7.1.5 Demon Speed artifact trait nerf

[Shirofune]

Didn't mean they'd be better in terms of damage, but the builds will yield more variety for our class. Flexibility for any class is nice, more so for the players who don't push high level m+ / Mythic raiding.

Nice, but what matters at the end is if we're competitive or not.

I will not say we're gonna be worse or better than now 'cause its way too soon, but if its a nerf, I don't give a flying fuck if there's a new spec.

So far, there's a new legendary to farm, and we all know how lovely mr RNGysus is (and how Blizzard still loves it to keep getting money from subs from people farming em).

[Deleted]

Didn't mean they'd be better in terms of damage, but the builds will yield more variety for our class. Flexibility for any class is nice, more so for the players who don't push high level m+ / Mythic raiding.

If you are talking about non competitive play, just go ahead and play it, doesn't matter if anything gets buffed or nerfed, just do what is the most fun for you.

[Matchles]

It's this type of mentality that has ruined the class in my opinion (if the changes go through as they are), there is no time in the history of the game where this scenario has existed, in these types of comparisons the one which can yield more benefit is chosen 100% of the time, if they buffed nemesis enough that it would be as good or better than momo then literally every DH would swap to it, there wouldn't be this "well i prefer playing with momo so I'm gonna play it even though its worse" it just doesn't happen in the real world.

The changes to Havoc are pretty devastating overall, all they needed to do was nerf the ring and buff our ST damage to compensate for that so that we didn't require a legendary to be good ST, they also should have just changed the Blur artifacct trait to have nothing to do with Blur, we should have just got a new ability that reset the CD on Fel Rush, you guys can argue all you want but as it stands DH's are shit in 7.1.5

That's bull. There are plenty of situations where some people pick the lower skill cap talent that does a bit less damage to simplify their rotation. Those that refuse to end up doing shit for damage if they can't get the more complex rotation down. If someone can't get used to the momentum style of play, there should be a competitive option for them to switch to. It is absolutely insane to argue for cookie cutter talent trees and arguing against so certainly isn't "ruining the class."

[Toffie]

Watching different specs that are performing amazing right now getting buffed is making me lose my faith in blizzard and this class.
We needed a buff with our single target and they go ahead and nerf us, i don't know what goes through blizzards thought process.
Ion is honestly the worst thing to happen to this game as a balance point of view. Time to reroll.

[Deleted]

And if you take Fel Mastery you will still do it, rofl

Yep.
Never understood those who are against Momentum, and those who are against Momentum because they don't want to Fel Rush.
It's completely beyond me.

Btw I didn't understand one thing: Fel Blade is now baseline? Or is it simply switching places with Chaos Cleave?

[Deleted]

No it isn't. It's letting people pick something else on that talent tree. Momentum will almost undoubtedly pull ahead for players that have decent up time on it.

With this nerf to blur? Really? I only see it being feasibly useful in AoE scenarios tbh. This indirect nerf is a massive one; and it will also destroy some of the cool playstyle flow of momentum.

[Deleted]

That's bull. There are plenty of situations where some people pick the lower skill cap talent that does a bit less damage to simplify their rotation. Those that refuse to end up doing shit for damage if they can't get the more complex rotation down. If someone can't get used to the momentum style of play, there should be a competitive option for them to switch to. It is absolutely insane to argue for cookie cutter talent trees and arguing against so certainly isn't "ruining the class."

No, it's not bull, come and join us in the real world where people adapt their playstyle around whats best, not the other way around.

[Matchles]

With this nerf to blur? Really? I only see it being feasibly useful in AoE scenarios tbh. This indirect nerf is a massive one; and it will also destroy some of the cool playstyle flow of momentum.

I'll wait until people have tried out both. Even with the change to blur it seems like momentum, when played well, will stay ahead of nemesis.

- - - Updated - - -

No, it's not bull, come and join us in the real world where people adapt their playstyle around whats best, not the other way around.

Why the fuck even have talent trees in your "real world." You obviously don't like choice.

[Deleted]

Why the fuck even have talent trees in your "real world." You obviously don't like choice.

Ok, this idea that in every tier of every talent tree there is choice and you will change them situationally is not an idea, it's a myth, if it is a throughput tier one will always be better than the other two, unless it's one where it's aoe vs single target, that's fine then you just swap depending on the fight, but that's not what we're talking about. I do want choice, I want to choose whether to bring an aoe stun or a single target stun, stuff like that, what you seem to want is "do I choose this one which is easier but does less damage or this one which is harder but does more damage" plenty of those exist but have a guess which one 99% of people choose, most people when doing their talents use resources like this site, icy veins etc and when they know which talents are numerically the best they choose them and learn how to use them, if you could see how many demon hunters worldwide are currently speced into momentum I would say it's about 90% and there's a reason for that, if they make another choice better then that 90% will swap, the sooner Blizzard and people like you realise that the better.

[BlingtiN]

with this talent fucked, now blizzard needs to put momo duration to 7 sec, problem solved

[Deleted]

Nope. It is just an overall damage nerf.

This.
Plus, there is no choice or possible builds, regardless of what Blizz wants and thinks you'll take the best talents for the situation at hand.
And those talents come from the best possible choices.

[Matchles]

Ok, this idea that in every tier of every talent tree there is choice and you will change them situationally is not an idea, it's a myth, if it is a throughput tier one will always be better than the other two, unless it's one where it's aoe vs single target, that's fine then you just swap depending on the fight, but that's not what we're talking about. I do want choice, I want to choose whether to bring an aoe stun or a single target stun, stuff like that, what you seem to want is "do I choose this one which is easier but does less damage or this one which is harder but does more damage" plenty of those exist but have a guess which one 99% of people choose, most people when doing their talents use resources like this site, icy veins etc and when they know which talents are numerically the best they choose them and learn how to use them, if you could see how many demon hunters worldwide are currently speced into momentum I would say it's about 90% and there's a reason for that, if they make another choice better then that 90% will swap, the sooner Blizzard and people like you realise that the better.

Why do you even care what they do with that talent then? First, you have NOTHING to back up your claims about the talent trees. The vast majority of players don't sit around on here or any other forum, pouring over which spec they should take. Even if they did the vast majority do not understand the math going into these simulations, they are just following what some "expert" says is the most powerful. I love that the spec YOU prefer happens to be the correct spec to run in your mind. None of my comments are assuming nemesis will be more powerful than momentum. But making the talents closer to one another has zero impact on you. So the question remains, why the hell do you care?

[Deix-EU]

Trying to do a build not Demonic centric with talents updates right now is awkward. I can't see any doing the trick and if you look very carefully, we have now a full potentiel demon build to the right, a semi ST-stationary but spiky build with the middle (fel eruption is nicely upgrades along with First blood) and an AoE/High mobility DPS dependency (current one but tweaked with ... nerfs) one with the left.

It's time to help them build us new funs and competitive 3 builds from now on. We're a key for feedback but it's at least the time of a breeze in our talents.

[Velissaro]

I guess it's a case of them wanting Blur to be used purely as a defensive CD, not to reset the charges of Fel Rush, we will see how it plays out.

[Deleted]

I love the new changes, a sprint is nice

And i hate to play in every situation with Fel Mastery Momentum demosblade Bloodlet shit build.
I love to see every other build.

And its nice to see all Momentum passiv talent Demonsblade ring user cry .

Than their are other players they dont like this playstyle why the should be punished in every situations?

Momentum Demonsblade playstyle is not the Class fantasy and was not the play style in alpha and beta. So only for the 3 Month live server after a lot of buffs and nerfs.

[Qck]

I'm going to be happy when the class fantasy meme dies. I don't even know who decided that was going to be the go to term for what you personally enjoy, but holy shit it's stupid at this point.

Not really happy about many of the changes at this point myself, ring nerf is okay, but nerfing DBlades as well feels bad. Balancing around the shoulders, if that's what they are actually doing, is horseshit. Taking the FR reset of Blur is good overall, but needs some compensation - even more Fury gen nerfs is not cool.

Was really hoping for Bloodlet to be baked in(even at 100%) and something to take that talents spot. Same with at least the Fury gen portion of Fel Mastery.

Let's just say I'm glad to have a Rogue alt at this point.

[Reydan]

They also want to nerf the leech of Metamorphis, it's now 70%. I guess they want to nerf it because of the new legendary, just stupid imo.

Really these changes would be devestating, I know it's just datamined but it doesn't make me happy about the class at all.

[Deleted]

Also consider that playing around a 4.5 second Eye Beam will be absolute shit on fights/dungeons where you can get one-shot abilities that you have to react to within >4 seconds. It was already a gamble to use EB in high M+ with volcanic because you would just die if you got a puddle under you - and that was witha 3 second EB channel. THat is not a playstyle/talent I want to have on mythic fights.

[Deleted]

Than their are other players they dont like this playstyle why the should be punished in every situations.

You don't have to be punished for not liking this playstyle, there are 10 other classes to choose from, something you guys don't seem to realise this that fel rush will still be part of your damage rotation without momentum, you will just do less damage, oh and now that the fury generation has been spanked you can prepare for some slow and boring gameplay on the DH class coming in this new patch, I pray that they revert or modify a lot of these changes before it goes live.

[Soulfròst]

You don't have to be punished for not liking this playstyle, there are 10 other classes to choose from, something you guys don't seem to realise this that fel rush will still be part of your damage rotation without momentum, you will just do less damage, oh and now that the fury generation has been spanked you can prepare for some slow and boring gameplay on the DH class coming in this new patch, I pray that they revert or modify a lot of these changes before it goes live.

I think they should, at the very least, allow haste to modify the cooldown of Fel Rush in order to compensate for losing the extra 2 charges from Demon Speed. Even though the charge reset mechanic is a much better solution.

I've been trying to play Havoc as much as I can (long live Momentum) since the changes were announced. First spec I've legitimately loved playing since as long as I can remember. Blizzard has a reputation for making terrible changes to a spec and ruining the fun. Might even hang up the game if it stays how it is on PTR currently. Let's hope their "final iterations" that they haven't yet made are good enough to keep the playstyle/build strong.