I like Outlaw!

[Deleted]

Neither of these would necessarily change a lot with regards to how much you reroll.

They would just change which rolls you keep and reroll, you'd still likely be rerolling roughly the same amount of times on average.

maybe not...but it would make our dps way less rng dependent. Which is 90% of my problem with outlaw. (i still main outlaw btw.) I really like it but its a bitch to play the moment you dont get more than a single buff for 10 consecutive rolls.

[Sinbad101]

Well, since that's pretty much what we're there to do, one might argue that that's a legitimate complaint.

I loved Outlaw at first, and I'm still pretty cool with it now, although I have begun pumping ap into my sub artifact. I can easily see myself working the old paradigm "Sub on ST/Outlaw on MT". Honestly don't want to go Sin because I don't care for the playstyle, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. But we'll see as time goes by.

And sorry, but RTB and dps cannot be off the table since they are not only at the heart of the issue but are bound inextricably together. I still believe the easiest way to fix this would be to revert the nerf to rtb by simply giving us back the +40% buff to crit/attack speed/whatever. This not only improves the damage but also takes the sting out of a one buff roll in many cases. Otherwise, they could revert the relic nerfs. Granted, this wouldn't fix rtb, but let's be honest: if you're doing respectable and consistent dps, you're going to be a lot more tolerant of the vagaries of rtb.

Some other observations, since you asked for something other than rtb comments:

Still love the spec for any 5 man content. It's fast paced and given all the trash in these things it's easy to satisfy my inner dps whore.

And finally, I'm not a huge fan of the whole pirate thing. I see myself more as a highwayman than a pirate. Takes a few mental gymnastics, but it works for me. Cheers!

OK here's the thing: DPS is of the table and should be when discussing design, that's b/c they could easily buff us back to the top 7 again.
As for RtB, i say that b/c I'm trying to pin point the OTHER reasons some might hate or dislike outlaw. Anything else. B/c RtB is all people are talking about when the spec imo does have other issues and RtB will take the longest to fix/replace.
I want to get an idea of the OTHER issues the spec has and get to talking about those.

WE already know people hate RtB, duh. XD

[Valnar]

maybe not...but it would make our dps way less rng dependent. Which is 90% of my problem with outlaw. (i still main outlaw btw.) I really like it but its a bitch to play the moment you dont get more than a single buff for 10 consecutive rolls.

My whole point is that those ideas wouldn't necessarily make the spec less RNG dependent. You might still have to reroll just as many times, only that it would be rerolling any 2 roll that doesn't have TB for example.

[Blayke]

OK here's the thing: DPS is of the table and should be when discussing design, that's b/c they could easily buff us back to the top 7 again.
As for RtB, i say that b/c I'm trying to pin point the OTHER reasons some might hate or dislike outlaw. Anything else. B/c RtB is all people are talking about when the spec imo does have other issues and RtB will take the longest to fix/replace.
I want to get an idea of the OTHER issues the spec has and get to talking about those.

WE already know people hate RtB, duh. XD

Well, can't really help you there because I actually still like the spec overall. It's fun, it's fast, and it's still awesome in 5 mans. I don't even hate RtB, tbh. I would just like to see it tightened up just a little bit. Not saying eliminate the rng, since that would defeat the purpose of the ability. Just would like to see the high and low ends of our dps brought a bit closer together.

[Grizvok]

Nope.

Mage will always be in the top 7, Sin/Mut won't. If all you care about is topping the DPS charts.. which i pity thee, then go mage. B/C clearly you have no love for Roles in an RPG.

Assassination i like.. It's easy and boring.. but relaxing and methodical. but like i said, outlaw was supposed to be the dynamic spec. like a dark souls game, reaction. but it ended up a punishing spec.

Also there's the people whom hate daggers and love swords.

- - - Updated - - -



I never got this comparison. They have stealth. Plus all melee are just warrior with different weapons unless it's a DoT spec. Seriously, The comparison is dumb, if you know what a "rogue" means, you know it's pretty broad and doesn't mean "stealthy", that's just wow.

- - - Updated - - -



THAT. is the issue. They're still learning how to balance and tune it, it's new, that's why i said not to f-king mention it.


PLUS: honestly it's a bit pathetic no matter how important it is, to hate a spec based on 1 button. imo

Assassination is in a great spot right now, and I expect it to remain that way for quite a while. We do excellent single target and cleave damage. Your posts are so whiny it's laughable. If you didn't care about being high up on the damage meters you wouldn't be here whining about how Outlaw is tuned.

[Sinbad101]

Well, can't really help you there because I actually still like the spec overall. It's fun, it's fast, and it's still awesome in 5 mans. I don't even hate RtB, tbh. I would just like to see it tightened up just a little bit. Not saying eliminate the rng, since that would defeat the purpose of the ability. Just would like to see the high and low ends of our dps brought a bit closer together.

You see THAT, is a great point. As for how to do that idk, but anything to make it less punishing and defining would be awesome, b/c like you, I like the idea of RtB.

I just hate the Outlaw gold traits and Talents. plus that 50 energy for SS.

- - - Updated - - -

Assassination is in a great spot right now, and I expect it to remain that way for quite a while. We do excellent single target and cleave damage. Your posts are so whiny it's laughable. If you didn't care about being high up on the damage meters you wouldn't be here whining about how Outlaw is tuned.

You don't think much outside your own brain do you?

My post is trying to pinpoint the issues with OUTLAW from a design perspective. Not damage. Dumba-s.
IDc about damage but i do care about how the spec is perceived by the community b/c THAT affects game play and how people treat you in game.
especially b/c there's Mut elitist like you that let their spec do the work for them as it's numbers are high.


Also: When the f-ck did i whine about how Outlaw Damage is tuned?? This whole damn thread I've been asking about issues and solution's to the spec's DESIGN. Go get an education and learn reading comp you bandwagon flavor of the month F-ck



I promise you that if they were to buff Outlaw's dps up to the top 3 spots in the game for the rest of legion, I would still be trying to find way of fixing it's issues, no matter how small. You, would probably either choke on your pride or switch to it.

worst part of being in the rogue community is the vast amount of ignorant shallow minded DPS obsessed Idiots that inhabit it.
This is why i say that if all you care about is DPS and not spec DESIGN and GAME DESIGN, gtfo and play a mage. Or maybe play something easy with high numbers like Assassination, Havoc, or Ret.
F-cking cancer of MMO's.

[stresskiller]

i just miss the combat spec .. cloak and dagger ..

[telygroar]

like it. But more safeguard for bad luck streak would be good

[Sinbad101]

i just miss the combat spec .. cloak and dagger ..

So.. More mobility? good suggestion. But HOW would YOU change it?

- - - Updated - - -

like it. But more safeguard for bad luck streak would be good

Yes that IS the issue, thx

[ymirsson]

Sinbad, please stop posting your biased double standards. If you need some unadulterated confirmation, simpy say so and move on.

And swearing does not make you look cool.

[stresskiller]

So.. More mobility? good suggestion. But HOW would YOU change it?

put it in talent tree instead of the grable hook

[Sinbad101]

Sinbad, please stop posting your biased double standards. If you need some unadulterated confirmation, simpy say so and move on.

And swearing does not make you look cool.

Why are you still here? dude go play the game or get a job. There's no Double standards bro, this post is about discussing Design flaws for Outlaw rogues that most rogues have a problem with. YOU, have yet to add to that. at all.

I'm actually fine with swearing, but i never stoop so low as to patronize someone over the internet that i don't know. But from observation of how YOU'RE on every thread, It's reasonable to assume you are as the title says. So i bleep them out because kids play this game.


Now get off the thread if you refuse to be of any use to the topic of conversation.
and by god man, get outside.

[ymirsson]

I'm actually fine with swearing, but i never stoop so low as to patronize someone over the internet that i don't know.

Are you aware of the fact that you contradicting yourself in the very post you made?
As in most of your posts?

[OperationFerret]

As the mechanic currently stands there are certain RtB combinations that are more desirable for AoE, some that we want for burst and some that are best for ST outside of burst. So it would make more sense if RtB was split into two or three different sub-abilities, each being more tilted towards rolling certain buffs than the other. RtB: Fate, RtB: Yarrr! and RtB: Savvy or something.

[TheCuts]

I like Outlaw a lot and really enjoy playing it, but I also like raiding. Personally, I think to fix roll the bones maybe we could have a mechanic similar to Curse of the Dreadblades where we sacrifice HP for a better chance to reroll? Maybe even just extra rolls. It adds to the your playing with fate part of the fantasy, "Roll the Bones". I also think it would be cool that the ability has you sacrifice increasingly more hp everytime you choose it to reroll in the fight or maybe just a significant flat rate. This would eliminate having to wait 4 to 5 seconds for a new reroll and maybe even add to the fantasy.

[Sinbad101]

Are you aware of the fact that you contradicting yourself in the very post you made?
As in most of your posts?

Dude why are you still here?

you stalk all my post (3), and everybody elses. Are you aware you prove my point by continuing to post useless things? Gtfo, Do you have nothing better to do? Does this make you proud? Gives you a jolly tingle?

loser

[Valnar]

put it in talent tree instead of the grable hook

Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but that's already a thing with acrobatic strikes.

AS is really strong for mobility within fights.

[catablitz]

It's not about Rtb, its about that you must choose and use Rtb.

[mrgibb]

I've been playing Outlaw since release but today i decided to try assassination again.
Let's just say that I'll never go back to Outlaw again.

Sent from my Sony Xperia Z5

[Sinbad101]

It's not about Rtb, its about that you must choose and use Rtb.

Good point there. So how would you change the 100 talent tier and even change SnD to make up for that??
Trying to balance the average power and Fun factor between all those things is what's hard. SnD's biggest problem right now, besides being boring AF and not changing your rotation at all, is that you give up MfD, so perhaps MfD could replace Parley and they then buff dirty tricks somehow to balance that tier.
Throw out some ideas mate.

- - - Updated - - -

I've been playing Outlaw since release but today i decided to try assassination again.
Let's just say that I'll never go back to Outlaw again.

Sent from my Sony Xperia Z5

How is that relevant to the topic?? Nobody cares if you jump onto the flavor of the month bandwagon, it's nothing interesting and such a common decision that it in turn makes you less interesting and therefor less relevant to this topic.

Have fun with Sin, seriously i mean it, but don't come to this type of thread just to tell us some useless info about your personal in game life. Just be happy with your easy af damage and DoT tracking, I'm glad you found your place. But what gave you the idea to even leave that comment? Pride, for doing something easy and expected? Idk man, but i'm glad you gave the thread another reply to keep it up tho. I mean no salt friend