Should bad tanks be penalized if the run doesn't go smooth?

[nekobaka]

well one way is to act like an elitist jerk, like the gentleman two posts above you or the other one 4 posts below you.

Calling people elitist who would not cater to griefers the elitists is comical. Found the griefer who is more than likely the griefing DPS that pulls ahead of tanks. Tradition forum behavior would be calling you the elitist.


At ComputerNerd. Had a tank that announced that they was new. Helped explain to them the pulls and praised them on job well done. They acted surprised that people was helpful. Made me feel sad that such was their response when my behavior for me was common from others as well. Run went well and parted our merry ways. Two dungeon runs later I encounter a tank that demanded the DPS to announce their DPS possibilities or they would AFK. I initiated a vote kick which passed and the group went on. Ah, random queue. Still glad I have instant vote kick ability.

[onesBronson]

No, tanks shouldn't be punished because they're bad. Why?

Because they're trying. Not good enough?

Well vote kick them. Still waiting on a tank afterwards?

RIP.

[Fabled]

Only if bad dps can be penalized if they don't manage a certain number (Outdpsing 2 other lvl 110s with my lvl 101 unholy DK, more damage then both of them combined...), and healers can be penalized if someone died and shit. It all gots to go around.

To your bit about outdpsing 110s, damage scaling is skewed. The numbers you see aren't the numbers they see.

[Deleted]

Shitposting threads like this should be penalized

[Burnick]

How about bad players of any role? Not just tanks...

[Arlee]

Do people honestly tank LFD for those satchels? Am I missing something? You get like what... 2k ap (nothing), 800 gold (who cares), 1-4 runes and the occasional BoA 100AP token that doesn't even scale with artifact power. Which part of tempts anyone to tank for PuGs exactly?

The only time I tank Heroics these days is when the Tank call to arms is up. The chance for a pet/mount is pretty cool and heroic runs are stupid quick; especially since I have spent so much time running M+ runs it worksout to being a good source of AP. Every group I've been in has seemed happy when I do too, though I always tell the healers to give me a shout if they need me to wait a moment. Running heroics is super chill so for me it's not a big deal.

[Pony Soldier]

So you want Blizzard to punish players for not being up to your standards? Yeah, brilliant idea.

[BananaHandsB]

Want bad tank protection, bring a good tank.

[Nohzuko]

Sure. Penalise the tanks. They are playing the easiest role in the game.

If a tank presses button at more than 20% of the rate of a dps then he holds aggro. boss fights in raids are hugely forgiving to a tank. they barely have to move and the most difficult mechanic is press a button before something happens. Pretty fucking easy. Even mouth breathers can tank, if a tank sucks then they are just being negligent. punish them for their negligence.

You know you're describing a bad tank and then say it's easy to be bad right ?
Well, playing DPS and healer is easy too if you do nothing more then the minimum required.

[Kaiarra]

The only time I tank Heroics these days is when the Tank call to arms is up. The chance for a pet/mount is pretty cool and heroic runs are stupid quick; especially since I have spent so much time running M+ runs it worksout to being a good source of AP. Every group I've been in has seemed happy when I do too, though I always tell the healers to give me a shout if they need me to wait a moment. Running heroics is super chill so for me it's not a big deal.

The satchels don't drop mounts/pets or BoA alt gear anymore - thats part of my issue with it. AP is always useful but the amount is too small (lol @ 1.9k @ 13 Artifact research). Golds nice enough but it easier to go herb and make flasks. The best incentive for me to tank for PuGs has always been gear I could send to my alts (pets/mounts were nice but as I own most of them I'd never got anything new).

http://www.wowhead.com/item=140591/s...#reward-from-q

I think they'd encourage more 'good tanks' if they improved the rewards (of course that could also make more clueless tanks sign up for said reward). Maybe they can change it so you only got the satchel if you're over a certain item level rather than certain roles? That way well geared DPS/tanks/healers could all get the satchel. Wouldn't improve queue times but the runs would likely be smoother with more well geared players spread around.

[Violent]

They do, it's called dying and having to run back. Or, losing players to which you then have to wait to replace.

[Arlee]

The satchels don't drop mounts/pets or BoA alt gear anymore - thats part of my issue with it. AP is always useful but the amount is too small (lol @ 1.9k @ 13 Artifact research). Golds nice enough but it easier to go herb and make flasks. The best incentive for me to tank for PuGs has always been gear I could send to my alts (pets/mounts were nice but as I own most of them I'd never got anything new).

http://www.wowhead.com/item=140591/s...#reward-from-q

I think they'd encourage more 'good tanks' if they improved the rewards (of course that could also make more clueless tanks sign up for said reward). Maybe they can change it so you only got the satchel if you're over a certain item level rather than certain roles? That way well geared DPS/tanks/healers could all get the satchel. Wouldn't improve queue times but the runs would likely be smoother with more well geared players spread around.

Well damn... I totally missed that change At least the first heroic a day gives 6k AP but yea there's very little reason to do it.

[SirBeef]

Especially in LFD/LFR, should the game have some sort of "bad tank" protection if in fact the tank isn't pulling their weight / wiping the group / failing at pulls etc?

I've seen so many bad tanks when I do happen to use the LFD tool for the daily heroic, its almost getting unbearable. It really seems like the queue section of the player base has fallen in skill this expansion. Could just be my experience though.

So getting back to penalizing bad tanks, maybe if they solo queued for the bag, they don't get the bag at the end of the run? Or instead of 3 players required to vote kick, only 2 are needed? What suggestions can we make to fix the bad tank situation?

No, that is what real raiding is for. If you queue up for LFR you know what you are getting yourself into. Mostly a bunch of non raiders that are not very good skill wise, who are not communicating and probably do not do any research into the fights or their class. That is why determination is built into LFR. Punish the elitists who try to act like real numbers need to be pulled and try to boot people that fall below regular raiding standards or numbers that cannot be achieved with non raiding gear.

[JTHMRulez1]

DPS complaining about tanks? Is this for real?

If something like this happens the same should be applied to DPS and Healers. Its easy to criticize when you can do your role like crap because there are other people who are also doing it. I've seen little people complain about one guy doing poor DPS but in a wipe either the tank or the healer always gets the blame.

[Deleted]

No, not at all. DPS should try playing tanks - and vice-versa. Why should the sole responsibility of a group depend on the tank? If the tank could literally TURN OFF the abilities of the DPS then fine but otherwise, no. Just, no.

[xChurch]

I'm sure that'd be great for participation number of tanks. Would rather incentivize good tanking than punish bad times.

[Shakari]

Especially in LFD/LFR, should the game have some sort of "bad tank" protection if in fact the tank isn't pulling their weight / wiping the group / failing at pulls etc?

I've seen so many bad tanks when I do happen to use the LFD tool for the daily heroic, its almost getting unbearable. It really seems like the queue section of the player base has fallen in skill this expansion. Could just be my experience though.

So getting back to penalizing bad tanks, maybe if they solo queued for the bag, they don't get the bag at the end of the run? Or instead of 3 players required to vote kick, only 2 are needed? What suggestions can we make to fix the bad tank situation?

Absolutely amazing ... there is a constant shortage of tanks and jay wants to put even more people of tanking ..... daft idea to end all daft idea's.

[Jaylock]

Absolutely amazing ... there is a constant shortage of tanks and jay wants to put even more people of tanking ..... daft idea to end all daft idea's.

Basically a wall should be built to keep bad tanks from tanking with good players. If not a wall, some sort of penalty for bad tanking should be put in place, thats all im advocating.

[Eleccybubb]

Basically a wall should be built to keep bad tanks from tanking with good players. If not a wall, some sort of penalty for bad tanking should be put in place, thats all im advocating.

Should we make DPS pay for the wall?

[xindralol]

No, if you think a person is doing a bad job you could tell em how to get better or if you cant be arsed with that then deal with it

^

this
it's painful enough to heal or tank anything LFR