Exorsus and their statement.

[Mamut]

It's still odd that they didn't ban the guilds that used these bugs in WoD though.
A bit hard for the top guilds to know whats ok and whats not.

In any case, they had som good points about legendaries.

Its totally different thing. If tank death would stop Heyla breath only once (like crystals on archi) it would be ok. The problem is it stopped the ability completly.

[Dnusha]

Not much of a cap when all it did was turn off the bad luck protection at 4 legendaries.

you kidding right, what do you think are your chances of getting 5th legendary if you already have 4 without bad luck protection? theres a guy on my realm that haven't seen a single legendary after 720+ mythics. he got his four from the first 250.

[Deleted]

you kidding right, what do you think are your chances of getting 5th legendary if you already have 4 without bad luck protection? theres a guy on my realm that haven't seen a single legendary after 720+ mythics. he got his four from the first 250.

Sounds like he's really unlucky, just as there are still plenty of people who don't even have one let alone two legendaries even with the bad luck protection.

[Brewhan]

There's no hype for world firsts because a lot of it isn't even about skill. I'm not saying that skill isn't required, because of course it is, but the only thing separating world first guilds from top 100 guilds is the fact that they play an unhealthy amount of hours whenever content is released to get world first. You CANNOT get world first unless you play that much during progression. That's why there's less hype for it amongst a general audience, people don't care about who was able to play for 16 hours a day for 2 weeks, they care about who is the best. Actually, some people go further than not caring, a lot of people are outright turned off at the idea that people would play that much. It's hard for people to cheer for someone they're slightly disgusted by.

true I just cringe thinking about all the top end raiders in their actual environment(behind the mic). I mean I watch one guy whos barely in a top 50 guild that raids 6 days a week for about 6hrs each time and he wore the same shirt for 15 days (aka didn't shower for 15 days). That is disgusting. I didn't say anything in his chat about it but I just kept it to myself and was like " i wonder if he is going to be wearing this same celldweller shirt today" 15 days later...

I have no sympathy for a niche group of people who play unhealthy amount of times, skip showers and meals just to be the top 10 in the world to kill a boss. Congrats you did something that will eventually be killed by everyone else just with less boss abilities. In 2004-2009 this was cool but nowadays its hella cringe. I used to be a realm first raider and even after that raiding 5 days a week 4 hrs each day I had enough as I grew up.

If you want to get paid for playing video games look to streaming/youtube/building a brand but don't blame blizzard they wont give you money to smell like crap and play 12hrs a day for 3 weeks without any sort of productive thing given back to society or the gaming community but your toxic attitude towards "casuals".

[Armourboy]

Not much of a cap when all it did was turn off the bad luck protection at 4 legendaries.

Yup, all they did was make it true RNG after that point.

As far as mythic raiding goes, its going to continue to shrink and the world first type guilds even more so. The reason is pretty simple, the gaming industry is, and will continue to be more and more casual. It's players overall are becoming more and more casual. Most people do not want to spend their limited vacation time on 14-15 hour days beating their heads against the wall for some glory in a video game.

This style of play and hardcore mentality used to work well because the overall gaming community was much more hardcore, especially in MMO's. Heck most casuals I knew still played WoW for several hours a night back during Vanilla and TBC. Today if you see them a couple of times a week for an hour or two, it's doing something.

The change is pretty simple, the base, the core of what used to make up the original MMO market is getting older. I was in my mid-20's when I started, I'm 40 now. We have real life to work and succeed at now and sink 14-15 hours a day into, we don't want to spend the other hours doing the same thing. Would I love to be able to play insane numbers of hours a day playing WoW and be hardcore again? Heck yeah, but I'm not going broke, and changing jobs to do it.

Frankly, I think WoW is probably going to be the last bastion of more hardcore playstyle in MMO's, once it's gone it probably will pretty much be gone forever.

[Deleted]

Anyone who goes on about Exorsus being cheaters, exploiters and what not apparently never killed a boss before any nerfs, legendaries or changes whatsoever. Its like right there written in their guild bios: "chance to see bosses world first". "Cheats/bugs/exploits" like this one (avoiding -one- breath with a tank death) are used so frequently in mythic (heroic in the past) that I lost count. It is Blizzard fault for not fixing a known bug (Helya stopping breathing), and not communicating it. They usually have a direct link to the world first guilds who progress on a given boss and even hotfix mid-fight. It is not our job to beta test their bosses on live, and being banned for something like this just shows how desperate they are seeing that not even this tigthly tuned shit fest of 3 boss raid instance is not holding back the worlds best raiders.

Examples of "bugs" which no one was banned for:

Heroic/Mythic Garrosh: you could use that dagger toy to kill yourselves to avoid Malice in P3 in the first 2 IDs. No one was banned for this, not even Paragon.

Mythic Archimonde: every sacrificed their tanks to avoid playing several Source of Chaos in P3.

[incaen]

I love how the other guild admitted they were wrong and took the ban, and how Exorsus did not apologize ONCE for what they did and then tried to misdirect the blame to Blizzard "softcapping" legendary and have NOTHING to do with the subject at hand. AND IT WORKED.

[Sithalos]

I only got about halfway through their "statement" before I got bored and stopped reading. Too much whining for my taste.

[Armourboy]

Anyone who goes on about Exorsus being cheaters, exploiters and what not apparently never killed a boss before any nerfs, legendaries or changes whatsoever. Its like right there written in their guild bios: "chance to see bosses world first". "Cheats/bugs/exploits" like this one (avoiding -one- breath with a tank death) are used so frequently in mythic (heroic in the past) that I lost count. It is Blizzard fault for not fixing a known bug (Helya stopping breathing), and not communicating it. They usually have a direct link to the world first guilds who progress on a given boss and even hotfix mid-fight. It is not our job to beta test their bosses on live, and being banned for something like this just shows how desperate they are seeing that not even this tigthly tuned shit fest of 3 boss raid instance is not holding back the worlds best raiders.

Examples of "bugs" which no one was banned for:

Heroic/Mythic Garrosh: you could use that dagger toy to kill yourselves to avoid Malice in P3 in the first 2 IDs. No one was banned for this, not even Paragon.

Mythic Archimonde: every sacrificed their tanks to avoid playing several Source of Chaos in P3.

Here is the difference though, your other examples from previous expansions were basically seen as creative use of mechanics, at the end of the day they did not break the boss fight, which is why this one is viewed differently.

In the previous examples, you still had to eat the deaths, but the boss continued on with it's mechanics as normal. You were changing the fights by tactics or things that were available to all players to use, but at the end of the day the boss kept on doing his thing.

This one though completely stops the boss from working correctly, and choosing to use the tactic after you know it's not supposed to happen, throws you in the deep end of the gray area pool. Should Blizzard fix it's bugs? Absolutely. However, every single one of these guilds knows it's par for the course when you are pushing content like this. We also know by their own admission that they knew it could be seen as cheating/exploiting by Blizzard because it broke the boss fight. They chose to do it anyways and now they are paying the price.

[Dnusha]

Because there is nothing to apologize for.

[Jotaux]

Examples of "bugs" which no one was banned for:

Heroic/Mythic Garrosh: you could use that dagger toy to kill yourselves to avoid Malice in P3 in the first 2 IDs. No one was banned for this, not even Paragon.

Mythic Archimonde: every sacrificed their tanks to avoid playing several Source of Chaos in P3.

Neither of those two examples broke the encounter and caused the boss to never use those abilities again.

[Alvito]

That's a point exorsus made. The reason they don't stream it is so other guilds don't take their strats, but exorsus said to have a set of rules where each guild competing has to stream their mythic progress and kills and the guild who gets world first would get rewarded with whatever the prize pool is.

So if you happen to be the world first kill and dont steam then what? Imagine the ways some groups would try to screw with others if live streaming did happen. We would have a repeat of the early days of RBGs. Ultimately Exorsus cheated, got caught and now is trying to blame anybody besides themselves for it.

- - - Updated - - -

Well..

At least Exorsus got Ion to make an official statement on the 4 Legendary softcap.

It was just a cap on the bad luck protection, you weren't capped at 4 legendary items, there is a huge difference between the 2 things.

[Mad_Murdock]

It is Blizzard fault for not fixing a known bug (Helya stopping breathing), and not communicating it. They usually have a direct link to the world first guilds who progress on a given boss and even hotfix mid-fight. It is not our job to beta test their bosses on live, and being banned for something like this just shows how desperate they are seeing that not even this tigthly tuned shit fest of 3 boss raid instance is not holding back the worlds best raiders.

Everyone uses steriods, it's the NBA\NFL\MLB fault for not having better drug tests!! The everyone else is doing it excuse doesn't really work for me. Either you have a sense of sportmanship or you don't and if "we're going to use every exploit we can because it's a race and it matters" is the answer you going to give, then don't expect Blizzard and the rest of the world to care about your stupid race.

I don't really have anything against the WF guilds, but that post read like a bit of a whine statement. We have to do Split runs, we have to do this, We have to do that. It sounds like they want Blizzard to pay them a salary to raid. I'm still going to contend one of the best things that can happen is for the WF raid scene to die off. People can go back to playing the game casually and maybe some of the elitist min\maxing will die off with it.

[Alvito]

Why they exploited Helya Mythic and shouldn't be punished because guilds X and Y got away with stuff in past expansions.

They why enforce any rules now since once somebody else didn't get caught or punished. Hell we should just roll this over in to day to day life too.

[RoKPaNda]

Anyone who goes on about Exorsus being cheaters, exploiters and what not apparently never killed a boss before any nerfs, legendaries or changes whatsoever. Its like right there written in their guild bios: "chance to see bosses world first". "Cheats/bugs/exploits" like this one (avoiding -one- breath with a tank death) are used so frequently in mythic (heroic in the past) that I lost count. It is Blizzard fault for not fixing a known bug (Helya stopping breathing), and not communicating it. They usually have a direct link to the world first guilds who progress on a given boss and even hotfix mid-fight. It is not our job to beta test their bosses on live, and being banned for something like this just shows how desperate they are seeing that not even this tigthly tuned shit fest of 3 boss raid instance is not holding back the worlds best raiders.

Examples of "bugs" which no one was banned for:

Heroic/Mythic Garrosh: you could use that dagger toy to kill yourselves to avoid Malice in P3 in the first 2 IDs. No one was banned for this, not even Paragon.

Mythic Archimonde: every sacrificed their tanks to avoid playing several Source of Chaos in P3.

You actually didn't understand the bug they exploited. The boss stopped doing breath at all, they didn't just skip one breath.

[Pull My Finger]

So it seems (as we all know) that it's not doing too well. Exorsus attributes that to Blizzard paying no attention to it whatsoever. I personally agree and feel that if Blizzard actually made it something to be hyped about and gave motivation to try and get world first aside from "bragging rights" the scene would absolutely flourish.

What do you think?

Who gives a fuck about that "scene" flourishing? Why should Blizzard pay more attention?

A bunch of idiots who live in a fantasy world. How can people overestimate their importance that much?

[Armourboy]

Everyone uses steriods, it's the NBA\NFL\MLB fault for not having better drug tests!! The everyone else is doing it excuse doesn't really work for me. Either you have a sense of sportmanship or you don't and if "we're going to use every exploit we can because it's a race and it matters" is the answer you going to give, then don't expect Blizzard and the rest of the world to care about your stupid race.

I don't really have anything against the WF guilds, but that post read like a bit of a whine statement. We have to do Split runs, we have to do this, We have to do that. It sounds like they want Blizzard to pay them a salary to raid. I'm still going to contend one of the best things that can happen is for the WF raid scene to die off. People can go back to playing the game casually and maybe some of the elitist min\maxing will die off with it.

Lets face it, they are basically a bunch of junkies, and they are blaming the system instead of themselves, just like drug addicts do.

Most of the world can say no, they can't and will do anything to get that next kill.

[Deleted]

Neither of those two examples broke the encounter and caused the boss to never use those abilities again.

Do you even know what Malice is? Wait, do you even know what raid bosses are?!

- - - Updated - - -

You actually didn't understand the bug they exploited. The boss stopped doing breath at all, they didn't just skip one breath.

Its right there explained in my post. But you're playing on a closed private server, why do you even care?

[Armourboy]

Do you even know what Malice is? Wait, do you even know what raid bosses are?!

- - - Updated - - -



Its right there explained in my post. But you're playing on a closed private server, why do you even care?

Except you didn't explain it correctly you said, "Cheats/bugs/exploits" like this one (avoiding -one- breath with a tank death) .

They didn't avoid one breath, they stopped every single breath after that from happening as well by the tank dying one time. If they had avoided all of them by the tank dying each time then it would be perfectly acceptable and Blizzard wouldn't have banned them. That isn't what happened though. They knowingly made the boss stop functioning correctly for the rest of the duration, which has always been a bannable offense.

[Jun]

Blizzard's game, Blizzard's rules, subject to change whenever Blizzard feels like it.

Don't like them, then don't pay them money to play it.