. All they want to see is blood. And that's the cold hard truth of it. None of you even know the girl. And if you have an ounce of brain, you know that no punishment can undo what they've done. The task here is not this girl, she's already the victim. The task here is to think of the next girl and make sure that these guys properly rehabilitate.

Unless someone suddenly has a solution to put people away for life without paying the cost and/or using the death penalty, which civilised countries do no longer employ? No? Thought so.

How are you going to rehabilitate them if you allow them to live in the same environment which turned them into a rapist in the first place?

[Faenskap]

I thought European countries were supposed to be ahead of the curve for law and order with the amount of times people call America a backward rape enabling country.

How can this scenario even be possible?

I prefer America's general sentencing system over Europe's "rehabilitation^^". I'm disgusted by the jail time rapists get in Norway, two cases come to my mind
Kurdish guy takes part in two gangrapes with like one week in between them. They incapacited one victim with alcohol, the other heroine. The latter said something along the lines of "I was bleeding, the more I cried, the worse it got" (a rare statement, victims of rape aren't quoted in media). Many years on and these victims still aren't living normal lives. The guy escaped but was later found in Slovenia, brought back to Norway and got ten years. The other men got between 6 and 8 (iirc)

Another guy had a daughter, and the daughter would invite her friends over, which were all under 10. He's now facing prison for raping 7 and sexual indecency towards 1. He might get 20 years. Might.

There can be no rehabilitation.

These four young men and the one girl (the girl filmed it) should be trialed as adults, no bullshitting around with "but they're under 18! They're children" (well, one was 21).

[Slant]

But we need harder punishments, i grew up with a Lebanes and with 16 years he had already 76 different charges
(burglary, assault, pickpocketing, drug selling, blackmail, damage of property and many many more)
and you know, when he told that some Roma guys, they made fun of him because all of them had already over 100 chargers.
Btw the Roma only had to do 1000-1500 hours of community service for that.

A friend of my brother got mugged and thrown infront of a train and the deliquent gets 1 year probation for murder.

The german law system is just a fucking joke.

Ok, we could introduce a new law system specifically for foreigners, gypsies and other undesirables. Is that what you suggest?

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How are you going to rehabilitate them if you allow them to live in the same environment which turned them into a rapist in the first place?

People on the internet tend to view concepts as isolated things. I've explained how the justice system works and people only think about that. They don't think about a youth system, social workers, family courts and all the other things the state has to oversee such situations and help families, or rather the youth. It's not the courts job to raise children or teach them lessons. That's not their job. Their job is to see that justice is done in a manner that doesn't completely and instantly ruins those kids for the rest of their lives, because unless we kill them on the spot, society has to deal with them one way or another for probably 50-60 more years.