Betrayal of Trump's anti-Washington, anti-Wall Street base has been swift

[alexw]

HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA

It's as I said, cranks in the 60s and 70s.

The election was a national embarrassment. This is just as bad. For fucks sake.

- - - Updated - - -

http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/sto...get-1789008594

Stormfront is loving Steve Bannon.

I can kind of understand how the nutjob thinks Hillary Clinton works for the Muslim Brotherhood (being an evil democrat and all) but how the hell does he come to the conclusion Grover Norquist is too???

- - - Updated - - -

Honestly, maybe Trump should try. Just to bring this comedy of horrors to a close all the quicker.

Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan are not stupid people. Particularly the former. Mitch McConnell's personal rivalry with Harry Reid, by admission of their peers, is one of the things that poisoned the Senate the past few years above all others, but he is an institutionalist, and a master of politics.

Maybe the reason they're being so mum on this descent into a carnival sideshow is so that the Trump stooges devour themselves, leaving a weak Trump Presidency where Ryan and McConnell are the true masters and Trump the puppet.

Maybe. The dangerous thing about that line of thinking is they would not be the first mainstream politicians who think they can control a demagogue. But maybe Trump is legitimately, that talent-less, they'll succeed. Part of me thinks the reason he asked for his son in law to get Top Secret clearance (which by law, he won't get), is because he realizes how in over his head he is and doesn't want to fuck it up.

Yes that's happened too many times in history. They *think* they have a pawn they can control until they find out they are the ones being controlled.

[Skroe]

I can kind of understand how the nutjob thinks Hillary Clinton works for the Muslim Brotherhood (being an evil democrat and all) but how the hell does he come to the conclusion Grover Norquist is too???

His wife is muslim.

Grover is a piece of trash, who, ironically, hasn't had less influence in his entire career thanks to our new Big Government "CONservative" President-elect. But Grover's been fending off for years that he believes what he believes about the size of government because his muslim wife is trying to destroy America. It's a very old slander.

[Elegiac]

Yes that's happened too many times in history. They *think* they have a pawn they can control until they find out they are the ones being controlled.

I doubt Trump has enough acumen to 'control' a seasoned politician; doing such involves stroking egos and handshaking, and he doesn't seem to suffer having to be on equal footing with other people very well.

Call it new money insecurity.

[alexw]

I doubt Trump has enough acumen to 'control' a seasoned politician; doing such involves stroking egos and handshaking, and he doesn't seem to suffer having to be on equal footing with other people very well.

Call it new money insecurity.

I would not be so sure given how brain-dead fanatical the Trumpists are. He could easily turn them against the republican establishment.

[Garnier Fructis]

Warren Harding's legacy is in danger.

[Elegiac]

I would not be so sure given how brain-dead fanatical the Trumpists are. He could easily turn them against the republican establishment.

Which would rend the party in half between the more moderate Republicans and the Tea Baggers/Evangelicals/etc.

Again, very dangerous game to play on Ryan's part.

- - - Updated - - -

Warren Harding's legacy is in danger.

What, Teapot Dome?

[Garnier Fructis]

What, Teapot Dome?

The legacy of worst President.

[Elegiac]

The legacy of worst President.

Eh, I'd ascribe that to Andrew Johnson personally.

[Skroe]

I doubt Trump has enough acumen to 'control' a seasoned politician; doing such involves stroking egos and handshaking, and he doesn't seem to suffer having to be on equal footing with other people very well.

Call it new money insecurity.

I'm kind of wondering if say, Guliani is named Secretary of State, and it's very clear there aren't 51 votes to name him Secretary of State, if Trump will unleash the Trumpkins on his fellow Republicans.

There are plenty of National Security Senators in the Republican Party who will stand against a bad choice for some of these jobs.

[Mgann-Morzz]

What a fucking shock, he conned all his rube supporters and they believed him when EVERYONE ELSE was telling them how massive a con-man he was.

America deserves this for being so fucking pathetic and stupid. At least Rural America does, they'll realize nothing can save their pathetic unviable economies until they FINALLY accept they need massive retraining and restrucuring.

Us in Urban America don't, yet we have to suffer with the fucking trailer trash.

[alexw]

The legacy of worst President.

I wonder if this has a chance of utterly destroying the republican party? Trump isn't fit for the job we all know that. So what happens when he has to do the job and fails and fails and fails. Could he be that much of an utter disaster?

[Elegiac]

I'm kind of wondering if say, Guliani is named Secretary of State, and it's very clear there aren't 51 votes to name him Secretary of State, if Trump will unleash the Trumpkins on his fellow Republicans.

There are plenty of National Security Senators in the Republican Party who will stand against a bad choice for some of these jobs.

I mean, it was already clear to a lot of people that the GOP is pulling itself apart at the seams; though more gradually than predicted. Trump is the chicken that has come home to roost, in that sense; he's mobilised the ultraconservative elements that have driven moderates away from the GOP, but in such a way that it threatens the establishment Republicans who play the balancing act between both.

Though the worriesome thing about this is the damage this election has done and will do to public confidence in the system. Though I'd argue that the current iteration of US government is reaching its useful end - we're getting to the point where our incarnation of the Reform Acts are becoming an increasing necessity.

[Skroe]

I mean, it was already clear to a lot of people that the GOP is pulling itself apart at the seams; though more gradually than predicted. Trump is the chicken that has come home to roost, in that sense; he's mobilised the ultraconservative elements that have driven moderates away from the GOP, but in such a way that it threatens the establishment Republicans who play the balancing act between both.

I agree.
One Foreign Policy expert thinks that between Bannon and now Eliot Cohen, the nominations are going to to unleash the GOP Civil War.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...nst_trump.html

Let's hope so.

I should note, I’ve been friendly with Cohen for many years. We disagree on many issues, but I regard him as a serious analyst and wise historian. (His book Supreme Command is one of the best studies of civil-military relations; Military Misfortunes, an edifying analysis of failure in warfare; Conquered Liberty, a surprising and entertaining chronicle of our nation’s early frontier battles with Canada and how they shaped the American way of war.) His annual seminars on military history, taught to officers, have earned him wide respect inside the armed forces’ more intellectual circles. He is sober-minded, sophisticated, not prone to outbursts. In other words, this tweet, in its tone and substance, is uncharacteristic—and for that reason, many of his ilk are taking it seriously.

Cohen told the Washington Post that he’d written the tweet after submitting names for possible national-security positions at the request of a longtime friend who’s a senior official on the Trump transition team. His friend’s response, Cohen said, was “very weird, very disturbing … It became clear to me that they view jobs as lollipop things you give out to good boys and girls.” His friend, he added, seemed “unhinged.”

Max Boot, a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations, and a neocon who signed a similar anti-Trump letter by 122 national-security experts (and agitated against Trump on his Twitter feed until last week), wrote an op-ed for USA Today after the election, arguing—as Cohen did in his American Interest piece—that #NeverTrumpers shouldn’t hesitate to counsel Trump, if just “to save him from himself.” However, when I asked Boot this morning about Cohen’s retraction, he emailed, “Eliot’s tweeting is a matter of concern because it suggests Trump people will stay in their bunker. Heaven help us if they staff the entire admin only with Trump loyalists.”

And you know, for my part, #NeverTrump means #NeverEverDonaldFuckingTrump.

Even on things I agree on and will applaud - sure let's build a 350 ship Navy and renew infrastructure - he'll never be my President. How you win matters and this immoral demagogue now chooses surrounded himself with cretins. He won without honor and I'll forever deny him the honorific of "President Trump". He is simply, "Trump".

[Mgann-Morzz]

I wonder if this has a chance of utterly destroying the republican party? Trump isn't fit for the job we all know that. So what happens when he has to do the job and fails and fails and fails. Could he be that much of an utter disaster?

I wish, but the Republicans were basically REWARDED for bringing Government to a halt for the last 6 years, their utter masters of marketing themselves and pinning blame on others. And their base votes for them like it's their religion... while the Democratic base has to be super inspired and prodded to actually get out and vote (which is what happened this election, the polls got their LV screens really wrong when it came to dems)

[Elegiac]

I wish, but the Republicans were basically REWARDED for bringing Government to a halt for the last 6 years, their utter masters of marketing themselves and pinning blame on others. And their base votes for them like it's their religion... while the Democratic base has to be super inspired and prodded to actually get out and vote (which is what happened this election, the polls got their LV screens really wrong when it came to dems)

A lot, and I mean a lot of these issues stem from the fact the American system is gradually succumbing to gearlock. People don't vote because the system is increasingly less representative of most citizens and don't feel they have a stake in it, with the corollary that genuine reform is precluded by a system which keeps the old hats in place none of whom have genuine interest in rationalising the electoral structure.

[Skroe]

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/...21142525665280

Donald J. TrumpVerified account
‏@realDonaldTrump
Very organized process taking place as I decide on Cabinet and many other positions. I am the only one who knows who the finalists are!

The Apprentice TV show has taken over the world's only superpower.

[Milchshake]

I'd argue it isn't new, as we actually have an early precedent from the sort of schizophrenic foreign policy you tend to get in more representative democracies with short durations of leadership; British policy regarding the Ottomans, specifically the transition from Disraeli to Gladstone. 'Cabinet diplomacy' of the sort figures like Bismarck and Kissinger excelled at has become unworkable recently simply because the prevalence of things like the internet, meaning officials are under a lot more public scrutiny - with dipshits like Assange and Snowden around, any foreign policy decision made in confidence can be easily scuttled once it's exposed to the public and subjected to one of the least qualified body to be making such decisions, the voting public.

It's something we discuss fairly frequently in political science, how the general trend since Vietnam has been more towards the delegate model rather than the trustee; I'd argue that's one of the chief reasons US government has become so cumbrous and unworkable even in the domestic sense.

The Iran deal seems to be in certain danger with whomever lands at state. In the face of such reactionary foreign policy, Iran racing towards a nuclear deterant seems rational at that point. I can only imagine how Saudi Arabia will react to that. Along with the US cozying up to Putin in regards to Syria.

[Elegiac]

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/...21142525665280

The Apprentice TV show has taken over the world's only superpower.

If this were a novel about the evils of capitalism I'd have called the symbolism too heavy handed.

[alexw]

I agree.
One Foreign Policy expert thinks that between Bannon and now Eliot Cohen, the nominations are going to to unleash the GOP Civil War.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...nst_trump.html

Let's hope so.



And you know, for my part, #NeverTrump means #NeverEverDonaldFuckingTrump.

Even on things I agree on and will applaud - sure let's build a 350 ship Navy and renew infrastructure - he'll never be my President. How you win matters and this immoral demagogue now chooses surrounded himself with cretins. He won without honor and I'll forever deny him the honorific of "President Trump". He is simply, "Trump".

Trump is surrounding himself with sycophants who will only tell him what he wants to hear. That cannot end well.

- - - Updated - - -

I wish, but the Republicans were basically REWARDED for bringing Government to a halt for the last 6 years, their utter masters of marketing themselves and pinning blame on others. And their base votes for them like it's their religion... while the Democratic base has to be super inspired and prodded to actually get out and vote (which is what happened this election, the polls got their LV screens really wrong when it came to dems)

Not this time. They control all levers of power. If things go wrong they own it. There is noone else to blame.

[Skroe]

The Iran deal seems to be in certain danger with whomever lands at state. In the face of such reactionary foreign policy, Iran racing towards a nuclear deterant seems rational at that point. I can only imagine how Saudi Arabia will react to that. Along with the US cozying up to Putin in regards to Syria.

The Iran deal has always been a cretinous mess. It was bullshit layered on bullshit. It was Obama's Second Term Foreign Policy - Protecting the World from American Power - incarnate. It was positively bizarre that Obama often times seemed to be asking as a mediator between his own country and the rest of the world, rather than an advocate for OUR national interests. But that's always been his biggest foreign policy criticism.

But the Iran deal also turns out to be better than nothing.

Iran was always going to get a nuclear weapon. Unless the US invades and does regime change - and it won't - or unless it is read to do serious and deeply destructive air strikes and deal with the blow back when Iran blows up some jetliners in response - and it isn't - Iran was always going to position itself as being nuclear capable. The timeline keeps moving, but the end point is the same. Iran's work on ballistic missile technology just supports that end-point.

I've long felt that, in part like Obamacare, the Iran deal was designed to collapse and fail a few years after Obama wasn't President anymore so that his successor would be the one responsible for cleaning it up. There's a particular irony in the fact that a *shiver* two term Trump Presidency could easily see a Nuclear Armed Iran sometime after 2020.

Honestly the best US option is to let the deal go as far as it can, and spend like mad on missile defense. Throw some THAADs in Qatar, for example. Like with North Korea, in the end, it'll be the threat of destruction that keeps them at bay.