Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Molvonos]

Which would you prefer?

Don't bother trying to get any real conversation out of them. They're just a die hard troll who thinks the Nos group can't be the target of legal ramifications.

[Deleted]

Which would you prefer?

blizzard hosted vanilla progessive servers, it would be amazing and would bring wow back imo the amount of high profile old streamers who used to play would return and stream it. would hype it up and its populatity would go through the roof, it would be like a new game to people who never played vanilla, and to us the veterans it would be like going home after all these years, why blizzard deny us this chance is unacceptable and stubborn and the people who agree with blizzard and say that Classic was nostalgia is wrong, i played classic in 2005. and i played when nost came out and still enjoyed it just as much as i did in 2005.

I personally cannot stand the linear, empty, solo experience of Legion. it has become the new CoD, you are the hero now wit hthe best weapons and gear and have done it all, your not a grunt or a lowly soldier anymore, and as CoD4 Remastered proves, been a solider is better than been a hero. Legion way to casual and a completley different game to vanilla, vanilla was crafted as an MMO, legion is crafted as a game for casuals and people with no time commitments, and legion is failing already as subs are dropping at a similar number to WoD was, they have to release classic servers to remain on the gaming map or simply fade in to gaming history.

They have to say something at blizzcon about vanilla, and something signifigant, a simple no we will not release classic servers or yes, there is a big enough demand for us to release classic, no inbetweens or maybe, or it will spark further outrage on the issue and nost will do as they promised and release nost 2.0. but i have a feeling they will literally say nothing.

[Eleccybubb]

blizzard hosted vanilla progessive servers, it would be amazing and would bring wow back imo the amount of high profile old streamers who used to play would return and stream it. would hype it up and its populatity would go through the roof, it would be like a new game to people who never played vanilla, and to us the veterans it would be like going home after all these years, why blizzard deny us this chance is unacceptable and stubborn and the people who agree with blizzard and say that Classic was nostalgia is wrong, i played classic in 2005. and i played when nost came out and still enjoyed it just as much as i did in 2005.

Not stubborn at all. Their decision and for now they don't want to speak about as they said they will not be doing so at Blizzcon. After? Perhaps and perhaps not. Notice the emphasis on your "I" yet you consistently sound like you and the other pro legacy "hardcore fans" speak for everyone.

[voidillusion]

they have to release classic servers to remain on the gaming map or simply fade in to gaming history.

As much as i want legacy, and i want it so much that i'm actually playing it, this makes no sense, regardless of that happens WoW has already made his mark in history, 11+Million subscribers at his peak, nobody ever came close, and i bet nobody will.

[Deleted]

Easy to manage entry bosses in these later raids is evidence that Blizzard intended less-skilled guilds to at least enter them and try these bosses. With that said, Blizzard completely failed their original goal, and therefore catch-up mechanisms were introduced.

This is a good point, and you can clearly notice it during the span on TBC. I think this is more to do about Blizzard not doing attunements that well. I don't think they need to be used to make sure that players progress through the raids in the "correct" order, this should be done via difficulty. Not every raid needs to have attunements either I think. It shouldn't be an all in kinda deal.

As for catch-up mechanics, personally I like things like ZG and ZA, accessible content to allow people get the gear (Also does great for a guild to actually be able to progress somewhere, banging your head to a brick wall is a sure way to destroy guilds.) to help them access other content. Especially ZA was just a brilliant move by Blizzard. It offered the speedrun for the guilds who don't need the gear and offered gear for the people stuck in T4. (Although if you were able to beat ZA and were stuck in T4 it was generally because of lack of people and not of gear/skill, but ZA still helped I'd imagine.)

You are right, you can't dismiss gear's effect on WoW. As mentioned earlier, it barred lower-skilled guilds from seeing content that was designed for them. Catch-up mechanisms (which is also gear) changed that.

While it's probably true that gear is what barred "lower-skilled guilds", I don't believe gear is something that prevented a lot of the guilds from seeing content. It was probably just not raiding enough, not being dedicated enough. And I don't say that to dismiss them, despite what I've said before, I think that if the majority of players want to play the content, but just don't have the time to progress through it, something certainly should be done. Somethings were done too, I'd argue they were the wrong things.

There was a curious feature added back in Wrath. It allowed you to extend the raid lock, meaning you could just never not progress. No need to grind those bosses you've already downed, man was I excited. Too bad nobody else was. See, I thought this would bring an era of very progression based raiding, with more than one raid per tier. (Perhaps a few small raids with only 1-2 bosses that you kinda farm each week, and the main raid that you can progress nicely.) Now this is probably just me playing with the wrong people at the time, but everyone else seemed to only be concerned about gear. Why would you not reset the raid every week, since it allows you to grab the free loot from the first bosses again. Whatever. I wonder if that feature is still a thing and if anyone ever used it. I feel like it could have been utilized so much better by Blizzard.

You had me until Patchwerk. There is a reason he was the last of the first 4 bosses in Naxx to die. He was the one of the biggest DPS checks in the game and it is what told you if you were ready for the rest of the instance.

My point about Patchwerk was that it was mechanically a very simple encounter. That if you discount gear, he's far easier than a lot of other bosses prior to him. Of course, as you say, he was clearly designed as a gearcheck for the rest of the dungeon.

You're probably right about C'thun though, all I know about that fight is hearsay.

[Deleted]

blizzard hosted vanilla progessive servers, it would be amazing and would bring wow back imo the amount of high profile old streamers who used to play would return and stream it. would hype it up and its populatity would go through the roof, it would be like a new game to people who never played vanilla, and to us the veterans it would be like going home after all these years, why blizzard deny us this chance is unacceptable and stubborn and the people who agree with blizzard and say that Classic was nostalgia is wrong, i played classic in 2005. and i played when nost came out and still enjoyed it just as much as i did in 2005.

I personally cannot stand the linear, empty, solo experience of Legion. it has become the new CoD, you are the hero now wit hthe best weapons and gear and have done it all, your not a grunt or a lowly soldier anymore, and as CoD4 Remastered proves, been a solider is better than been a hero. Legion way to casual and a completley different game to vanilla, vanilla was crafted as an MMO, legion is crafted as a game for casuals and people with no time commitments, and legion is failing already as subs are dropping at a similar number to WoD was, they have to release classic servers to remain on the gaming map or simply fade in to gaming history.

They have to say something at blizzcon about vanilla, and something signifigant, a simple no we will not release classic servers or yes, there is a big enough demand for us to release classic, no inbetweens or maybe, or it will spark further outrage on the issue and nost will do as they promised and release nost 2.0. but i have a feeling they will literally say nothing.

I would not want to have Classic back, though I have played since Dec 2005. My favorite expansions are Wrath and BC, followed by MoP and Cata. I still don't know what to think of Legion, they got some things right regarding my current RL situation, and others completely wrong. But I would even set WoD up a higher ranking than classic. The only thing memorable from classic was RP. I was much more a roleplayer back then than I was a gamer. I ventured out to experience the story as it fit my characters (my druid stayed as long on Kalimdor as possible, to heal and to protect the homeland), and surely spent half of my time in RP sessions, thus leveling even slower than the other "noobs".

I would love to have the feature from Neverwinter in WoW, where you can build your own quest areas complete with mobs and rewards, and even build small quest dungeons. This would be a great thing for the community and also for RP. I don't need a classic server where most of my characters could not even exist (because class or race not available), where I don't have my cool looking outfits and no transmog feature, and many other things. If Classic would launch today, even with better and polished graphics, I would not want to play it.

[Molvonos]

You're probably right about C'thun though, all I know about that fight is hearsay.

C'thun P2 was literally impossible until they patched in a bugfix. Adds were spawning in places they had no rightful place to be (such as the tentacles on the surface spawning in the stomach or, outside the visible range of the players).

There was one kill, the night before the patch, which was basically down to luck when it came to tentacle spawns.

It was an awesome boss to fight for the time, and all the work we put into it, even pre-bugfix.

- - - Updated - - -

First off: Glad you proved me wrong regarding being a troll, this is far more useful than your last halfdozen or so posts.

blizzard hosted vanilla progressive servers, it would be amazing and would bring wow back imo the amount of high profile old streamers who used to play would return and stream it. would hype it up and its popularity would go through the roof, it would be like a new game to people who never played vanilla, and to us the veterans it would be like going home after all these years, why blizzard deny us this chance is unacceptable and stubborn and the people who agree with blizzard and say that Classic was nostalgia is wrong, i played classic in 2005. and i played when nost came out and still enjoyed it just as much as i did in 2005.

There are plenty of High Profile Streamers who play WoW and have played WoW since the inception of Twitch. Twitch started in 2011, WoW started in 2004. With those dates, most Twitch WoW Streamers started in Cataclysm, which most people consider to be the most reviled expansion, next to Warlords of Draenor. Also, you seriously need to stop speaking as if you're speaking for everyone, with comments like us veterans. Your opinion is your own and while it might be shared by some, it is not shared by all. Most of this paragraph is opinions and little else.

I personally cannot stand the linear, empty, solo experience of Legion. it has become the new CoD, you are the hero now wit hthe best weapons and gear and have done it all, your not a grunt or a lowly soldier anymore, and as CoD4 Remastered proves, been a solider is better than been a hero. Legion way to casual and a completley different game to vanilla, vanilla was crafted as an MMO, legion is crafted as a game for casuals and people with no time commitments, and legion is failing already as subs are dropping at a similar number to WoD was, they have to release classic servers to remain on the gaming map or simply fade in to gaming history.

The start of this paragraph is pretty spot on with everything you've posted. You, personally, cannot stand.... Again, opinions, not facts. I played in Beta, I played in Vanilla through to Legion. I've taken breaks on and off after Lich King because of life, but not once did I suddenly go 'You know what, I hate being popular In Character.' My character, as far as story goes, personally brought down Ragnaros, Onxyia, Nefarian, C'thun and thrashed Naxxramas with an army of other like-minded heros. This trend continued through Burning Crusade, where we smacked down Illidan's Lieutenants, Illidan himself, the Engine in which the fel orcs were created for Illidan's army and finally, Big Bad Kil'Jaeden himself. (Oh yea, and we smorked the fuck out of Grull, just cause.). In Lich King we... took down Naxx again, Malygos (the first Aspect we actually put down), an Old God threat in the north, the Lich King deciding to crash our Tourny and then the Lich King himself.

I could go on and on. But our 'growth' as a hero has been set from day one, no matter how much anyone wants to bitch, whine and moan otherwise. (I don't wanna be important! I miss being a rank and file soldier!')

WoW will never fade into gaming history and it's likely going to be around another 10 or so years, if Everquest is any inclination towards the trend. That's just you being spiteful and hoping for the worst because Blizz won't cater to pirates and thieves.

They have to say something at blizzcon about vanilla, and something signifigant, a simple no we will not release classic servers or yes, there is a big enough demand for us to release classic, no inbetweens or maybe, or it will spark further outrage on the issue and nost will do as they promised and release nost 2.0. but i have a feeling they will literally say nothing.

They literally don't have to say anything. In fact, they've stated they won't and if they do? That's icing and nothing else. I've heard rumors that Pro-Legacy crowd are gonna try and fuck up things at the panels, trying to invoke 'free speech' and all that. But unfortunately, free speech doesn't extend inside of events. If they disrupt Blizzcon, they will have security or the police escort them off or have them arrested, depending on the severity of problem. Blizzard already got their money for the ticket in, so all these supposed Pro-Legacy folks are doing, will be making an even worse image for themselves and the group they supposedly represent.

*Edit: And if the Nos group releases another pirated, Private server, Blizzard will no doubt go after them legally. Just because they release the server in Russia, or where ever, doesn't mean they, personally, will be moving to said country. And Blizzard has their names and can easily get their addresses working with the countries they live in, because of international law. Do you honestly think that, as smart as these folks are, they're willing to risk their potential future for a private server of a game, after being found out?

Even if they try to be anonymous, they can never be as 'big' as they were before they bowed to the Cease and Desist that Blizzard sent them, let alone the meeting they had. If you really want to go tin-foil hat theory, Blizzard only invited them to get their personal information first and foremost, just in case they try to do anything stupid, like reopen Nostralius.

**Edits: A few bbcode errors.

[Sturmbringe]

They literally don't have to say anything. In fact, they've stated they won't and if they do? That's icing and nothing else. I've heard rumors that Pro-Legacy crowd are gonna try and fuck up things at the panels, trying to invoke 'free speech' and all that. But unfortunately, free speech doesn't extend inside of events. If they disrupt Blizzcon, they will have security or the police escort them off or have them arrested, depending on the severity of problem. Blizzard already got their money for the ticket in, so all these supposed Pro-Legacy folks are doing, will be making an even worse image for themselves and the group they supposedly represent.

We used to get that a lot from trolls here at MMO Champion prior to the Nostalrius team meeting with the Blizzard guys and Mr. Morhaime. Trolls claimed Blizzard would "call the police" and that the Nostalrius team would "do time in jail".

Instead, here's what happened:



Something tells me that the same will happen at Blizzcon, i.e. Blizzard will listen to us and they will be their normal cordial self, because Blizzard are just people and they love their fans, especially the passionate ones, like us.

I gotta say though, J. Allen Brack is really gonna get what's been coming at him from like a year ago. Karma.

[Deleted]

I gotta say though, J. Allen Brack is really gonna get what's been coming at him from like a year ago. Karma.

Jesus fucking christ man. It's a videogame. Fucking stop with personal threats right now you fucking idiot.
Man. Some people. You are a fucking disgrace to humankind.

INFRACTION

[Deleted]

Jesus fucking christ man. It's a videogame. Fucking stop with personal threats right now you fucking idiot.
Man. Some people. You are a fucking disgrace to humankind.

You speak as if he said he is going to kick J. Allen Brack's ass at blizzcon with a sock full of nickels XD

[Sturmbringe]

Jesus fucking christ man. It's a videogame. Fucking stop with personal threats right now you fucking idiot.
Man. Some people. You are a fucking disgrace to humankind.

My friend, it is high-time you leave the basement. :-)

[Molvonos]

-Snip-

Blizzard acted precisely like I expected them to. They're generally a very standup company full of human-beings. Which is why errors of judgment happen. However, Blizzard has also, already given the warning. They even invited the Nost group to visit, as you showed in the image. But if Nost goes through with their 'threat' of relocating their pirated server to Russia (or wherever), Blizzard will act accordingly as a Corporation looking to protect it's assets.

The Nost-group can no longer claim ignorance of their actions, nor can they claim their 'passion' after Blizzard went through those processes, especially if Blizz doesn't lead anyone on regarding a Legacy server 'promise'.

Ultimately, the ball is in the Pro-Legacy's court. How they act, what they do, may or may not shape the future of what they want. If the more zealous Pro-Legacy folks do something really stupid at Blizzcon, well. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone if Blizz doesn't give into their demands.

Because right now, they're about as threatening as this:

[Galax]

The talk of whether legacy servers will happen is stupid. They will happen because like you said, the shelf life of this game has several more years left which means demand for older content will continue to grow.

Also it's not like they will be launching a new game. They will simply release dedicated servers that run the same game but with a relaunch of old content. While I'm sure it will take some time to sort out, it's really not that big of a deal and considering the game's popularity over the years, the subs it will attract will be substantial.

Legacy in 2016? Probably not.

2017? Probably.

By 2018? I'd put money on it.

[voidillusion]

This is the part of the discussion i really can't understand. It kinda reminds me this meme:


Obviously this is an exageration, because nothing is on fire, yet, but legacy IS happening, if you want it enough and are diligent enough, you play it, easily, in stable and populated servers.

So this isn't a question of legacy happening or not, it's been happening for years, and it isnt a question also revolving around nost, although they might just be a good catalyst, this is basicly a question of blizzard wanting to deal a fatal blow to the majority of the pservers, while increasing their playerbase by just releasing official servers or not, either way Legacy will keep on happening

[Sturmbringe]

Blizzard acted precisely like I expected them to. They're generally a very standup company full of human-beings. Which is why errors of judgment happen. However, Blizzard has also, already given the warning. They even invited the Nost group to visit, as you showed in the image. But if Nost goes through with their 'threat' of relocating their pirated server to Russia (or wherever), Blizzard will act accordingly as a Corporation looking to protect it's assets.

The Nost-group can no longer claim ignorance of their actions, nor can they claim their 'passion' after Blizzard went through those processes, especially if Blizz doesn't lead anyone on regarding a Legacy server 'promise'.

Ultimately, the ball is in the Pro-Legacy's court. How they act, what they do, may or may not shape the future of what they want. If the more zealous Pro-Legacy folks do something really stupid at Blizzcon, well. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone if Blizz doesn't give into their demands.

Because right now, they're about as threatening as this:

As far as I know, the Nostalrius team is still in pretty good (speaking) terms with Blizzard, even with the upper echelons thereof.

The Nostalrius team actually congratulated Ion Hazzikostas on his promotion, as did I, on Twitter.

AFAIK, the "threats" and the "animosity" between Nostalrius and Blizzard is a creation of forum trolls in order to fill their sad and pathetic lives.

[Chaelexi]

My point about Patchwerk was that it was mechanically a very simple encounter. That if you discount gear, he's far easier than a lot of other bosses prior to him. Of course, as you say, he was clearly designed as a gearcheck for the rest of the dungeon.

You're probably right about C'thun though, all I know about that fight is hearsay.

The difficult part about C'thun is that it was one of the first fights that had multiple mechanics and individual responsibility. If you were to take the fight and release something similar it would be comical how easy it would be for skilled players to complete as we have seen these fights all through WoW for 10 years. Looking back they used the template for C'thun(minus the unforgiving entrance to the boss) as a test bed on how to create a multiple mechanic fight without making it impassible and that is why it took 2 or three tuning passes for it to be killed as at points it was mathematically impossible to do everything you needed to do. Especially the stomach phases.

[Deleted]

I hope someone will ask about legacy servers at Blizzcon

According to this, 1700 people agreed to ask for it

https://www.change.org/p/blizzcon-ti...cy-vanilla-wow

It's a Mark Kern's petition for legacy server questions at Blizzcon. lol

[Eleccybubb]

As far as I know, the Nostalrius team is still in pretty good (speaking) terms with Blizzard, even with the upper echelons thereof.

The Nostalrius team actually congratulated Ion Hazzikostas on his promotion, as did I, on Twitter.

AFAIK, the "threats" and the "animosity" between Nostalrius and Blizzard is a creation of forum trolls in order to fill their sad and pathetic lives.

Lol you are kidding right. How is Nost saying "if Blizzard don't do something then we will" something that trolls made up when Nost themselves said it directly?. Also sad news for you. They said they won't be discussing Legacy at Blizzcon so get over it. You are literally here to create tension among the thread at the moment which tbh I do not see the point in.

[Pann]

I hope someone will ask about legacy servers at Blizzcon

According to this 1700 people agreed to ask for it at Blizzcon

https://www.change.org/p/blizzcon-ti...cy-vanilla-wow

It's a Mark Kern's petition for legacy server questions at Blizzcon. lol

Even if someone, somehow manages to ask a question about legacy at Blizzcon they are just going to be told that Blizzard are still investigating their viability.

[Saracens]

Yet again, please stop the bickering and the personal attacks.