Rest in peace, Unholy.

[Taeldorian]

But Paladins didn't know they had something in for them when they started complaining either. No one does, because no one has seen anything yet. And with the history Blizzard has of ignoring classes like DK, we can only assume that the "buffs" will range from not enough to nothing (and btw, there was a LOT of complaining before 7.1 landed, and all we got was a 2% ST buff that didn't fix anything). So yes, we tried waiting already, and we didn't get anything. For all we know, with how things have been going so far into Legion, 7.1.5 won't change anything meaningful either. But of course, you can't understand this, since Paladins were fixed early on, while DKs got bandaid fixes that we don't even know how long they're gonna last. Clearly didn't last long enough to keep Unholy worth a shit.

But don't worry, I'll be here to quote you again when PTR notes land and Unholy sees nothing. Just like last patch. I'll then ask you if it's time to start complaining. Let's see if your answer changes to "you don't know what's in patch 7.2".

You do realize that 7.1 only brought buffs/nerfs right? It wasn't suppose to be a big patch. My answer is never "wait and see" unless they say that a patch is going to specifically bring big class changes like 7.1.5 will. Of course I didn't say wait and see until 7.1 because they didn't say big class changes were coming. Now they did.

They've already said this patch is going to change things like talents, legs, etc. I know that's hard to understand, but when they say "a big class patch is coming" then how do you know what to complain about? What you're complaining about could already be changed.

Either way, we'll see. If I'm wrong about next week and nothing good happens for Unholy I'll gladly eat my words. If that's not the case I'll be back to gloat like an asswipe.

[Deleted]

Where, or how, are you able to get the % of how much impact each legendary has?

You sim a char that has the legendary, then you replace the item with a regular epic item and same stats.
And in the case of the bracers you remove some mastery and replace it with crit (because the stat weights are different).

- - - Updated - - -

The difference between the best bracers DK and the best no-bracers DK is 9% DPS on Mythic Ursoc
On heroic Ursoc (so ST only) the difference is 18%

It IS that insane

That is because the bracer effect adds alot of randomness to your dps. So you have higher outliers (best parses are usually outliers that got lucky bracer proccs during the opening burst with potion etc.). However, on average it surely is not 18%. Additionally you can expect most top DKs having bracers, since they play so much that its highly unlikely that they dont have them. That further shifts the top parses in favor of the legendary.

The only way to really tell the effect of the bracers is by mathing it out.

[Hunaxor]

If they nerf the bracers and don't buff unholy by good amount, I will cancel my sub. I am not willing to level another character or grind another artifact because Blizzard is unable to balance their game at all. They had a lot of time to fix it, and if they take only thing keeping unholy in the game away, I am not going to pay for bad service.

[Deleted]

Im sorry but not being able to do competitive DPS without bracers is seriously ridicolous.. If you can't be at all competitive with a certain legendary, the fault is in you. Not the game.
There is no issues being in top 5 dps as unholy without the bracers.

And threatening to unsub and quit the game because they're nerfing a certain legendary which most DK's don't even have, is beyond ridicolous.

[Gamerloin]

The bracers aren't required to play the spec well, at all. I don't have the bracers, and I'm doing great st and aoe dps. The bracers are too strong though, i welcome the nerf if that means they will look into balancing the legendaries overall

[Baddok21]

The bracers aren't required to play the spec well, at all. I don't have the bracers, and I'm doing great st and aoe dps. The bracers are too strong though, i welcome the nerf if that means they will look into balancing the legendaries overall

Bracer and Non-Bracer Unholy requires a buff, you dont simply want to be at "Current Unholy bracers levels" of DPS as that would still be lower tier.

Though now that i have the Shoulders, Wrist AND Belt im smilling for the rest of the expac. (loot spec changed to Blood for M+ pugs etc)

[Zandalariprelate]

One question guys it is a bit off topic but i would like to hear from the community, i am playing an warlock destro and i am not satisface with the whole situation of the class from the numbers and gameplay point of view i was thinking in play my dk which i love both unholy and frost but is really far behind in ilvl and artifact points also in my raid we have a lot of melees 3 retries, 1 monk, 1 dk, 1 warrior, 1 feral, 1 rogue and the rest are ranges dps(2 hunters, 1 shadow priest and 2 warlocks including me)

[Deleted]

Im sorry but not being able to do competitive DPS without bracers is seriously ridicolous.. If you can't be at all competitive with a certain legendary, the fault is in you. Not the game.
There is no issues being in top 5 dps as unholy without the bracers.

And threatening to unsub and quit the game because they're nerfing a certain legendary which most DK's don't even have, is beyond ridicolous.

If you are top 5 DPS in a single target fight like Nythrendra or semi cleave fight like Ursoc without bracers, then your raid team is seriously simply bad. Show me some logs and their percentiles.

If you are 75/ 95 percentile and we assume your other mates have compareable gear and percentile, my bet is they will be at a much higher DPS than you.

Fx at 877 ilvl and 91 percentile i pull 373,9k DPS on renferal. My mage friend on 88 percentile 874 equipped does 403 k.

let that sink in. He is both worse geared, and did worse in his bracket percentile, and still beats me.

Without bracers you are not going to do well on meters, and you will most likely only beat people you would have beaten as any other class anyway. You say it is about skill, but if you are against an equally skilled Shadowpriest, fire mage, demo lock etc on ST fights, you will be beaten, every time any day, you would be happy to even be #10 out of 12 DPS, your only hope would be RNG since our spec's damage can vary wildly on that.

Skill can only carry you to a certain point. It will not carry you over your class limit. Others playing better classes with same skill is gonna beat you. Simple as that.

[Akakishin]

One question guys it is a bit off topic but i would like to hear from the community, i am playing an warlock destro and i am not satisface with the whole situation of the class from the numbers and gameplay point of view i was thinking in play my dk which i love both unholy and frost but is really far behind in ilvl and artifact points also in my raid we have a lot of melees 3 retries, 1 monk, 1 dk, 1 warrior, 1 feral, 1 rogue and the rest are ranges dps(2 hunters, 1 shadow priest and 2 warlocks including me)

I stopped playing warlock after 4xpacks because of how ridiculous their gameplay is(all 3specs period). Unholy and frost have cool design and fun to play style(uh best melee gameplay imo). But numbers aren't good and right now we are in the dark. There is some serious issues with stat scaling for both specs. The best thing you can do right now is to keep AK going for your dk and do emissaries day to day and surammar quest line till some further info comes to play, maybe like 7.1.5 patch note or something.
P.s: Or you can just switch hunter/mage.

[Zandalariprelate]

I stopped playing warlock after 4xpacks because of how ridiculous their gameplay is(all 3specs period). Unholy and frost have cool design and fun to play style(uh best melee gameplay imo). But numbers aren't good and right now we are in the dark. There is some serious issues with stat scaling for both specs. The best thing you can do right now is to keep AK going for your dk and do emissaries day to day and surammar quest line till some further info comes to play, maybe like 7.1.5 patch note or something.
P.s: Or you can just switch hunter/mage.

Thanks for those advice and i hate the actual hunter and mages never liked to me, maybe i would play a shadow priest in the future with some boost because there is no way i am gonna level all to way again

[Schizoide]

If you are top 5 DPS in a single target fight like Nythrendra or semi cleave fight like Ursoc without bracers, then your raid team is seriously simply bad. Show me some logs and their percentiles.

Yep, this is true. Unholy is not a competitive spec without the legendary bracers. That's really the problem, that's why they do need to be nerfed-- and baseline Unholy buffed.

[raionyx]

Yep, this is true. Unholy is not a competitive spec without the legendary bracers. That's really the problem, that's why they do need to be nerfed-- and baseline Unholy buffed.

As long as you realize (Which I think you do) that if they nerf the bracers too much, buffing Baseline Unholy will only leave us in the same position we are now. Honestly a straight buff to baseline Unholy would be warranted. That majorly broken promise of not overturning spec efforts really stung everyone who invested in Unholy up till 7.1

[goriander]

Im sorry but not being able to do competitive DPS without bracers is seriously ridicolous.. If you can't be at all competitive with a certain legendary, the fault is in you. Not the game.
There is no issues being in top 5 dps as unholy without the bracers.

And threatening to unsub and quit the game because they're nerfing a certain legendary which most DK's don't even have, is beyond ridicolous.

Are you seriously this ignorant? In a group of equally skilled and geared players and everyone getting 95-99th percentile parses an unholy dk will always be sitting at the bottom of the dps meter. The guild I used to play in at the start of mythic EN I was always at the top 3 but that was only because I got 95-99th percentile parses (without bracers) on every boss while the others were sitting at 40-75th percentile. That did not make me feel good and it does not make unholy a competitive spec, the other players in my raid group were just playing like trash. If you're topping the meters as an UH DK you might want to find a new guïld.

[Deleted]

If you are top 5 DPS in a single target fight like Nythrendra or semi cleave fight like Ursoc without bracers, then your raid team is seriously simply bad. Show me some logs and their percentiles.

If you are 75/ 95 percentile and we assume your other mates have compareable gear and percentile, my bet is they will be at a much higher DPS than you.

Fx at 877 ilvl and 91 percentile i pull 373,9k DPS on renferal. My mage friend on 88 percentile 874 equipped does 403 k.

let that sink in. He is both worse geared, and did worse in his bracket percentile, and still beats me.

Without bracers you are not going to do well on meters, and you will most likely only beat people you would have beaten as any other class anyway. You say it is about skill, but if you are against an equally skilled Shadowpriest, fire mage, demo lock etc on ST fights, you will be beaten, every time any day, you would be happy to even be #10 out of 12 DPS, your only hope would be RNG since our spec's damage can vary wildly on that.

Skill can only carry you to a certain point. It will not carry you over your class limit. Others playing better classes with same skill is gonna beat you. Simple as that.

1000 times this.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Thanks for those advice and i hate the actual hunter and mages never liked to me, maybe i would play a shadow priest in the future with some boost because there is no way i am gonna level all to way again

If you just want a class that is always upper tier go with warrior, mage or rogue, at least one of their specs is usually brokenly op or bad and another usually at least significantly above average. I guess hunter as well, but no one likes hunters :P.

[Zandalariprelate]

If you just want a class that is always upper tier go with warrior, mage or rogue, at least one of their specs is usually brokenly op or bad and another usually at least significantly above average. I guess hunter as well, but no one likes hunters :P.

Hunters are really boring right now and in the past my main was a warrior fury actually in the past but the artifact weapons are ugly as fuck also we have already 3 warrios in my guild, 2 are the tanks and the other is dps

[Schizoide]

As long as you realize (Which I think you do) that if they nerf the bracers too much, buffing Baseline Unholy will only leave us in the same position we are now. Honestly a straight buff to baseline Unholy would be warranted. That majorly broken promise of not overturning spec efforts really stung everyone who invested in Unholy up till 7.1

Yep, unholy with bracers is in a poor place too.

[Pricklepants]

How about waiting to patch notes?

Pretty much

[Hunaxor]

Yep, unholy with bracers is in a poor place too.

I would say that with the bracers unholy is where it should at least be. Good for AoE and cleave, fine ST dps. Given our lack of mobility and utility we should actually do more than now with bracers, but I don't see that happening.

[Parseval]

It's not just about this bracers, it's about unholy, i don't have this bracers and i want to play unholy but i'm in a HL guild so i can't, i had to respec frost last patch for the progress because i don't have this leg.
The best solution is to nerf the bracers and buff the unholy spec.