"Argus will not be an expansion"

[Alanar]

That seems like a great shame. Argus is an entire planet - it could have sustained multiple expansions as we pushed through to the Legion's main stronghold. If this is truly the end of the Legion it seems odd that they didn't make Argus the new levelling content in the first place.

No it's not, it would be more of the same. Besides this is LEGION expansion.

Also this guy got it right..

I used to think of Argus as an expansion, but I think, especially after the whole orc fatigue fiasco, I realized it's not really a good idea.
There's no way to portray an entire "continent"'s worth of Argus in a way that we could believably quest through, visit distinct biomes, friendly hubs, and find friendly factions on, that wouldn't either be repetitive or completely undermine the concept of the Legion.

Something like Molten Front or Isle of Quel'Danas is probably the most you can get out of it in a way that makes sense

Fully agree.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

As a lore geek this makes me even happier I decided to main my Draenei paladin for this expansion. What better time to play him than when we're going to Argus? Fire up the Exodar; Come fel or high ichor, we're going home!

[Aucald]

I dont know about once and for all, but for at least 2-3 expansions yes.

True, who knows where the story will go from then. I think Blizzard's typical M.O. is stuff concepts in the cooler and then re-visit them if the current arc needs a distraction or just for nostalgia's sake. So while we'll likely peel apart the Legion's command structure, I'm sure demons and their ilk will remain in the Twisting Nether. Like the Scourge situation post-WotLK the Legion may still exist, but they'll no longer be an active threat.

[Trifande]

Some food for thought:

- Burning Legion:
There is no guarantee that Argus spells the end of the Burning Legion. It's the HQ for an extremely distributed organization.
One capable of regenerating their leaders (within a certain set of circumstances). All they need to do if they lose Argus is relocate to another HQ.
Additionally, there's ALWAYS the probability that other leaders exist that want to usurp the positions of either KJ, Archi, or even Sarg.
Not the least, we don't even know if we will face Sargeras, or just some avatar.

- Zone Diversity:
We know nothing about the makeup of the planet, beyond that it used to support Draenei and now is home to the Eredar and other assorted demons (for millennia).
There is quite literally a fuckton of possibilities when designing a variety of zones. Minor example: Do Netherstorm and Hellfire look exactly the same (TBC)? How about either of those compared to Marduum?

- Story Progression:
There is absolutely no cap on the ability of Blizzard to generate new threats to ensure that WoW's story can continue beyond the existing entities or organizations we know. As has been mentioned above, there's also a ton of story to continue based on the threats we DO know (old gods, azshara, void lords, legion, etc.)
Hell, you can even think outside the box a bit and consider additional avenues from them to add new story - Books, Comics, Machinima/Video stories, Tie-ins from other games (perhaps a wc4 even). Regardless of how this might annoy some people, it's all still plausible.

- Expansions and Patches:
Blizz seem dedicated to delivering a constant stream of 'content' in this xpac. If they deliver (and it points strongly towards that atm), and it pays off (i.e. playerbase responds to the type of content by staying subbed), it's likely that the continue down this vein. With that assumption, 7.3 might not be the final patch of legion. It might cap off the primary story of Legion, but there might be a minor/major patch after it to usher in other story. I'd bet on there being a minor patch (7.x.5), at the least.

[alemaite]

Did people honestly think it would be an expansion? It was pretty clear to me it would be a patch. They wouldn't just casually announce a new expansion like that.

[Explorer]

From wowhead:
http://www.wowhead.com/news=257585/l...on-hazzikostas

Is Argus just a raid or a whole new continent?
Argus is not a leveling experience or expansion.
Patch 7.3 is Argus: outdoor zones, instanced contents, raids, other features. Capstone of the story of the Legion expansion.
After the temporary peace, we need to go to the source of the Legion and put a stop to them once and for all.

Sooooo....

PREPARE SARGERAS

[Zandalariprelate]

I expect some new races of the legion in that some and a lot of demons so much that outside of the outpost you need to be very careful or go in a group to survive while you are doing dailies.

[Hawkknight97]

Well I guess there is a point why Argus is not going to be a full on Expansion. But in Patch 7.3 they really got to Amaze us and I really mean Amaze to the make the Patch sounds awesome. I feel like that a outdoor zone and only a raid wouldn't make it very Exciting. Unless of Course if the outdoor zone is huge and big than Molten Front, Isle of Quel'thas, and Isle of Thunder.

You can have that Outdoor content to have like a Huge Portal as the start from the Tomb, You would explore some Ruined Draenei Ruins of a city, there would be like Draenei Ruin Hub where we can rebuild it and make it our base against the legion, Fel Rocky Canyons with Caves of demonic alien creatures, Black sandy Dunes area kind of like the one in Outlands Terokkar Forest area place, and of course a legion black Draenei capital where Kil'jaeden and Archimonde would be at. Plus more new Dungeons and somewhat of a pvp battleground or something. Basically content that would be big and awesome in patch 7.3

[Qualia]

- Burning Legion:
There is no guarantee that Argus spells the end of the Burning Legion. It's the HQ for an extremely distributed organization.
One capable of regenerating their leaders (within a certain set of circumstances). All they need to do if they lose Argus is relocate to another HQ.
Additionally, there's ALWAYS the probability that other leaders exist that want to usurp the positions of either KJ, Archi, or even Sarg.
Not the least, we don't even know if we will face Sargeras, or just some avatar.

It will, though, going by official stance of Blizzard. Of course, the entire Legion wouldn't be destroyed, but they will revert to the version before Sargeras (if we are killing Sargeras in 7.3) or before Archimonde, Kil'Jaeden and the Eredars (if we aren't killing Sargeras in 7.3). Both are much less of a threat compared to them now.

The leader force of the Legion consists of, as far as we know, Sargeras, Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde and their Eredar lieutenants, plus some Dreadlords. Illidan already culled majority of the Dreadlords with his continent burster portal bomb on Nathreza and we are killing Tichondrius + some more in Legion so the Dreadlords are out of the picture. The Eredar lieutenants, fortunately, seem to be positioned in Argus so by the time we assault Argus, we'd kill them. Archimonde is presumably dead at the moment. That left Sargeras and Kil'jaeden. If we finish Kil'Jaeden, even if Sargeras remains alive (which I think would be the more likely possibility), he wouldn't have any important commander left. It wouldn't be just a minor inconvenient solvable by relocating to another HQ. As Illidan put it:

"There is only one way of winning: to assault the Burning Legion where it can be destroyed. It is a slim chance, but it is our only one. We do not have a choice. All we can do is stand and wait to die, or we can take the war to Sargeras and his minions. We will destroy the lieutenants who motivate the Legion’s forces. We will slay Kil’jaeden, and Archimonde, too, if he has been reborn. Sargeras needs commanders to control his soldiers. Without them, the eredar will fall to fighting among one another, and piecemeal may be destroyed."

If we are, by some unknown means, going to finish Sargeras as well? The Legion will revert to the bloodthirsty but disorganized and incompetent version before Sargeras started his Burning Crusade. That wouldn't even be a threat in comparison to current Legion.

- Zone Diversity:
We know nothing about the makeup of the planet, beyond that it used to support Draenei and now is home to the Eredar and other assorted demons (for millennia).
There is quite literally a fuckton of possibilities when designing a variety of zones. Minor example: Do Netherstorm and Hellfire look exactly the same (TBC)? How about either of those compared to Marduum?

We do, though. Even if it's limited information, we know that the entire planet has been bathed in Fel for thousands of years, so much that it's drifting towards the Nether by itself (in comparison, Outland only was pulled towards the Nether because many portals exploded). Fel is kinda anti-life, so it'd be illogical for many natural terrains to remain. No blue water, no snow, no green grass and trees, no brown earth, etc. It'd be filled with zones, as you mentioned, like Netherstorm (without the Eco-domes), Hellfire and Mar'duum - basically a dark purple, red and green theme. As Illidan put it when he observed Argus, "Now it was cold and
cruel. A darkness brooded over the place, and a sense of corruption and loss". There wouldn't be any natural inhabitants left - either they'd have been killed, or turned into demons filled with Fel. Being standalone zone(s) is fine, but as an entire expansion, it's far from diverse enough, people will get bored of it by the time they pass the 2nd or 3rd zone.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I doubt we'll kill Sargeras. Maybe make him unable to interfere with Azeroth or be imprisoned and such but not necessarily completely defeated.

[wych]

That's sad, was always an expansion I was excited for. I guess we'll be plowing straight into Azshara/N'zoth next expansion. was hoping we'd go to Argus for a couple years, then return to find out Azshara had fucked us royally

[Techno-Druid]

yeah its the same as the emerald dream expansion, there would be a few zones, but all the same in the end

green meadows
green forests
red meadows
red forests
thats it
and all the buildings would be based on druidic culture, so it would basicly be rather small look wise...

I would argue that an Emerald Dream expansion would at least be more viable than an Argus expansion. Remember that we've only seen pieces of the Emerald Dream and that it represents the whole of Azeroth without mortal influence. The only major issue I could see is that aside from druids and worgen, there would be no humanoids that you could really create questing behind.

I personally want another MoP-like expansion, off-beat and unique, an expansion that focuses more on character development and throws strange, unexpected twists.

[ravenmoon]

Argus will be an expansion, of which 7.3 would open a small part of.

The next expansion always follows on where the last patch of the previous expansion led, and this one leads to Argus, so i reckon it would be 1 argus zone, and 8.0 will have us go through the other Argus zones.

[Florena]

Argus will be an expansion, of which 7.3 would open a small part of.

The next expansion always follows on where the last patch of the previous expansion led, and this one leads to Argus, so i reckon it would be 1 argus zone, and 8.0 will have us go through the other Argus zones.

I doubt it. Yes MoP led into WoD and WoD to legion using Garrosh and Gul'dan. But they didn't tie in geographically like that. I think instead they're priming the naga and Nzoth for the next expansion.

[Feroxxy]

I just expect Argus to be the size of a whole zone. Passage blocked probably by crevaces, buildings and doors.

[ravenmoon]

I doubt it. Yes MoP led into WoD and WoD to legion using Garrosh and Gul'dan. But they didn't tie in geographically like that. I think instead they're priming the naga and Nzoth for the next expansion.

this time they are reusing a lot of assets right, for multiple purposes... and getting a jump start.

look at the Trial of valor raid.. they used it as questing zone as well as had some dungeons in it, same with suramar

everything is being streamlined and made more efficient to maximize output in the shortest possible time without compromising on content

what this means is that, you will get patches like 7.3 which lead to the new expansion and they'll give us the first zone as they finish working on the rest of the planet for the new expansion.. it's far more efficient that way. #That way you don't haev to wait 1 year for everything! They can realease a small part of the expansion early as a the last patch of the previous one.

but legion effecitvely ends with Tomb of sargeras.

[Deleted]

Seriously, thinking that Argus will be an expansion is denial at this point.

[Deleted]

This 'there isn't diversity enough' is the no new classes argument. Just beacuse you or me can't think of 5 to 6 separate zones all with heavy fel infleunce doesnt mean someone at blizzard can't. That said if blizzard want to wrap up the Legion in Legion I'm all for it . Bring new intresting villains and stories

Still interesting Legion has completely removed the possibility of two speculated expansions Dream and Argus and canablized a speculated zone, broken isles, for the South Seas. Makes me really excited to see what's coming in the a few expansions beyond Nzoth

[Florena]

this time they are reusing a lot of assets right, for multiple purposes... and getting a jump start.

look at the Trial of valor raid.. they used it as questing zone as well as had some dungeons in it, same with suramar

everything is being streamlined and made more efficient to maximize output in the shortest possible time without compromising on content

what this means is that, you will get patches like 7.3 which lead to the new expansion and they'll give us the first zone as they finish working on the rest of the planet for the new expansion.. it's far more efficient that way. #That way you don't haev to wait 1 year for everything! They can realease a small part of the expansion early as a the last patch of the previous one.

but legion effecitvely ends with Tomb of sargeras.

How can it be ending at the tomb when we're getting a whole RAID TIER in Argus? We're not just getting some filler zone there like timeless isle for casual content. It's the culmination of the legion story as they said at blizzcon. Just because they're reusing assets for a FILLER RAID between nightmare and nighthold doesn't mean that they're going to make Argus into an expansion. You're making a lot of assumptions here.

[ravenmoon]

How can it be ending at the tomb when we're getting a whole RAID TIER in Argus? We're not just getting some filler zone there like timeless isle for casual content. It's the culmination of the legion story as they said at blizzcon. Just because they're reusing assets for a FILLER RAID between nightmare and nighthold doesn't mean that they're going to make Argus into an expansion. You're making a lot of assumptions here.

My statement about re-using assets was to demonstrate the shift to greater efficiency. And it hints that they're not afraid to use again somethign they've started. In the case of 7.3 , they will introduce the new world, and they will use it again (re-use) for the new expansion because it will be the first zone of the world.. in which case 8.0 will give us the remaining zones.

This is more efficient. because in reality, during those long breaks between the expansions, they are desigining the new world, in 7.3 they're just going to give the first zone they've done in 7.x instead of in 8.0 -- so in one sense, 7.3 is already the new expansion, all the system changes and the rest of the world will come in 8.0

But it's Argus we're having for 8.0