With two abilities, you could repair the damage done to Brewmasters

[Saverem]

Please don't make Guard cost DPS resource energy to use. We're already one of the lowest DPS tanks as it is, we don't need to be further nerfing our damage.

If they make Guard cost 60 energy, then they need to remove the energy cost of KS altogether.

[thesmall001]

You're saying the same thing in a different way.

Balance is relative. There is no magic number that you want to shoot for - how good one class is depends on how they stack up against everyone else. It's easier to buff (or nerf) singular outliers than it is to balance everyone else around the outlier, particularly when we're talking about something as nebulous as "raid utility". Taking other people's away is not a good idea. Adding more where it's lacking is better, particularly since Tank spots in groups are limited (you're not going to start bringing 4 tanks to a fight just because one tank has some useful ability).

To be clear, I never said we don't have a raid utility problem. We absolutely have a raid utility problem. The raid-wide Stagger CD sounds great to me. Let's get that in ASAP. Can you imagine the synergy, in an AoE nuke phase, between the an AoE HoT and a raid-wide Stagger?

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Please don't make Guard cost DPS resource energy to use. We're already one of the lowest DPS tanks as it is, we don't need to be further nerfing our damage.

If they make Guard cost 60 energy, then they need to remove the energy cost of KS altogether.

Well the proposal would be 60 Energy every 45 seconds. No major loss. That's like 5 Tiger Palms a fight. Ain't nobody gonna be missing those. Our DPS problem more stems from RJW damage being way too low and KS radius being a little bit unforgiving vs. Blood Boil or Thunder Clap. Blackout Strike should also be a bit higher since everybody is taking Combo and using it on CD when it was originally envisioned as a DPS trade-off filler.

[Saverem]

To be clear, I never said we don't have a raid utility problem. We absolutely have a raid utility problem. The raid-wide Stagger CD sounds great to me. Let's get that in ASAP. Can you imagine the synergy, in an AoE nuke phase, between the an AoE HoT and a raid-wide Stagger?

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Well the proposal would be 60 Energy every 45 seconds. No major loss. That's like 5 Tiger Palms a fight. Ain't nobody gonna be missing those. Our DPS problem more stems from RJW damage being way too low and KS radius being a little bit unforgiving vs. Blood Boil or Thunder Clap. Blackout Strike should also be a bit higher since everybody is taking Combo and using it on CD when it was originally envisioned as a DPS trade-off filler.

Any DPS nerf will suck. I've already been passed in M+ groups and Kara mount run because the Prot Pally does as much damage as the DPS on trash packs. Don't really need to have our DPS nerfed further.

If it's already on a CD restriction, what's the point of making it cost resources as well? Makes no sense. Just make it free and put it behind a CD wall. Boom. Done. Putting it on a long CD AND making it cost DPS resources is just stupid and redundant. We aren't prot warriors who use their rage purely on Def abilities. Warriors GENERATE rage with their DPS abilities and then spend rage on Def, we are the opposite, we USE energy on DPS and our defenses are free but behind a CD wall. Guard should be no different.

[Nalorakk]

So, I disagree with pretty much everything you've said. I don't know where everybody is having this problem with AoE pick-ups. RJW exists and is pretty much uncontested in that row. KS is excellent snap pick-up, made even better when you get the traits that make it ranged, and -failing both of those- you should know how to use Ox Totem effectively to draw ranged mob pick-up anyway. Sure, Leg Sweep is pretty excellent for M+, but it's a matter of choice.

You shouldn't be taking Gift of the Mists, so you gain nothing from not using Oxrbs asap, sub-35% is where you should save Healing Elixir to use. They even made that passive (a good bit of casual QoL) so you shouldn't have that problem, and you shouldn't be dropping that low to begin with because our burst taken is so low that a healer has no urgency in keeping us above 50% -- let alone 35%, and then you have Fortifying Brew for when it really hits the fan.

Thus proving that brewmaster talents fail the purpose of Legion talents. Having to talent into basic tank AoE is appalling.
Fortifying Brew is one charge on a 7 minute cooldown, if you get messed up early in an encounter you might be able to cast it twice per boss fight. Considering it's your only other mitigation tool besides Stagger, any extra pressure is entirely out of your hands.

You absolutely should not be using Brews on CD, you should be maintaining ISB (which, again -- with traits, should leave slack for 1-2 PBs) unless you know damage is fairly low for a few seconds so you can let half a brew re-fill in that window. We have very high amounts of Total Damage Reduction through our Mastery (even in low Mastery gear) which provides an undiminshed ~12% Dodge that doubles every auto-attack we don't dodge. We Dodge almost as much as Paladins Block. Honestly, we have phenomenal synergy with Resto Druids, Holy Priest and Mistweavers. We do sit at around 80% constantly. I get that it's "stressful" if you like to auto-run between packs but we have ~9% more HP than most Tanks to compensate for that.

"And using brews as needed" (including healing elixir ofc), I didn't think that needed any extra explanation because there's only one way to use your brew charges: ISB uptime as high as possible while storing a charge for emergency purify, maybe if the damage is light but spikey you can keep ISB down a little more in exchange for more purifies but these situations are rare.

Boss autoattacks aren't often an issue, it's only in combination with spikey abilities or fights like Ursoc where autoattacks matter, almost nullifying a brewmaster's main way of avoiding damage (which is passive and requires no input on part of the monk anyways). And no, sitting around 80% isn't stressful, what's stressful is dumping all of your heals into a monk and watching his health bar tick down even lower while your entire group also needs healing.

I'm not sure if you're just throwing an opinion into the ring having only healed 1-2 bad BrMs or maybe you're the one who hasn't read up on the details of how to play one properly. But most of what you've said sounds more based on Celestalon's outdated "How To Play" post than actual experience with BrM in the game. I don't MEAN to be dismissive, but are you going on principles or actual experience?

Personally, I think our niche is great and more Tanks should be lucky enough to have them, it'd take the weight of our shoulders and maybe make Warriors, Druids and Paladins feel more like their own specs instead of a generic "Tank" spec that fits Blizzard's cookie-cutter.

Experience.

Warriors, Druids and Paladins do not feel generic to me. They have different forms of active mitigation which interacts with resources and other components of the kit, which is something Brewmaster is missing in excess.

Brewmaster has next to 0 interaction.

[thesmall001]

@Nalorakk

They all have roughly the same AM kit: a Heal/Absorb for magic damage and maintenance buff for physical mitigation. They all have relatively weak Masteries that mildly improve their strong active mitigation. We have a relatively strong Mastery that acts entirely passively and functions regardless of our AM. This is looking at the kit-level before we consider -how- we gear: Our RAW value of Mastery is potent.

Flat 8% undiminished Dodge (100%)
vs.
Only 12% chance to crit block (60%) when they block (30%) roughly 60% of the time.

My point being: Our kit has some very potent passive mitigation baked into it to keep our TDR roughly on par. I see the point you're making: they have mitigation AND avoidance AND active mitigation. They also lack control over their damage taken and have their respective weaknesses, whilst we are average out across all measures. Overall, we likely take no more than 10-15% more damage TOTAL than other tanks.

And auto-attack damage is all we're talking about because most Tanking mechanics are tuned around that, it's the baseline of how much damage you appear to take. You shouldn't be needing to Purify auto-attacks, ever, because Mastery and Gift of the Ox Orbs should be quite sufficiently keeping your healers happy with regards to that. Yes, the damage PATTERN is different and that can be alarming to healers (normally damage taken ebs and flows) but the numerical amount should not be much higher than anybody other than a Druid and Druids are the outlier here.

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Any DPS nerf will suck. I've already been passed in M+ groups and Kara mount run because the Prot Pally does as much damage as the DPS on trash packs. Don't really need to have our DPS nerfed further.

If it's already on a CD restriction, what's the point of making it cost resources as well? Makes no sense. Just make it free and put it behind a CD wall. Boom. Done. Putting it on a long CD AND making it cost DPS resources is just stupid and redundant. We aren't prot warriors who use their rage purely on Def abilities. Warriors GENERATE rage with their DPS abilities and then spend rage on Def, we are the opposite, we USE energy on DPS and our defenses are free but behind a CD wall. Guard should be no different.

Btw, I don't think we should get Guard back re-guard-less (geddit?) so it's totally moot. We more than sufficiently handle magical burst without Guard.

[Jaigar]

I have to disagree myself. I'll admit that when I first started playing BrM that AoE threat was a problem, but you just have to learn to target better (for example, hit the mob right in the middle of the pack with keg smash then taunt the one that may have not gotten hit). I still use RJW since its easy mode, but I may try experimenting here. RJW works better with HT or Elusive Dancer as your globals matter a bit less then.

And I'm glad guard is gone. It sucks that warriors got it, but without Ignore Pain, where would warriors be right now? I personally enjoy the stagger mechanic with shared brew charges because you have to smartly manage that resource. There is limited use on energy , but I'm not sure it needs anything more.

My BrM is a speed demon. Between momentum from Chi Torpedo and Swift as the Course River, I just fly around. One thing I noticed gets ignored in M+ tanking as BrM is the power of kiting. Once I get good agro, if I start running low on brews, I can keep enemies at a distance for a long time. I can kite bosses long enough to get Necrotic stacks to just drop.

My only complaint is that BoC should be baseline in some form.

[Nalorakk]

@Nalorakk

They all have roughly the same AM kit: a Heal/Absorb for magic damage and maintenance buff for physical mitigation. They all have relatively weak Masteries that mildly improve their strong active mitigation. We have a relatively strong Mastery that acts entirely passively and functions regardless of our AM. This is looking at the kit-level before we consider -how- we gear: Our RAW value of Mastery is potent.

Flat 8% undiminished Dodge (100%)
vs.
Only 12% chance to crit block (60%) when they block (30%) roughly 60% of the time.

My point being: Our kit has some very potent passive mitigation baked into it to keep our TDR roughly on par. I see the point you're making: they have mitigation AND avoidance AND active mitigation. They also lack control over their damage taken and have their respective weaknesses, whilst we are average out across all measures. Overall, we likely take no more than 10-15% more damage TOTAL than other tanks.

And auto-attack damage is all we're talking about because most Tanking mechanics are tuned around that, it's the baseline of how much damage you appear to take. You shouldn't be needing to Purify auto-attacks, ever, because Mastery and Gift of the Ox Orbs should be quite sufficiently keeping your healers happy with regards to that. Yes, the damage PATTERN is different and that can be alarming to healers (normally damage taken ebs and flows) but the numerical amount should not be much higher than anybody other than a Druid and Druids are the outlier here.

I'm not sure what you mean by "they also lack control over their damage taken" when they have passive mitigation, active mitigation and ways to avoid damage. Brewmasters don't have control, it all just comes and it comes. The most control Brewmasters have over their damage taken is purify timing.

The damage pattern is very different, but also the raw damage is a lot higher.
Demon Hunters, Paladins and Druids need less healing because they have a lot of mitigation and healing of their own.
Death Knights need less healing because they're their own healer.
Warriors need less healing because they avoid taking damage in the first place and have powerful mitigation tools in the case of damage spikes.

Brewmasters? They take almost no immediate damage, but it all still comes. They do have decent self-healing, but it's nothing special and certainly can't compete with the damage they still get smashed by.

There's a reason Brewmasters are ridiculously underrepresented right now, and it's not because people don't 'get' them. It's not like Stagger is a new mechanic, it's been around for ages now. WoD Brewmaster was one of the most enjoyable specs in the game and now it's become... this.

[Brickwalls]

Just something to fix the clunk. I don't find BrM complicated as much as I find them clunky. Too many buttons for the same effects as other tanks.

[thesmall001]

I'm not sure what you mean by "they also lack control over their damage taken" when they have passive mitigation, active mitigation and ways to avoid damage. Brewmasters don't have control, it all just comes and it comes. The most control Brewmasters have over their damage taken is purify timing.

The damage pattern is very different, but also the raw damage is a lot higher.
Demon Hunters, Paladins and Druids need less healing because they have a lot of mitigation and healing of their own.
Death Knights need less healing because they're their own healer.
Warriors need less healing because they avoid taking damage in the first place and have powerful mitigation tools in the case of damage spikes.

Brewmasters? They take almost no immediate damage, but it all still comes. They do have decent self-healing, but it's nothing special and certainly can't compete with the damage they still get smashed by.

There's a reason Brewmasters are ridiculously underrepresented right now, and it's not because people don't 'get' them. It's not like Stagger is a new mechanic, it's been around for ages now. WoD Brewmaster was one of the most enjoyable specs in the game and now it's become... this.

They lack control because they don't choose when their AM is most effective. It is either up or down, and it will not get stronger or weaker based on how they use it. Only exception is DKs and Druids, who can time DS and FR for optimal healing, which is akin to our delaying a PB.

This is my point though:

We have okay self-healing, sure it's not DK levels, but it's still good.
We have good heal boost, sure it's not Druid's Mastery, but it's still good.
We have great avoidance, probably the highest of any class.
We have high HP, maybe not as high as a Druid, but a few % higher than any Plate user.
We have high control because we smooth those damage spikes that most Tanks need AM + CD to survive or not get chunked.
We have poor mitigation but that's the smallest factor in how hard a Tank is to heal.

Thus, relative balance.

Is the trade off of slightly more damage taken overall, and it is slightly -- not the massive gulf you seem to believe, for never being able to be burst worth it? I'd say heck yes.

Could we use more Raid Utility to make us more competitive? Absolutely.

Could our damage afford to be a bit higher? Fo' sho.

Could we benefit from having something to help off-set our weakness to high sustained magic damage? Also, yes.

But Stagger, and our Brews being throttled, are not the problem here.

[Raakel]

There's a reason Brewmasters are ridiculously underrepresented right now, and it's not because people don't 'get' them. It's not like Stagger is a new mechanic, it's been around for ages now. WoD Brewmaster was one of the most enjoyable specs in the game and now it's become... this.

^ so much this!

I had the most fun in ages tanking as BrM in WoD / Pandaria and after Legion pre patch I felt like someone close to me has died. It was sad...

It took me two months until I could play him again and now it just feels kind of ok'ish but the huge smile on my face while tanking as BrM is gone.

[Nalorakk]

They lack control because they don't choose when their AM is most effective. It is either up or down, and it will not get stronger or weaker based on how they use it. Only exception is DKs and Druids, who can time DS and FR for optimal healing, which is akin to our delaying a PB.

This is my point though:

We have okay self-healing, sure it's not DK levels, but it's still good.
We have good heal boost, sure it's not Druid's Mastery, but it's still good.
We have great avoidance, probably the highest of any class.
We have high HP, maybe not as high as a Druid, but a few % higher than any Plate user.
We have high control because we smooth those damage spikes that most Tanks need AM + CD to survive or not get chunked.
We have poor mitigation but that's the smallest factor in how hard a Tank is to heal.

Thus, relative balance.

Is the trade off of slightly more damage taken overall, and it is slightly -- not the massive gulf you seem to believe, for never being able to be burst worth it? I'd say heck yes.

Could we use more Raid Utility to make us more competitive? Absolutely.

Could our damage afford to be a bit higher? Fo' sho.

Could we benefit from having something to help off-set our weakness to high sustained magic damage? Also, yes.

But Stagger, and our Brews being throttled, are not the problem here.

I don't see why you're so opposed to the idea of playing a class instead of the hollow shell of what was once a class.

Brewmasters have no opportunity to shine as players.

Do you keyboard turn? No.
Do you have good keybinds? Yes.

Great! You too can join the top ranks of Brewmasters, which is rightfully below the middle of the pack of every other tank spec.

There is no competition for resources, there is no 'extra' to the same rotation you do as soon as you finish unlocking your abilities. There is no creative or clever or personal use of your kit you can do to flourish and stand out as a tank because you only have the same thing to do over and over again which is ineffective compared to other tanks, which have this level of depth to boot.

The spec plays like it was made in 2004 with invisible benefits all over the place and responsibility shifted out of your hands - be it passive RNG avoidance or your lack of ability to reduce raw damage throughput being taken out of the healer's mana bar.

Stagger (and thus your brews) are very much a problem because you're an absolute slave to them. The current state of Brewmaster can NEVER be a healthy asset to the game. If Stagger isn't threatening, they'd be completely overtuned and riskless tanks. If Stagger isn't good enough then it's all the problems I've detailed in this thread amplified. The current tuning makes them almost passable if you don't mind being screwed over. They're an anchor on the team because their wretched design has removed all the control the spec used to have.

You talk a lot about how Brewmasters have the ability to control the damage they take, your logic is completely backwards when you think other tanks don't have this ability.

The only control Brewmasts have over the damage they take is purifying brew, because it doesn't matter how much Stagger % you have if all the damage still catches up to you.

The spec is deadbeat and poorly designed compared to what it used to be and that is why nobody is playing it right now. I love the changes Blizzard has made to every spec I've played in Legion with the lone exception of Brewmaster. I don't even want to log into my Monk because it'd be more enjoyable to flay myself with a bed of nails.

[Asrialol]

I don't see why you're so opposed to the idea of playing a class instead of the hollow shell of what was once a class.

Brewmasters have no opportunity to shine as players.

Do you keyboard turn? No.
Do you have good keybinds? Yes.

Great! You too can join the top ranks of Brewmasters, which is rightfully below the middle of the pack of every other tank spec.

There is no competition for resources, there is no 'extra' to the same rotation you do as soon as you finish unlocking your abilities. There is no creative or clever or personal use of your kit you can do to flourish and stand out as a tank because you only have the same thing to do over and over again which is ineffective compared to other tanks, which have this level of depth to boot.

The spec plays like it was made in 2004 with invisible benefits all over the place and responsibility shifted out of your hands - be it passive RNG avoidance or your lack of ability to reduce raw damage throughput being taken out of the healer's mana bar.

Stagger (and thus your brews) are very much a problem because you're an absolute slave to them. The current state of Brewmaster can NEVER be a healthy asset to the game. If Stagger isn't threatening, they'd be completely overtuned and riskless tanks. If Stagger isn't good enough then it's all the problems I've detailed in this thread amplified. The current tuning makes them almost passable if you don't mind being screwed over. They're an anchor on the team because their wretched design has removed all the control the spec used to have.

You talk a lot about how Brewmasters have the ability to control the damage they take, your logic is completely backwards when you think other tanks don't have this ability.

The only control Brewmasts have over the damage they take is purifying brew, because it doesn't matter how much Stagger % you have if all the damage still catches up to you.

The spec is deadbeat and poorly designed compared to what it used to be and that is why nobody is playing it right now. I love the changes Blizzard has made to every spec I've played in Legion with the lone exception of Brewmaster. I don't even want to log into my Monk because it'd be more enjoyable to flay myself with a bed of nails.

Ion said Brewmasters are very good right now.

Thus, you're wrong. Anything you say, regarding how "bad" BRM is, is therefore false.

[Nalorakk]

Ion said Brewmasters are very good right now.

Thus, you're wrong. Anything you say, regarding how "bad" BRM is, is therefore false.

tru
/10chars

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Please don't make Guard cost DPS resource energy to use. We're already one of the lowest DPS tanks as it is, we don't need to be further nerfing our damage.

If they make Guard cost 60 energy, then they need to remove the energy cost of KS altogether.

Things could be tuned around that, I know as far as questing went, leveling my monk felt the slowest and most tedious of all the tanks.

It's not like Brewmasters will ever be breaking damage meters after all.

[Segus1992]

Spinning Crane Kick and Guard.

Spinning Crane Kick would reduce the cooldown on your brews for every mob hit, up to a cap of 4 seconds and cost 40 energy.

Why?
Because having no baseline AoE filler in 2016 is fucking stupid. It's leaps and bounds backwards in tanking QoL.


Guard would cost 60 energy and grant you a decent shield, on a 5 second cooldown. Damage sustained by the Guard shield does not interact with Stagger (Stagger won't impact the shield and damage blocked by the shield will not be delayed by Stagger).

Why?
Right now, Brewmasters have no real resource because nothing competes. You spend energy to reduce the cooldowns on your brews, but your brews don't alter in pattern 99% of the time. You have nothing else to do outside of that.

With Guard you can choose between interacting with your Stagger or simply avoiding the damage to begin with. It supplements Stagger well in the sense you can build up a big stagger bar and avoid incoming damage while it cleans itself up, at the expense of lowering the cooldowns of your brews. Every other tank in Legion has to compete with its resources in some way, Brewmaster doesn't and that's partially why it's currently dead boring.

The spec is now fun and good again.
Rejoice.
Be happy.

Yes I am aware balancing this will be a bit difficult initially because of how disruptive it is to Brewmaster's current (dumb) function.

For AoE, make the statue baseline like it used to be. Such a fantastic threat tool on such a valuable tier of talents (for dungeons). It can be a little hard to use when it has such a big radius though.

For survival, Guard works. Though I'd prefer a heal (one that is reliable and on demand) as BrM already has tools for stopping damage temporarily.

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Ion said Brewmasters are very good right now.

Thus, you're wrong. Anything you say, regarding how "bad" BRM is, is therefore false.

Pretty sure he commented on their survival, not their QoL. Survival in the grand scheme of things isn't terrible - it's how you get it that's the problem.

I know it's popular to hate on devs, but come on.

[Xahz]

So, I disagree with pretty much everything you've said. I don't know where everybody is having this problem with AoE pick-ups. RJW exists and is pretty much uncontested in that row. KS is excellent snap pick-up, made even better when you get the traits that make it ranged, and -failing both of those- you should know how to use Ox Totem effectively to draw ranged mob pick-up anyway. Sure, Leg Sweep is pretty excellent for M+, but it's a matter of choice. You can even Taunt the statue to turn it into an AoE Taunt.

AoE threat generation is a necessary tool for a tank to have; it should not be in a talent tier, end of story. It would be equivalent to having Provoke in a tier against Leg Sweep - a major defensive cooldown in Mythic+. Ostensibly you would have a choice, but you really wouldn't since you can't function as a tank without a taunt.

[Deleted]

I have to disagree myself. I'll admit that when I first started playing BrM that AoE threat was a problem, but you just have to learn to target better (for example, hit the mob right in the middle of the pack with keg smash then taunt the one that may have not gotten hit). I still use RJW since its easy mode, but I may try experimenting here. RJW works better with HT or Elusive Dancer as your globals matter a bit less then.

I disagree with you, you've just proven that it's not impossible to pick up aoe threat in packs of 3. not that aoe threat isn't a problem, a need to use taunt to get aggro on a pull isn't a good a solution although it is a solution.
also i don't the issue is keg smash as I said in my first post i think the issue is what the traits do to our abilities.

wowhead.com/spell=213050/smashed Smashed
wowhead.com/spell=213183/dragonfire-brewDragon fire brew
Greatly help us with aoe threat, but are very deep in the tree with dragon fire brew being what people usually pick up last if they read any guides, which and this is presumptuous they probably do due to the bad rep about BrM.

Without these pulling aoe threat as brew is more annoying than it should be, with them it becomes much easier, but here's the thing not many people trying brew will invest that deeply that quickly or know that you really need rwj to be like other tanks.

honestly why
wowhead.com/spell=214428/full-keg Full Keg is unlocked before the much more important Smashed I'll never know. brewmaster might need to be kinder on people trying the spec, it really feels like the spec rewards you a lot if you have good gear and have invested and a lot in your artifact its just not many people were going to with all the bad press.

can't post links feels powerful.

[Will]

I think the mastery should be changed to work on a per-target basis tbh. As it stands our mastery is great vs a single foe that hits very powerfully but slowly, but against fast hitting AoE packs it's awful. Instead of stacking an increasing dodge chance on the tank each time an attack isn't dodged, it should stack an increasing chance for the next attack to be dodged by the tank ON THE TARGET. This means in an AoE situation the mastery has the same effectiveness PER TARGET. So if 3 targets all hit us, each one has the X% increased chance their next attack on us is dodged.

[trm90]

WoD BrM was fun but Guard was dump and stagger felt inconsequential thanks to Chi Explosion doing all the work for you. I agree that the current iteration of BrM 'feels' worse but the design philosophy should stay the same.

[Deleted]

Combine Chi Burst with RJW, make it baseline, make it AOE dmg & heal BUT way less than Chi Burst and RJW do now. Instead make the dmg/healing power depend on stagger values or dmg avoided over time or something like this, with a relatively small base value, but become at least somewhat significant with high numbers (like current RJW dmg + same healing level when you're in high yellow stagger).
Or make Keg Smash leave a small pool on the ground (as it is now) which works like a small monk version of the resto drood mushroom - players in it become a little intoxicated = increased dodge/avoidance or even stagger (without purification, but still - smooth out dmg intake). Do the same for Special Delivery and suddently BoC + SD become baseline talents. Make Exploding Keg debuff work for all raid/party (the 3 sec miss debuff) and suddently BM is the most welcome tank of them all.

I still think BMonks are fine as they are now. No keyboard mashing bears (the hunter among tanks - press all which is NOT on CD and deliver top results and everyone wants you in team), no warriors with 2 keybinds (Ignore Pain + 1button macro to spam all other skills on CD), no endlessly self-healing BDKs or DHs, no flashy shiny shield-flinging Captain America's with 1 overtuned talent which makes them basically a DPS class with a shield.
BMonks are fine in my book and experience - for what they are intended and within their fantasy.

Zoom, kite, avoid, smash, zoom, dodge, breathe, zoom, smash their heads with your mofo kegs (Keg Smash, Keg on Stick - weapon, Exploding Keg, Special Delivery) ... be surprised everyone died but you, die from stagger cause you ran out of brews and your healer died

[Targom]

My BrM is a speed demon. Between momentum from Chi Torpedo and Swift as the Course River, I just fly around. One thing I noticed gets ignored in M+ tanking as BrM is the power of kiting. Once I get good agro, if I start running low on brews, I can keep enemies at a distance for a long time. I can kite bosses long enough to get Necrotic stacks to just drop.

But if other tanks don't have to kite and can stand and deal damage, the entire run becomes faster. Yea, we can kite but that reduces our damage dealing uptime greatly since we can only Keg Smash at that point. When time matters, as it does in M+, tank damage matters. We are already the lowest damage tank with good uptime and that only falls off the more we have to kite.