Should a blood test at birth be standard procedure to confirm who is the father?

[Deleted]

Or banning driving because of deaths/grave injuries on the road, ban Facebook because some people have their children drowing while checking the feed (true story), banning WoW/online games people some people play till they die... Point is, some people are irresponsible but the responisble shouldn't be punished for the actions of the former, which would be the case with complusory paternity tests

If it turns out that Tim has a daughter ages 10 that isn't really his daughter, he shouldn't have to pay child support if he divorces/breaks up with the mother, nor be sent to jail if he refuses. If Bob isn't quite sure if he's the father to his 3 month old child, he should have the oppurtunity to have a paternity test done.

But paternity tests should never be compulsory, as it is sending a message to aspiring mothers saying "we don't trust you", and again, "if you've done nothing wrong, you needn't fear" doesn't help, at least not for me, because I don't cheat or lie, as I mentioned earlier, and I don't want to be regarded as a person who does.

What exactly do you mean with , biological deadbeat fathers, or those thinking they are the father but aren't?

Right, it is perfectly fine to lie to Tim for 10 years, nothing wrong with that...

If the test is mandatory then it is in no way like saying "she is a whore" the only thing it says is that we want to be sure.

Funny how biological fathers who do not want to be a father are deadbeats and woman that does not want to be a mother is a "strong woman".

[Total Crica]

it is not uncommon for males to raise offspring that is not theirs without knowing it

And those that want to know should be able to pay for the test, while those who do not care should not have to pay for it

why? because this is not a need for anyone who does not care about it

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woman that does not want to be a mother is a "strong woman"

that is def not the society i grew up in

i am a 45 yr old female

i gave up my child to adoption (after being pressured to not do an abortion)

i was always looked at as a deadbeat after that, and to this day i harbor the guilt of feeling no desire to raise my child

[Jotaux]

And those that want to know should be able to pay for the test, while those who do not care should not have to pay for it

why? because this is not a need for anyone who does not care about it

Some people do care but don't know they aren't the father.

[Total Crica]

Some people do care but don't know they aren't the father.

and if they care, they can ask for the test to be done and should not be denied

[Faenskap]

While I see the logic behind it, there is an intrinsic difference here. Men cheating and that resulting in pregnancy won't make their partners believe the child is theirs because it's not their uterus the child is growing in. It's not about cheating per se, it's about (possibly lifelong) paternity fraud. Which is a tad more problematic than cheating itself. And which has no equivalence for women (well, with some bizarre exception of the man bribing an in-vitro doctor to change the eggs to that of his mistress). Just so happens it is a result of cheating.

It was more of an attempt to make the (mostly) male posters see the issue from another side, when men are accused and blamed due to the actions of other men. A strained relationship between new parents isn't that uncommon,sadly, and maybe men cheating with a new baby in the house is more common than some woman tricking someone to thinking he's the father.

Of couse, cheating can end up being deadly, when the wives cheated on kill the children;

http://latest.com/2015/09/mom-killed...wall-in-blood/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ld-police-say/
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../10/ng.01.html
http://www.sowetanlive.co.za/news/20...e-hubby-cheats

Despite these cases, I don't actually want men to be constantly watched, because not all men cheat, just as not all women deceive poor men into false fatherhood.

(But wouldn't @Xarim agree that's a great idea, to keep men watched, because he's all "for the children!" and here we have 7 dead children, which should be far more severe than men raising children that aren't theirs?)

[Deleted]

And those that want to know should be able to pay for the test, while those who do not care should not have to pay for it

why? because this is not a need for anyone who does not care about it

There is a big difference between "not caring" and "trusting your spouse", most of the time people do care, but they trust their spouse. If you trust your spouse but she lied what do we do then?? Compensate the male for his lost (insert number of years)? You cant, there is no way to compensate him for that, and it could have all be prevented by an easy enough test at birth.

that is def not the society i grew up in

i am a 45 yr old female

i gave up my child to adoption (after being pressured to not do an abortion)

i was always looked at as a deadbeat after that, and to this day i harbor the guilt of feeling no desire to raise my child

Im sorry you have had shitty parents or whom ever talked you out off an abortion, but that is no reason for this test not to be mandatory. And you should not feel guilty about not wanting to raise a child. If there are people in your life that make you feel guilty about something like that it might be time to see if its not better to cut these people out off your life.

[Total Crica]

Im sorry you have had shitty parents or whom ever talked you out off an abortion, but that is no reason for this test not to be mandatory. And you should not feel guilty about not wanting to raise a child. If there are people in your life that make you feel guilty about something like that it might be time to see if its not better to cut these people out off your life.

yes, it was my parents, they adopted my child as well - i feel guilty for not raising a child i brought into this world, because that is how my society views it, that parents who don't raise their children are deadbeats

as for it having anything to do with my view on the test, it doesn't - i think the only time the test should be preformed is if the "parents" wants to know or if the courts NEED to know - any other time, the test doesn't matter, so there is no need for it to be done

[Deleted]

It was more of an attempt to make the (mostly) male posters see the issue from another side, when men are accused and blamed due to the actions of other men. A strained relationship between new parents isn't that uncommon,sadly, and maybe men cheating with a new baby in the house is more common than some woman tricking someone to thinking he's the father.

Of couse, cheating can end up being deadly, when the wives cheated on kill the children;

http://latest.com/2015/09/mom-killed...wall-in-blood/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ld-police-say/
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../10/ng.01.html
http://www.sowetanlive.co.za/news/20...e-hubby-cheats

Despite these cases, I don't actually want men to be constantly watched, because not all men cheat, just as not all women deceive poor men into false fatherhood.

(But wouldn't @Xarim agree that's a great idea, to keep men watched, because he's all "for the children!" and here we have 7 dead children, which should be far more severe than men raising children that aren't theirs?)

At least a woman does not have to pay for 18+ years when her spouse cheats, a male does..

[Total Crica]

At least a woman does not have to pay for 18+ years when her spouse cheats, a male does..

A woman does have to pay if any woman he cheats with gets pregnant and doesn't abort or give up the child

[Uzkin]

The would-be-father should always be asked the following question:

"Do you agree to act as a parent to this child in case it is not biologically yours?"

If the answer is "yes" then no blood test is necessary. If the answer is "no" or "it depends" then the blood test should be required.

[Total Crica]

The would-be-father should always be asked the following question:

"Do you agree to act as a parent to this child in case it is not biologically yours?"

If the answer is "yes" then no blood test is necessary. If the answer is "no" or "it depends" then the blood test should be required.

that is ok with me, perfect compromise, wise person, thanks!

[Deleted]

yes, it was my parents, they adopted my child as well - i feel guilty for not raising a child i brought into this world, because that is how my society views it, that parents who don't raise their children are deadbeats

Do you not think that "society" is wrong here? Would the child have been better off if it was raised by you? I imagine that this was some time ago and that when this happened you where in no condition to raise a child off your own, realizing this is not being a dead beat, it is how ever, putting the needs of the child you brought into this world over your own needs and feelings. I do really hope things worked out for you on this and that you now have a good relationship with your child.

as for it having anything to do with my view on the test, it doesn't - i think the only time the test should be preformed is if the "parents" wants to know or if the courts NEED to know - any other time, the test doesn't matter, so there is no need for it to be done

So you want the woman to be able to lie about it? I think the "father" always needs to know, and i do not believe that just because the male trusts his spouse he doesn't want to know if his trust is misplaced.

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A woman does have to pay if any woman he cheats with gets pregnant and doesn't abort or give up the child

Nope, she does not, the male will have to pay. She can keep her whole earnings. But that doesn't mean that he isn't a massive ass hole for cheating, like everyone who cheats.

[Total Crica]

Do you not think that "society" is wrong here? Would the child have been better off if it was raised by you? I imagine that this was some time ago and that when this happened you where in no condition to raise a child off your own, realizing this is not being a dead beat, it is how ever, putting the needs of the child you brought into this world over your own needs and feelings. I do really hope things worked out for you on this and that you now have a good relationship with your child.




So you want the woman to be able to lie about it? I think the "father" always needs to know, and i do not believe that just because the male trusts his spouse he doesn't want to know if his trust is misplaced.

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Nope, she does not, the male will have to pay. She can keep her whole earnings. But that doesn't mean that he isn't a massive ass hole for cheating, like everyone who cheats.

as for my child, i brought it into this world and then tossed it on someone else to take care of, shruging my obligation to take care of it onto someone else, that is how my society feels about parents that dont raise their children

i never gained a desire to raise children, so i never had anything at all to do with my child, nor plan to unless i gain a desire, and i will carry that guilt forever, i think

as for the test, if the father can always take the test if he wants to, there is no way for the mother to get away with lying about it is there?

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Nope, she does not, the male will have to pay. She can keep her whole earnings.

not in my society, both parents are required by law to provide for their children - if the mother leaves the child with the father, she must pay child support mandated by courts, if the father leaves the child with the mother, he must pay child support mandated by the courts - im not sure, but i think adopted parents can ask for the real parents to pay child support by law as well, but only if the real parents are allowed visitation rights, most adopted parents dont do that, tho, i think - both me and my child's father gave up parental rights to my parents and did not have to pay child support after that - but as long as the child is a ward of the state in my society, BOTH parents are required to pay child support by law

[Faenskap]

Right, it is perfectly fine to lie to Tim for 10 years, nothing wrong with that...

If the test is mandatory then it is in no way like saying "she is a whore" the only thing it says is that we want to be sure.

Funny how biological fathers who do not want to be a father are deadbeats and woman that does not want to be a mother is a "strong woman".

I've never said it's perfectly fine to lie to Tim for 10 years. I don't exactly go "you go girl!" when there are threads (on other forums, very obviously) going "I'm pregnant and don't know who the father is". What I would like, is for Tim to have the chance to find of whether or not he's the real father, and if he isn't, face no consequences should he walk away. That should be Tim's choice, and Tim's alone.

Should new fathers (biological ones!) be monitored so they don't cheat because let's face it, having a baby sucks all life and joy away which leads him to sleep with other women, risking the family breaking up, or if they do stay together, the death of trust? Compulsory paternity tests are like saying "we don't trust you", like having fathers watched in cheat-prevention would do*

If you think there is a high chance that a woman is going to screw you over, I feel sorry for you, honestly.

Regarding the last sentence, GoblinP wrote "'fathers'" and I was inquiring into whether he meant a biological father who ran away and ceased all contact when the child was 5 or whatever, or a man who was believed to be the father, but wasn't.

woman that does not want to be a mother is a "strong woman".

Absolutely wrong! A man who doesn't want to have children gains a lot more acceptance than a woman saying the same thing. You see, society wants children, they are encouraged. Merely 50 years ago, no one would ask you why you didn't have children (women, that is). As a woman, I'm expected to love children, to want children, to desire them, that life finally gains purpose when they pop out. To love not only mine, but other people's children. That a natural birth is wonderful and beautiful and the pain absolutely worth it, even the anal ruptures, that breastfeeding is so amazing and giving formulae is bascially child abuse. That I should be home, at least 1 year, and that spending 6 hours playing with the baby is so much better than being at work. That when it cries you don't want to become deaf but instead try to understand the little one ^^ Patience, love, understanding, selfsacrifice. Wanting to sleep 8 hours in a go, or to clean the house, or to shower - What kind of monster am I?! Poopy diapers, pee on your hand, so cute <3

There have been interviews with women choosing a childless life and they still have to say "oh, but I do like children, just don't want them". If you're a woman and you don't want children in today's society (Norway), you're anomaly, a selfish shit, unfeminine and that there is something wrong with you. If you divorce the man and he has custody, you're a freak. You even have to be 25 before you can choose sterilisation. What I'm getting at, there is no applause if you as a woman choose to have children despite not wanting them, people have decided that 95 % of all women want children and you're an outcast if you opt out. I have a child, and I loathe my new life. Its presence makes me depressed but I can't admit that, I'm a failure for thinking so. I'm supposed to be so happy ^^ I, as a married woman, now with a child, life is complete <3 No, not before grandchildren come^^

*Yes, it's a shitty example. Just try to understand where I'm coming from

[Tenjen]

do you know how expensive these are? How expensive it would be as standard procedure? Are taxes going to cover them? Is insurance going to? Is the hospital going to? Are the couple going to be made to? All are bad choices with terrible consequences.

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Nope, she does not, the male will have to pay. She can keep her whole earnings. But that doesn't mean that he isn't a massive ass hole for cheating, like everyone who cheats.

Not only is this not true in the majority of places but even then, most of the "paying and effort" goes to the person actually raising the child for 18 years, partial monetary compensation is getting off light.

[Deleted]

as for my child, i brought it into this world and then tossed it on someone else to take care of, shruging my obligation to take care of it onto someone else, that is how my society feels about parents that dont raise their children

i never gained a desire to raise children, so i never had anything at all to do with my child, nor plan to unless i gain a desire, and i will carry that guilt forever, i think

as for the test, if the father can always take the test if he wants to, there is no way for the mother to get away with lying about it is there?

Now you are confusing me, you said that your parents pushed you not to have an abortion, and then they adopted the child, but you have no relationship with it what so ever!? That is kind of strange to me, but what ever.

And, do fathers have to be more suspicious?? Is that what you are trying to say here? Because the only time this is relevant is when the mother lied to the father but the father trusts the mother not to lie.

not in my society, both parents are required by law to provide for their children - if the mother leaves the child with the father, she must pay child support mandated by courts, if the father leaves the child with the mother, he must pay child support mandated by the courts

Yes in your society too, when a male creates offspring with someone else he is obligated to pay child support. But the female he is with does not.
But when a woman cheats and gets pregnant and not informs her partner then the partner still needs to pay for this child, while it is not his.

[Hiricine]

On one hand, I don't see anything wrong with a father who mistakenly trusts a woman who claims she got pregnant by him to have to raise someone elses kid if he's dumb enough not to request such a test. On the other hand, I think mandatory testing would fix a LOT of problems. I cannot recall the stat but its something like 15-30% of children are born and raised by a father OTHER than the one the mother claims was the father (including married couples). Science classes that teach genetics often try to avoid having kids look at their parents because some subtle things (earlobe attachment, presence of a widow's peak, eye color) can often hint at genetic impossibilities that create problems at that time.

That being said, lying to a man and having him raise a child that is not his is a crime on the level of false imprisonment and slavery. Unfortunately, it would be one of those crimes that extremely difficult to prosecute because it generally involves the mother of young children whose real father is absent.

[Total Crica]

when a woman cheats and gets pregnant and not informs her partner then the partner still needs to pay for this child, while it is not his.

no he doesn't, he can ask for the test to be done if he wants to

[Deleted]

do you know how expensive these are? How expensive it would be as standard procedure?

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Not only is this not true in the majority of places but even then, most of the "paying and effort" goes to the person actually raising the child for 18 years, partial monetary compensation is getting off light.

It is true everywhere, if you are in a relation and you cheat as a male you will have to pay for it.
If you are in a relation as a female and cheat then there is no need to tell your current partner and this current partner is liable by default for this child.

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no he doesn't, he can ask for the test to be done if he wants to

So that is just bad luck for people who trust their partners then? When they get suckered into this that is their own fault for not checking?

[Total Crica]

do fathers have to be more suspicious?

if he is, he can ask for the test, that simple