Barrage isn't areliable aoe ability.

[venomancer]

So, as the title says, I think Barrage has stopped being a reliable aoe ability since the last change it received. I'm sure everyone has noticed that if there's a target 15 yrds higher or lower from where you currently are, and cast barrage, it wont deal any damage at all to those targets.
The "fix" was done with the intention of Barrage not pulling the entire dungeon (including birds that fly 30 feet high, and I'm not sure why those mobs are up there anyway), something that Sidewinders does anyway, it is arguably worse/less controllable than old barrage.
This issue sucks, and I'd love a re-design or even back going back to the old Barrage.

[Eapoe]

Pointed this issue out about 2-3 weeks ago. The fun part is, in certain places (the hill above the cave for Ursoc), if you use Barrage it won't deal damage yet somehow pulls adds off in the distance without actually damaging them.

[mmocfd1b0ab5a3]

I want old barrage back. It was fine for 4 years so why so many barrage fixes now?

[Patrick Star]

Yep. I want the old barrage back for sure. I didn't really understand the change as a player who knows how to position themselves correctly in a dungeon is never going to pull with either Sidewinders or Barrage. This new change is terrible and the lack of damage at certain places in the AoE is a horrid oversight on Blizzard's behalf too.

[zoomgpally]

Yep. I want the old barrage back for sure. I didn't really understand the change as a player who knows how to position themselves correctly in a dungeon is never going to pull with either Sidewinders or Barrage. This new change is terrible and the lack of damage at certain places in the AoE is a horrid oversight on Blizzard's behalf too.

Pretty much, any competent hunter knows how to use barrage properly and only pull when you want to pull.

Except the Ursoc hill, where it can pull mobs far enough to the side to not be hit because reasons, but that happens with the new barrage as well...

[Hyve]

The issue is, albeit you guys knowing the position, most Hunters don't, and it's not you that suffers when it goes wrong. The best thing for Blizzard to do is fix the issues with Barrage, rather than revert it.

[Mirishka]

Change Barrage back to old version, and program it to only deal damage to targets that are in combat. /profit

[Deleted]

Change Barrage back to old version, and program it to only deal damage to targets that are in combat. /profit

But but
If works in that way how i will pull 20 mobs spread all around WQ zone to my poor pet ???

[Arrol]

It requires positioning to make use of the ability, same as the old barrage and same as sidewinders.

I don't really see the issue. It's perfectly reliable for me (how many boss encounters had 20 yard vertical?)

[Sarevokcz]

The issue is, albeit you guys knowing the position, most Hunters don't, and it's not you that suffers when it goes wrong. The best thing for Blizzard to do is fix the issues with Barrage, rather than revert it.

the last change didnt do almost anything for ninjapulling hunters other than not pulling seagulls (and realistically, you still pull them with sidewinders anyway), while screwed any elevated combat, like stairs in BRH etc etc etc

[Fetacheese]

It requires positioning to make use of the ability, same as the old barrage and same as sidewinders.

I don't really see the issue. It's perfectly reliable for me (how many boss encounters had 20 yard vertical?)

Helya is the biggest problem with the stairs. I've also had it miss on Il'gynoth, Ursoc (this one weirded me out), and Dragons. Every time barrage gets changed it feels a little more awkward.

[ohgasauraus]

Change Barrage back to old version, and program it to only deal damage to targets that are in combat. /profit

The problem with that is i want to open with MD and pull multiple mob, but because of your suggestion, i can't. That's a stupid suggestion!

Barrage has always been a L2P issue rather than a the skill itself, revert back is the right way.

Another suggestion to fix barrage is to align it to hunter's primary target, meaning, if the target is in the air, the 15 yard above and below is calculated from the target. This will allow hunter standing below the stairs shooting up and still have barrage hit target above the stairs due to the hunter line of sight. Same goes with hunter standing above the hill shooting down at target at the bottom of the hill.

Blizzard so far has only taken the easy way out by simply chopping off the top and bottom cone rendering the shot useless when using on top of hill or bottom of stair because, that additional calculation to align barrage to hunter's aim is a lot more work.

[Drahzere]

The problem with that is i want to open with MD and pull multiple mob, but because of your suggestion, i can't. That's a stupid suggestion!

Barrage has always been a L2P issue rather than a the skill itself, revert back is the right way.

Another suggestion to fix barrage is to align it to hunter's primary target, meaning, if the target is in the air, the 15 yard above and below is calculated from the target. This will allow hunter standing below the stairs shooting up and still have barrage hit target above the stairs due to the hunter line of sight. Same goes with hunter standing above the hill shooting down at target at the bottom of the hill.

Blizzard so far has only taken the easy way out by simply chopping off the top and bottom cone rendering the shot useless when using on top of hill or bottom of stair because, that additional calculation to align barrage to hunter's aim is a lot more work.

This sounds like the best way to do it, if that's possible. Agree with this (and one of the above posts) about Mirishkas fix not being a good one.. I like using barrage to pull all the things ... it's fine guys just let us be like the starfalling boomkins of cataclysm!

EDIT: Honestly I have more issues with sidewinders than barrage with pulling extra shit.. but that's on a rare occasion. In all honesty if you can't learn to aim barrage properly then you have other problems.

[Deleted]

This sounds like the best way to do it, if that's possible. Agree with this (and one of the above posts) about Mirishkas fix not being a good one.. I like using barrage to pull all the things ... it's fine guys just let us be like the starfalling boomkins of cataclysm!

EDIT: Honestly I have more issues with sidewinders than barrage with pulling extra shit.. but that's on a rare occasion. In all honesty if you can't learn to aim barrage properly then you have other problems.

I can pull unwanted extras with both, but I have more issues with SW too. You never know how big the box is when you use that skill and it seems to be so inconsistent.
Sometimes I wonder if I have to increase my FoV, because I can pull stuff so far on the edge of my screen when I'm at max range, it's not even funny - pretty sure that they aren't even in range for any other skill.
It's both a curse and blessing.

Another annoying thing is the Legacy of the Windrunner proc, it ignores walls, doors, and probably even range requirements and when you tab through mobs while spamming AiS, cancel it, tab to another one which is behind a wall, the 6 arrows will hit that target instead. I literally managed to pull an extra table inside HoV with Legacy of the Windrunner - I don't even.... The worst part about it is that they flew in a totally different direction thanks to tab-targeting doing some wonky stuff.
I was standing at the gate right before the tables, I hug the wall so that I don't have LoS to any of the patrolling mobs, we pulled the left table, my Legacy pulled the right table, which isn't visible... at all.

[ohgasauraus]

I can pull unwanted extras with both, but I have more issues with SW too. You never know how big the box is when you use that skill and it seems to be so inconsistent.
Sometimes I wonder if I have to increase my FoV, because I can pull stuff so far on the edge of my screen when I'm at max range, it's not even funny - pretty sure that they aren't even in range for any other skill.
It's both a curse and blessing.

Another annoying thing is the Legacy of the Windrunner proc, it ignores walls, doors, and probably even range requirements and when you tab through mobs while spamming AiS, cancel it, tab to another one which is behind a wall, the 6 arrows will hit that target instead. I literally managed to pull an extra table inside HoV with Legacy of the Windrunner - I don't even.... The worst part about it is that they flew in a totally different direction thanks to tab-targeting doing some wonky stuff.
I was standing at the gate right before the tables, I hug the wall so that I don't have LoS to any of the patrolling mobs, we pulled the left table, my Legacy pulled the right table, which isn't visible... at all.

Imagine a triangle point starting from you(the hunter) to your target in the middle of the base of the triangle, the further you are, the wider the SW hits because the triangle becomes larger. That is how SW works. Standing nearer ensure you do not hit other mobs, while standing further ensure you hit more mobs. I kinda like how SW is now except the same reason as barrage, having a vertical hit as well. it needs to have that top and bottom cone chopped off but also align the shots to the target as explain in my previous post.

I dun mind the vertical hit, but a lot of hunters do and it is especially annoying in EoA pulling those seagulls flying in the sky.

[satimy]

Somehow they managed to make barrage worse

[Sarevokcz]

Imagine a triangle point starting from you(the hunter) to your target in the middle of the base of the triangle, the further you are, the wider the SW hits because the triangle becomes larger. That is how SW works. Standing nearer ensure you do not hit other mobs, while standing further ensure you hit more mobs. I kinda like how SW is now except the same reason as barrage, having a vertical hit as well. it needs to have that top and bottom cone chopped off but also align the shots to the target as explain in my previous post.

I dun mind the vertical hit, but a lot of hunters do and it is especially annoying in EoA pulling those seagulls flying in the sky.

yeah, we know its a cone/triangle, just that it gets ridiculously wide if you actually stand at 50 yards and benefit from your mastery, I have pulled stuff on sides several times, that was literally off the screen, maybe its time to upgrade to 21:9 just so I could see what I ninjapulled?

I believe the best solution for barrage would be for the chop off to be smaller than what it is now, it would also need to be based on elevation targets are, not of the player and only work on minions out of combat, its ridiculous, that i cant barrage up/down the hill/stairs even if it is only a single target

[Lioo]

Change Barrage back to old version, and program it to only deal damage to targets that are in combat. /profit

how i pull spiders to tank with it?

[Deleted]

Imagine a triangle point starting from you(the hunter) to your target in the middle of the base of the triangle, the further you are, the wider the SW hits because the triangle becomes larger. That is how SW works. Standing nearer ensure you do not hit other mobs, while standing further ensure you hit more mobs. I kinda like how SW is now except the same reason as barrage, having a vertical hit as well. it needs to have that top and bottom cone chopped off but also align the shots to the target as explain in my previous post.

I dun mind the vertical hit, but a lot of hunters do and it is especially annoying in EoA pulling those seagulls flying in the sky.

Barrage works the same way, but the "box" isn't as large as SW's... SW "horizontal" spread is just absurd. It basically goes from the left hand corner to the right hand corner at max range and max camera distance...I'll probably never get used to it because the spread increase/range ratio doesn't seem fluid but rather "small box - bigger, barrage size box - entire screen"

[Deleted]

It never was.

It always came with a pinch of unreliability.
You either were an unreliable DD because of the high chance you will cock up and pull half the instance with it
---OR--- (as it currently is)
A bit of the above+you actually had to be eye-to-eye with the targets for it to hit them

I prefer the current version, since we usually don't lack the DPS and the pulls are easier to handle.