[Resto] my mythic+ dilemma

[Deleted]

Hey guys!

I need some pointers for healing mythic+. Until now I probably did around 60-70 runs and most of it went well. But then again I have runs where there is absolutely no way to keep people alive. I know druid healing is potent right now and I refuse to accept all those deaths just happened because other people played badly, so there has got to be something I'm doing wrong on some level. It feels more like I'm outgearing the content than anything..
Here's a link to my armory for future reference. Let's get to the topics:

The situation
I'm mostly doing mythic 4-7 these days with some 2-4 boosting in between, the occasional 8 or 9 but rather cautious about those because I'm not really sure if I can reliably deliver there. My most worrisome scenarios are the falling rocks and the scorpions in Neltharion, the spider and kitty trash in Thicket, scout and kitty trash in BRH and the demon quarter and spirits in Arcway.

The spec
Currently I'm using Cenarion Ward, Cultivation, Germination, Flourish for 2-5 and Stonebark fo 6 and higher. In the beginning I ran with Prosperity & SotF but that often left me gcd-starved and it was nerfed recently, so that's pretty much out. Following the advice from anther resto I tried Incarnation last night in NL+8 to deal with the falling rocks and the scorpions, very mixed results but I'm putting that up to inexperience.

The stats
At the moment my stats are 32.6k int, 18% crit, 14% haste, 19% mastery and 5% versatility. My priority is mastery > haste > crit > vers, my high crit mostly comes from Ghanir, Ekowraith and Sephuz. The observation that my healing is not enough sometimes makes me think that I need even more mastery and a tad more haste. But from what I can gather about high mythic+ restos online, someof them are going high haste and crit with mastery on the side. Is there a breakpoint somewhere or are they trying to maximise dps or something else entirely?

The trinkets
Currently I have these available:

Cocoon of Enforced Solitude	870	Faith's Crucible	870	Fluctuating Energy	860	Infernal Alchemist's Stone	855
Chrono Shard	850	Vial of Nightmare Fog	850	Heightened Senses	850	Bottled Hurricane	825

I've made good experiences with Alchemist's Stone and Chrono Shard in combination, as well as Heightened Senses and Bottled Hurricane. But what about actual BiS for the sole purpose of efficiently healing mythic+? Regardless of titanforges and sockets and whatnot, what's the most optimal combination of stats + procc in this slot?

The example
Say I'm in one of my favourite dungeons, Neltharion, 6 or higher. We just pulled a group of 3-4 trash after Rokmora. At this point, I frantically put 2 Rejuvs on everyone and LB on the tank and wait for the rocks to fall to start casting Wild Growth. The first one doesn't hurt much usually but as soon as 1-2 people start taking damage, I have to decide if I want to try regrowth-spamming them up or if I want to avoid all risk with a cooldown (Tranq, Ghanir).
The mobs throwing rocks at people are just as tricky. If I don't have pre-hots on people, 2 mobs throwing rocks will cause serious damage, sometimes even fatal when combined with other things like falling rocks, volcanoes and the like. What's the verdict here? Is that how every healer perceives it or is it just me?

Absolutely all questions, feedback and criticism is welcome. Druid are one of the few classes that I really enjoy and yet for some reason, I can't play them without fear of failure. That needs to change, urgently. Thank you!

[Tomali]

In mythic+, don't be afraid to pop cooldowns on trash. Many trash pulls in the 7+ range start to hit just as hard or harder (i.e. Higher hps requirement) than bosses. Until tyrannical of course.

This seems like a problem of holding your cooldowns instead of proactively using them. Use iron bark and ghanir often and prehot for the especially tough pulls. This specifically for me is the difference between a tough or a smooth +6-9. It does take some knowledge of the pulls, but it seems like you have that knowledge base already.

[Deleted]

Hi friend! Trash are the absolute bosses of mythic+. Whenever I enter a pug, I always determine within my group who can aoe stun, and then set a loose rotation on that. You and I are both taurens, great choice! War stomp those big packs when possible.

I'm reading over your example and the first thing I noticed is.. where is the Wild Growth?! I'm going to assume it just slipped the mind but I tend to rejuvenate most or all of my party once, LB the tank, then WG during those moments of filthy aoe spike, then finish off germinating all over my party. If my mastery stacks from all of that plus cultivation is not doing the trick, then don't hesitate to bring in the ol' tranquility.

As the above poster said, iron bark is beautiful for reducing damage on the tank, but it's also incredible for increasing your HOTs effectiveness by 20%. Abuse this.

I honestly feel your stats are golden. Ideally, if it were me, mastery and haste is the way to go. My haste is terrible currently and I'm working on getting that up.

Sorry for any mistakes, typed this on my phone. :-)

Edit: no idea on the BIS trinkets, but I adore my chrono shard. Despite my awful haste, this thing procs every time I inhale. Incredibly useful.

[Deleted]

Use iron bark and ghanir often and prehot for the especially tough pulls

I'm reading over your example and the first thing I noticed is.. where is the Wild Growth?! I'm going to assume it just slipped the mind but I tend to rejuvenate most or all of my party once, LB the tank, then WG during those moments of filthy aoe spike, then finish off germinating all over my party. If my mastery stacks from all of that plus cultivation is not doing the trick, then don't hesitate to bring in the ol' tranquility.

Wild Growth slipped my mind, added it to the example. But what if double Rejuv, Cultivation, Wild Growth and Ghanir are not enough for say the falling rocks? Of course I can pop tranquility on top of that but then I'm all out of extras for the next pull and that will go wrong and went wrong many a-time...

War stomp those big packs when possible [..] As the above poster said, iron bark is beautiful for reducing damage on the tank, but it's also incredible for increasing your HOTs effectiveness by 20%. Abuse this.

Since I noticed the efficiency of the Stonebark talent, I am using Ironbark much more frequently and it helps greatly in dire situations. But I really need to get into the habit of using War Stomp, Hurricane and maybe Vortex more often. Those spells mostly stay unused because I can't seem to find the time when things are already going pear-shaped..

[Deleted]

Ah damn it. I typed out my response but my phone derped. Anyhow the short version is - cw tank, swiftmend the squishy mage, renewal yourself (off GCD), refresh rejuvs, WG soon as it's off cd, LB tank. If dps have not ruined most or all of the trash by this point, I'd start asking whether the DPS are up to task of quickly dispatching the appropriate mobs and less about your healing. :-)

Also, stun, especially when coordinated is practically a free pass of no damage being taken. It's invaluable and easy to build a quick understanding with others in the group that have it.

Edit: and also, a wise resto druid once said on YouTube, don't hesitate to spam regrowth on people to get their health up quickly. It's better for your party to be alive than to be efficient.

- - - Updated - - -

In fact, I just realised the druid on YouTube talks about the exact dungeon you used in your example, NL!

Worth a watch - cant link due to post count but YouTube search for cloudmighty. Title of the video is Mythic+ Restoration Druid Guide/Tips/Strategy. Hope it helps!

- - - Updated - - -

Though to be fair, thinking back to it now. He uses prosperity/sotw/flourish. And is also healing +2 and +5, which may not be the best examples for talents or encounters to learn from.

Nonetheless, a decent watch if you have the time!

[tratra]

if you are pulling 3-4 packs use all cd's available, and don't forget even tranq has like 3 mins cd, thats not a lot mate. In a few packs you gonna have it again.

Generally speaking, I use all my cd's all the time.

Also don't forget you might be in a low m+ but pulling 3 trash packs is gonna hurt your tank and the grp if there is aoe coming your way.

Spam CD's and dont worry if you'll have them for the boss or not, most bosses anyway don't hit as hard so you can do with soft cd's unless its like cos or dht tyranical last boss

Also on your example after this trash of 3-4 your tank is gonna have to give you some downtime and after you pull another pack ur staff is gonna be ready and after 3 trash your tranq is gonna be ready again so no worries just use everything

[Deleted]

in high mythic+ there is not much you can do if your group are not working together and chaining stuns/interrupts.

[Drekor]

There is a limit to what you can do and when it comes to Mythic+ the majority of the damage is prevented by your DPS. They need to be on point with interrupts and stuns and if they're not then things can fall apart very very quickly.

[Purpleisbetter]

on my DHT +11 with tyrannical the real issue was the first boss.
Xavius got one shotted.

[Broski]

+11 healer here. I go for as much haste as possible followed by mastery and then crit. I can get everybody double rejuv'd in about 6 seconds (running with legendary ring and 3rd golden trait so ez rejuvs) and then i run with 2 mana saving trinkets so I never run out. Keeping as many HoTs on the group as possible seems to do it for me, the other key thing is that your DPS know to interupt and stun/disorient/knockback/incapacitate. Honestly heals alone won't clear it, DPS has to be tight (though with fortitude this week you'll have your work cut out for you).

[chunx0r]

Hey guys!
The example
The mobs throwing rocks at people are just as tricky. If I don't have pre-hots on people, 2 mobs throwing rocks will cause serious damage, sometimes even fatal when combined with other things like falling rocks, volcanoes and the like. What's the verdict here? Is that how every healer perceives it or is it just me?

Pelters are the bane of my existence in that dungeon. Some of this comes down to the DPS. If they get 2 Pelters on themselves and don't use some kind of damage reduction cooldown it's almost impossible to keep them up. If you're in voice comms it can help to call for it.

[Deleted]

The spec
Currently I'm using Cenarion Ward, Cultivation, Germination, Flourish for 2-5 and Stonebark fo 6 and higher. In the beginning I ran with Prosperity & SotF but that often left me gcd-starved and it was nerfed recently, so that's pretty much out. Following the advice from anther resto I tried Incarnation last night in NL+8 to deal with the falling rocks and the scorpions, very mixed results but I'm putting that up to inexperience.

Prosperity was nerfed because it was rediculously overpowered. and it still is, so try that instead of cenarion ward. i'd also recommend always going with flourish,
especially if youre running with germination which u say that u are and i very much think u should after the recent buffs to cultivation.
dont be afraid to overwrite your existing rejuv or germination since most of the time this will just mean that the hot will now benefit more from mastery because there was more hots present on the target when u re-applied that specific hot.
and now that you have 2 swiftmends instead of just 1 on a rediculously long cd, your spothealing is suddenly very decent.
never use moment of clarity and never use stonebark unless youre in a mythic raid scenario or pushing m+ 11 or higher and have to deal with tyrannical

[Spoonman]

IMO u need to determine how good of a group you are in.
It's a lot more about how good dps the grp have and stuns etc, obv the faster u kill it the less u need to heal
If your pulling good numbers on hps and still not making it it means the dps isn't enough

I've done lvl 10+ as dps and imo where a good healer stands out is if u have tyrannical modifier on bosses at 10 and also if there are accident pulls on trash and u still survive it
Other than that dps and tanking roles impacts a lot more on the quality of the run

[Viridis]

Everything you list out seems fine. Provided you're not playing "slowly" (as in thinking too much and casting too little), your troubles seem, at first glance, to either be caused by DPS not performing their jobs (interrupt, stun, but also providing high damage output is key), or people not using their own mitigation buttons to ease your job. Some people get very used to just being healed through everything under the sun, and thus forget to press their own buttons.

And remember to use Vortex on the packs that jump around, it's a big deal and they die so much faster when people can just cleave their faces.

[Deleted]

Everything you list out seems fine. Provided you're not playing "slowly" (as in thinking too much and casting too little), your troubles seem, at first glance, to either be caused by DPS not performing their jobs (interrupt, stun, but also providing high damage output is key), or people not using their own mitigation buttons to ease your job. Some people get very used to just being healed through everything under the sun, and thus forget to press their own buttons.

And remember to use Vortex on the packs that jump around, it's a big deal and they die so much faster when people can just cleave their faces.

Come to think of it, that might be one of the core issues seeing as most people said that my general approach is fine.
Also, that idea with Vortex is massive! I can't believe I didn't know that until now. This should be in the resto guide someplace, more druids need to know that!

[Purpleisbetter]

Vortex is imho what it really makes us the best healer for M+.

You can Vortex-Typhoon to re-position stuff so monks are happy, Vortex-typhoon as a poor man's aoe kick, Necro kite, Pelter and VotA spiders' bane and many other crative uses.

You can piss people when you get some pocket demos lock and vortex like a whole alliance trying to summon their friends near karazan's stone only to get f*ed up by 3 fel lords.

Ah,OP. Seriously, FU for your luck with trinket procs.

[Deleted]

Vortex is imho what it really makes us the best healer for M+.

You can Vortex-Typhoon to re-position stuff so monks are happy, Vortex-typhoon as a poor man's aoe kick, Necro kite, Pelter and VotA spiders' bane and many other creative uses.

Can you elaborate please? I don't really get what you mean.

Ah, OP. Seriously, FU for your luck with trinket procs.

I got the Faith's Crucible from the follower Karazhan quest after an otherwise very sad Karazhan run. The other's that procc'd arent very useful and I'm pretty much only using Chrono and Alchemist's at the moment.

BUMP for the trinket question in the first post

[Purpleisbetter]

Can you elaborate please? I don't really get what you mean.


I got the Faith's Crucible from the follower Karazhan quest after an otherwise very sad Karazhan run. The other's that procc'd arent very useful and I'm pretty much only using Chrono and Alchemist's at the moment.

BUMP for the trinket question in the first post

Some examples:

Imps packs on CoS:

Vortex placed beneath them, wait for them to cast, cast typhoon (talent) -> interrupted all of em and stacked on top of each other, facilitating evry kind of aoe (think about monk fist of fury, your own sunfire etc).

Another use might be:

Tank is kiting a m+ with lot of stacks of necrotic, so he needs to kite. He runs out of tools (ie: Bear druid has his own typhoon and stampeding roar on CC). You place your Vortex between the tank and the pack, wait the pack to cross it, the pack gets pulled back then again u typhoon them away.

Vault of the warden:

Your tank pulls a pack of spiders; wait for an aoe stun to wear off, place the vortex sto the spiders won't run away from the light beacon.

[Emerald Archer]

I used to find myself struggling in m+ heal wise, until I changed into incarn and stopped caring about how much mana I spend. I go ham with mana, no care at all or consideration for it. What I do though, is have a crap ton of food in my bags to mana up, and everytime we're out of combat for a split second, i drink, even if it's for 5 seconds. Most tanks can live by themselves for the first 5-10 seconds of a fight, so you just sit and drink while they pull. Getting into combat doesn't stop you from drinking, you just gotta trust your tank, and if you can't. Make sure he's hotted up before the mili-second break in combat. Then you can drink.

Incarn I love, in most dungeons if you're going ham with mana, you don't really need cult or sotf, very few dungeons have such constant group wide damage that make these needed. Instead, Incarn as an oh shit button/if you're communicating with the tank, a way of letting him pull extra big for a pack. Just Innervate+Incarn and go ham.

Very few bosses will need your healing cds, use them on trash, off CD. If you're on comms with your team, let them know when you have cds up and they can go for a big pull.

Trinket wise, test them all and see at the end which one is doing the most healing for you. But don't bother with any mana trinket. Like I said, drink every half a second you get, and let the tank keep himself up for a few seconds. A tank should never need to wait for you to get mana to continue. I personally would use Chrono and Vial. But test it out yourself.

Cenarion Ward/Incarn/Germ/Stone. I don't see why you wouldn't take stone, even on lower difficulties, just make the tank pull bigger so you do get use out of it.

And while some Resto druids may shame it, don't be afraid to spam regrowth. If your hots are already on people/people are taking damage hots won't fix alone, just go ham with regrowth. But worst case scenario, you use a CD, but that's what they're there for.

[Gravitor]

Pelters are the bane of my existence in that dungeon. Some of this comes down to the DPS. If they get 2 Pelters on themselves and don't use some kind of damage reduction cooldown it's almost impossible to keep them up. If you're in voice comms it can help to call for it.

There'a a way to get around that kinda. Have the tank kite to the best of his/her ability. Use slows and stuns on those mobs. They wont pelt if they chasing the tank :>