[Megathread] Star Citizen

[masterhorus8]

I never said it was. But I don't have the time or interest to know every single detail about the game as my interest is only moderate. I don't see why that's a bad thing, not everyone can be super interested in everything and know everything about it.

One would hope that rather than just call people trolls or insulting them, when someone posts incorrect information that they are corrected with the complete/correct information. And one would hope that the person accepts that new information and adjusts their opinions accordingly.

That's partially the thing though. If someone comes in and asks a legitimate question, they will get a legitimate answer. If someone comes in here with incorrect info and is actively calling this project a failure instead of being more passive like your responses, they tend to get attacked by people because no one can tell the difference between a FUD campaign follower like EvcRo and then someone like FrankLampard who legitimately didn't know. Personally, I know i tend to answer people back with the same attitude that they're throwing around unless I'm in a good mood, just something I can't easily control (until after i reread what I typed and go back and remove the harsh responses.) So when someone comes in here with a shit negative attitude, they tend to be met with the same thing. But yes, you're right.

[stellvia]

One would hope that rather than just call people trolls or insulting them, when someone posts incorrect information that they are corrected with the complete/correct information. And one would hope that the person accepts that new information and adjusts their opinions accordingly.

The problem is its literally the same misguided rants over and over again from people flying by the thread. And they never come in seeking answers, they come in claiming to "know" what the game is like, then spout off opinions that prove they have no idea what the game is like nor a wish to know. They read someone elses unfounded opinions that reinforced their prejudices and ran with it.

How do we take them seriously when we have people like the below quote:

They're attempting to do all those things....and so are other games. ED is missing just the FPS...and it is planned. NMS already has them but has a different focus.

By his reasoning, why have normal hotel rooms when a capsule hotel with communal bathrooms already does the same thing? He's so far off-base its not even worth the effort.

[masterhorus8]

To try and follow what Edge was saying about trying to actually reasonably answer stuff, for the main differences between NMS and ED, and SC, I got an answer from someone who's played all 3.

"I think this game is different in primarily it's crowdfunding and philosophy. People optionally spend thousands now so most don't have to spend microtransactions later. Naturally this is a huge and controversial practice, so I don't think any game has been so divisive as SC.

I also think SC is the first example of a truly next gen PC only game, made from the ground up for enthusiast-grade PC gamers. The Witcher 3 is pretty damn next gen as well, but the poly counts in SC's models, the sheer detail, the ultra high res textures and the brand new and sometimes even untested tech going into the game makes this one more future-gen.

What makes it better or different than ED? Or NMS? In Elite Dangerous (A game I've played after I played SC and I enjoyed) you are a ship or SRV cockpit. Not a pilot. You can land on limited planets and have to have a rover to go around on the planets. Exploration is generally unsatisfying. You can have an Imperial Cutter (an outright Capital Ship) and yet it doesn't feel better than the Sidewinder you start out with, because it isn't a ship you can walk around in. It's a cockpit. Nothing more. You aren't a pilot that can walk around whenever you feel like it, you're a cockpit. Elite is so beautiful and well made, and yet it's so unsatisfying to me...

In NMS you can explore anything you can see, but every space station has exactly one alien and one hallway despite being huge. You can explore millions of places but you can never travel with friends. Every ship feels the same. Again, you're still just a cockpit. Your ship is an A to B to Galactic Core ship, not your home base. Not a trading vessel, not a fighting vessel, not a bounty hunting vessel, a thing to get you to the next planet. I played NMS. I did not like it. And I will leave it at that."

[Majestic12]

You were talking about it being Pay2Win in regards to people "buying the best ship" and "bigger ships being worth millions of credits"...then you proceed to tell us about your "Super Hornet" and what you'll do with it? I thought we were talking about real ships, the ones that cost actual money. Clearly your plans are much more casually oriented if we're seriously going to base this on the absolute bottom tier ships without even touching multicrew vessels. A few hours in Arena Commander or the Mini-PU and you'd know that there is no such thing as "best fighter-ships." Every situation is different, every pilot is different.



Then they clearly signed up for the wrong game from the outset. At no point was it ever made apparent that SC was going to be 30th century Euro Truck Driver Simulator. Whether you're fighting NPC's or other Players, you'll be in combat with someone or something at some point.

Yes this could all turn out to be one huge disappointment, it could crash and burn and we end up with a heaping turd. I guess the choices are do you want to resign yourself to that possibility? Actively wanting it to fail? Or stick with giving it time hoping the game turns out great? I personally opt for the latter, because it would be good for gaming in general.

Going off of PU balance right now is a mistake. It does not reflect the final flightmodel or balance in any way shape or form. I mean, It wasn't a long time ago that Auroras were basically unkillable due to multiple layers of shielding. We can't go off of what we see now. But I gaurantee you this: If an Aurora shows up in the real PU and starts fighting a Super Hornet, the Aurora will have no chance. It's not atmospheric combat we're talking about where skill actually matters, we're talking about incredibly bland space combat where the Aurora can't compete on any level. The fact that CIG is so far from their final flightmodel shows yet again how far this game is from a release.

By the way, I own an Orion if you want to talk about multicrew ships. The reason I don't bring it up is because it has nothing to do with stomping other players. I won't even get to see this ship until 4.0, which I will be surprised to see at all(going at this rate).

As a misc note, I don't think CIG has enough incentive to actually finish the PU anymore. Look at the money they are making from ship-sales that will supposedly go away entirely for real cash at launch(except maybe starter packs). Credit-sales even if completely unlimited won't be the same, and the PU will be PC-exclusive. Either they will break this promise(like they have done many others) or the PU will simply not generate much revenue in comparison to what they're making now.

SQ42 is the game's only hope. It is also what Chris Roberts really wants to do ever since his failure in Hollywood. He wants to make movies. This is why SQ42 will be full of mocap and cinematics. SQ42 is going to be incredibly disappointing too at this rate.

- - - Updated - - -

No, they didn't get rid of the financial responsibility. They only got rid of the part that wouldn't affect any new backers, the ORIGINAL KICKSTARTER clause. Since no one has been able to pay through the kickstarter for 3 and a half years, they got rid of the dead weight.

They got rid of it entirely dude, and they still haven't put up their financials. In my opinion it just shows they have something they want to hide from dissenters. Examples such as how much the MoCap and A-list of actors really cost them or the first failed Star Marine contract. By their own TOS, they should have posted the financials long ago. But they won't and they just want us to forget about it.

[Deleted]

Funding goal was 2 million dollars, they have raised more than 120 million dollars.
Yet they still fail to finish their game?

[Davemetalhead]

Funding goal was 2 million dollars, they have raised more than 120 million dollars.
Yet they still fail to finish their game?

They haven't failed to finish the game, yet. It's still ongoing - if it gets cancelled then you can claim they failed to finish it.

[1001]

To try and follow what Edge was saying about trying to actually reasonably answer stuff, for the main differences between NMS and ED, and SC, I got an answer from someone who's played all 3.

"I think this game is different in primarily it's crowdfunding and philosophy. People optionally spend thousands now so most don't have to spend microtransactions later. Naturally this is a huge and controversial practice, so I don't think any game has been so divisive as SC.

I don't see how that figures. Take Elite, you could buy the game in one of Steam's sales for £10 or so, you could then wait and buy each of its expansions for £10 a piece, after 6 years it would only have cost you £60, microtransactions are not forced upon you. Paying lots of money now for Star Citizen is like paying for a 12 year subscription to EVE before the game has even launched, whether it's brave fronting that money to a company that hasn't prooved itself or exceedingly stupid remains to be seen, but it's certainly not something I would do, I like to pay for my content as it arrives.

What makes it better or different than ED? Or NMS? In Elite Dangerous (A game I've played after I played SC and I enjoyed) you are a ship or SRV cockpit. Not a pilot. You can land on limited planets and have to have a rover to go around on the planets. Exploration is generally unsatisfying. You can have an Imperial Cutter (an outright Capital Ship) and yet it doesn't feel better than the Sidewinder you start out with, because it isn't a ship you can walk around in. It's a cockpit. Nothing more. You aren't a pilot that can walk around whenever you feel like it, you're a cockpit. Elite is so beautiful and well made, and yet it's so unsatisfying to me...

Sorry but this is a load of crap, comparing a Cutter (not an outright capital ship at all) to a Sidewinder is stupidly biased comment for someone to make.
If exploration was so boring why do so many people do it? It might not be everybody's cup of tea but it's an extremely popular activity.
Having tools to make use of the current gameplay is all that matters, so in Elite's case you have ships and SRVs. At the end of the day they're just designing their game differently, they're working from the macro to the micro as opposed to CIG who are doing the opposite. The difference is that you've been able to play Elite for the last 2 years with no fear of losing progress, you've been able to take part in storylines and all the activities the game offers etc.

I think people that like to make comparisons still fall into the old trap of expostulating what they think Star Citizin is going to be. So many of its features remain unknown quantities, so they compare ideas or dreams against reality, if you've followed gaming you know how that normally leaves you holding the short end of the stick.

[Yunru]

I realy wonder how much did egosoft spend on X-rebirth, compared to 120M here.
http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=345662

[Nihilan]

I made the mistake of buying one of the $45 ships 3-4 years ago and now these mother fuckers wont stop sending me email notices about a game i no longer care about.

[zealo]

I made the mistake of buying one of the $45 ships 3-4 years ago and now these mother fuckers wont stop sending me email notices about a game i no longer care about.

Should be a button at the bottom of them to unsubscribe from the mailing list, if that fails, as mentioned above, most email providers can easily mark certain domains as spam in the settings.

[kenn9530]

I don't see how that figures. Take Elite, you could buy the game in one of Steam's sales for £10 or so, you could then wait and buy each of its expansions for £10 a piece, after 6 years it would only have cost you £60, microtransactions are not forced upon you. Paying lots of money now for Star Citizen is like paying for a 12 year subscription to EVE before the game has even launched, whether it's brave fronting that money to a company that hasn't prooved itself or exceedingly stupid remains to be seen, but it's certainly not something I would do, I like to pay for my content as it arrives.




Sorry but this is a load of crap, comparing a Cutter (not an outright capital ship at all) to a Sidewinder is stupidly biased comment for someone to make.
If exploration was so boring why do so many people do it? It might not be everybody's cup of tea but it's an extremely popular activity.
Having tools to make use of the current gameplay is all that matters, so in Elite's case you have ships and SRVs. At the end of the day they're just designing their game differently, they're working from the macro to the micro as opposed to CIG who are doing the opposite. The difference is that you've been able to play Elite for the last 2 years with no fear of losing progress, you've been able to take part in storylines and all the activities the game offers etc.

I think people that like to make comparisons still fall into the old trap of expostulating what they think Star Citizin is going to be. So many of its features remain unknown quantities, so they compare ideas or dreams against reality, if you've followed gaming you know how that normally leaves you holding the short end of the stick.

ED is a bland game, i have experienced all it has to offer and it holds no interest, the exploration consists of flying around and scanning, there is no relevance or need to go down to the planets, they are just there to look at nothing else, you are not a person in the game and cant interact with things inside your ship or even leave it apart from the planet buggy, it has a limited multiplayer experience and it doesn't even feel like a proper space game.

Current alpha in SC has a greater sense of actually being a space game, ED your just disconnected as your only interactions are with your ship.

[Odeezee]

I never said it was. But I don't have the time or interest to know every single detail about the game as my interest is only moderate. I don't see why that's a bad thing, not everyone can be super interested in everything and know everything about it.

One would hope that rather than just call people trolls or insulting them, when someone posts incorrect information that they are corrected with the complete/correct information. And one would hope that the person accepts that new information and adjusts their opinions accordingly.

if you ask that of those of us who are knowledgeable then the same sensibility can be asked of those who are ignorant i.e. don't ask questions in a trolling manner and do not act as though it's our job to correct your misinterpretations when you are getting your information from highly dubious sources.

Funding goal was 2 million dollars, they have raised more than 120 million dollars.
Yet they still fail to finish their game?

see this Edge? this is exactly what i am talking about. firstly, the game did not raise 120 million in funds all in one go. second, CIG (the devs) had to create all the studios that would make the game from the ground up and staff them (took them until the middle of 2015 to reach that goal). thirdly, the game has only been in development for 4 years! so what is the time required to make an MMO and an RPG of this size, scope and complexity? most MMOs take 5-8 years to develop (an no i am not just referring to the time they tell the world that they are making the game, but the actual start of development) and the **WHOLE** reason for them even going the crowdfunding route was to avoid having to rush a game to release! /sigh

I don't see how that figures. Take Elite, you could buy the game in one of Steam's sales for £10 or so, you could then wait and buy each of its expansions for £10 a piece, after 6 years it would only have cost you £60, microtransactions are not forced upon you. Paying lots of money now for Star Citizen is like paying for a 12 year subscription to EVE before the game has even launched, whether it's brave fronting that money to a company that hasn't prooved itself or exceedingly stupid remains to be seen, but it's certainly not something I would do, I like to pay for my content as it arrives.

how are you missing the point? why do you have to wait for sales to to play the game? how is that even an argument? you do realise that you are effectively telling people that for them to get the same cost efficiency as a $60 retail game without microtransaction they they need to wait 6 years. haha, wow...

I think people that like to make comparisons still fall into the old trap of expostulating what they think Star Citizin is going to be. So many of its features remain unknown quantities, so they compare ideas or dreams against reality, if you've followed gaming you know how that normally leaves you holding the short end of the stick.

well ED is still barebones content-wise and that is a reality and for some what Star Citizen offers, even in it's current pre-alpha state, gives them more pleasure/enjoyment than ED. it should be noted that you cannot hate someone for what they enjoy whether or not you can understand or appreciate it. to each his/her own.

I made the mistake of buying one of the $45 ships 3-4 years ago and now these mother fuckers wont stop sending me email notices about a game i no longer care about.

haha, you typed out all of this yet all you had to do what click one option in your mail. thanks for the laugh.

[1001]

ED is a bland game, i have experienced all it has to offer and it holds no interest, the exploration consists of flying around and scanning, there is no relevance or need to go down to the planets, they are just there to look at nothing else, you are not a person in the game and cant interact with things inside your ship or even leave it apart from the planet buggy, it has a limited multiplayer experience and it doesn't even feel like a proper space game.

Current alpha in SC has a greater sense of actually being a space game, ED your just disconnected as your only interactions are with your ship.

You find it a bland game, which is totally subjective thing so making definitive statements is pretty daft.
I currently find Star Citizen AC and the PU exceedingly bland, not to my taste at all but that doesn't mean it won't improve.

[Tradewind]

Going off of PU balance right now is a mistake. It does not reflect the final flightmodel or balance in any way shape or form. I mean, It wasn't a long time ago that Auroras were basically unkillable due to multiple layers of shielding. We can't go off of what we see now. But I gaurantee you this: If an Aurora shows up in the real PU and starts fighting a Super Hornet, the Aurora will have no chance. It's not atmospheric combat we're talking about where skill actually matters, we're talking about incredibly bland space combat where the Aurora can't compete on any level. The fact that CIG is so far from their final flightmodel shows yet again how far this game is from a release.

By the way, I own an Orion if you want to talk about multicrew ships. The reason I don't bring it up is because it has nothing to do with stomping other players. I won't even get to see this ship until 4.0, which I will be surprised to see at all(going at this rate).

As a misc note, I don't think CIG has enough incentive to actually finish the PU anymore. Look at the money they are making from ship-sales that will supposedly go away entirely for real cash at launch(except maybe starter packs). Credit-sales even if completely unlimited won't be the same, and the PU will be PC-exclusive. Either they will break this promise(like they have done many others) or the PU will simply not generate much revenue in comparison to what they're making now.

SQ42 is the game's only hope. It is also what Chris Roberts really wants to do ever since his failure in Hollywood. He wants to make movies. This is why SQ42 will be full of mocap and cinematics. SQ42 is going to be incredibly disappointing too at this rate.

For someone who wasn't even aware of how instancing works in SC you're making a lot of guarantees here....

[Nirawen]

They're attempting to do all those things....and so are other games. ED is missing just the FPS...and it is planned. NMS already has them but has a different focus.

You say that I don't understand the technical boundaries. That is probably true...for you as well as me.

But as I said...other games already appear to have what SC is doing. Or have plans to add those features.

etc etc etc

A failure of understanding on your part. If you look at the way in which Star Citizen is attempting it's independent physics instancing and then look at NMS and think they are comparable because 'spaceships' then you aren't capable of understanding where the difference is. GTAV is the same game as the original GTA right? Why should there be any difference in cost or development time, they both have cars and guns.

And just to note, because in these discussions it's basically necessary, I'm not actually praising CIG. They could very well fail to achieve what they've set out to do but the idea that what they're attempting is just the same thing as games like NMS is, again, naive.

[1001]

how are you missing the point? why do you have to wait for sales to to play the game? how is that even an argument? you do realise that you are effectively telling people that for them to get the same cost efficiency as a $60 retail game without microtransaction they they need to wait 6 years. haha, wow...

Jesus christ... no one is saying you need to wait for 6 years, wtf? You buy the base game, if the price of expansions (your so called microtransactions) upsets you so much you wait until there is a sale and pick the expansion up then, repeat as needed. How hard can that be to understand?

well ED is still barebones content-wise and that is a reality and for some what Star Citizen offers, even in it's current pre-alpha state, gives them more pleasure/enjoyment than ED. it should be noted that you cannot hate someone for what they enjoy whether or not you can understand or appreciate it. to each his/her own.

Well yeah, no shit, it started its kickstarter the same time as Star Citizen so of course it's not going to have mountains of content yet. I see lots of Star Citizen fans arguing for patience and telling people Rome didn't get built in a day blah blah, then they go and moan about Elite not having a lot of content...

Anyway, what the game is now is far different from when it released, but of course that would never be enough for some people, for them it's not that it doesn't have content, it's that it has the wrong type of content.

[Rennadrel]

I never said it was. But I don't have the time or interest to know every single detail about the game as my interest is only moderate. I don't see why that's a bad thing, not everyone can be super interested in everything and know everything about it.

One would hope that rather than just call people trolls or insulting them, when someone posts incorrect information that they are corrected with the complete/correct information. And one would hope that the person accepts that new information and adjusts their opinions accordingly.

It's pretty obvious when people are shitposting and trolling in this thread, rather than just spouting misinformation, anyone with a brain can tell the difference and yet it seems to get ignored. And trying to reason with the idiots who are trolling and shitposting is a waste of time, they are too dumb to listen to reason and have a hard on for hating things.

- - - Updated - - -

You know there is this thing called "Mark as Spam"....

Or unregistering your email...

[Yunru]

It's pretty obvious when people are shitposting and trolling in this thread, rather than just spouting misinformation, anyone with a brain can tell the difference and yet it seems to get ignored. And trying to reason with the idiots who are trolling and shitposting is a waste of time, they are too dumb to listen to reason and have a hard on for hating things.

- - - Updated - - -



Or unregistering your email...

I think it has to be a thing with what happened with that other space game. So others got a bit...uneasy with any new space game in making.

Limited game play as its said in this lets play video:


I dont call it problematic tho, since game is not out yet as finished.

[ldev]

Snake Oil In Space: The Game

more appropriate title

Please post productively. Critical posts are welcome, but should actually contribute to the discussion. Infracted. -Edge

[Rennadrel]

I think it has to be a thing with what happened with that other space game. So others got a bit...uneasy with any new space game in making.

Limited game play as its said in this lets play video:


I dont call it problematic tho, since game is not out yet as finished.

SC is still so far out in terms of being even fully playable for testing. I am fine with it, their transparency has been very good.