Serenity caught exploiting on Helya?

[shaunika123]

Did you get it before or after the ToV Ilvl bump? I remember there apparently being a bug where when they buffed all ToV gear by 5 ilvls, and if you had a piece that was 895, it would get bumped to 900.

y, that's exactly what happened

[Keska71]

lol nothing unclear about it.. the proof is all there for everyone to see.

he streamed him exploiting and admitted it in discord. wonder what happens when blizzard finds out?

[WhatIsLegion]

lol nothing unclear about it.. the proof is all there for everyone to see.

he streamed him exploiting and admitted it in discord. wonder what happens when blizzard finds out?

Nothing, he's used the bug before on stream in dungeons.

[Krunkus]

What's with people thinking they're entitled to be able to kill every boss with fuck all effort or something? Why do you guys think that mythic difficulty should be able to be done by every man and his dog raiding 1 night a week without farming ap/legendaries and everything that comes with it? It's fucking MYTHIC. Like the top guilds are saying helya is one of the best bosses to come in a long time, because she's fucking hard. Like there's different difficulties for a reason, normal is for people just stepping into raiding, heroic is for groups that want to take a more casual approach to raiding and mythic is for the best guilds and the hardcore guilds. It should be the hardest thing in the game, it should be fucking gruelling and take 100s of wipes and near perfect play otherwise the hardest part of the game is trivial after the first few days to the top guilds. If you can't handle the difficulty that's absolutely fine, raid heroic difficulty. That's obviously where you sit in terms or skill, commitment or a mix of the two.

And for all the self righteous but lazy fucks who are going to arc up saying "I pay for this game I deserve to see all the content, whinge whinge whinge" Think of the truly skilled and committed players who are having a great time because there's actually a challenge in the game for them. When you guys get more gear and new raids release, THEN you can go give mythic a burl.

[Deleted]

The same community that has complained for years about bosses getting bowled over in a week are now complaining bosses are too overtuned.

How comical.

People on MMO-C just want to complain. A classic case of internet resentment.

[KaPe]

Nothing, he's used the bug before on stream in dungeons.

World second boss kill is slightly high profile activity than dungeons. Combined with the fact that three guilds have been banned already... well, yeah, probably nothing will happen. It's not nearly as bad as bugging entire boss ability, but still.

So weird that 4 out of 5 kills have used some kind of exploit. "Creative mechanics" were always a thing, but it's never been this bad for World First... well, maybe except for Atramedes.

People on MMO-C just want to complain. A classic case of internet resentment.

Or maybe there's more than one group of users and they have differing opinions. Hard to imagine, I know, but I believe it's a possibility.

[Deleted]

Or maybe there's more than one group of users and they have differing opinions. Hard to imagine, I know, but I believe it's a possibility.

No, there isn't. It's not even hard to find posters who whined like little bitches because EN was cleared so fast, who are now complaining that ToV is overtuned. It's always negative around here. Everything is always bad.

MMO-Champion WoW boards are just an outlet for frustrated virgins who will complain about anything. The world first race is basically all that is still interesting, and even that is a shitfest (well it has always been one). The collective cognitive dissonance of wanting to hate WoW/Blizzard and being addicted to it is a joy to watch.
Luckily the other sections here are more mature.

[Yhcti]

They didn't bug it. If they had, their dps would've been much higher than it is. Stop whining please millenials.

[Meiffert]

Exactly, how many breaths did they skip then 3? you skip 3 crystals on archi if im correct. all thats happened is 1 extra brezz for a 12 min fight would be needed for another breath. could have 3 battle resses just for tanks last phase because of killtime length no? This was about during the fight bug with a class though.

The fact that the whole encounter bugs out and stops using breath is only one part of the problem. Of course, it's clearly unintended, but you could argue that they bad battle resses ready to do it multiple times anyway.

The other issue (and why the comparison with Archimonde crystals really doesn't hold up) is that crystal is supposed to kill the tank. If you can't kill it in time and outheal the damage, the tank dies, that's the intended result of the mechanic. It's the same thing as random person getting a debuff that deals damage to them, you have several options: dispel it, outheal the damage, or let them die, no issues there.

The breath is not a channeled spell supposed to kill the tank though. You are not supposed to die during it's cast (I believe the boss doesn't even melee her target). It is only targeted on the tank so that you have the ability to position it properly and to force a tank swap afterwards.
If the tank dies during the breath's cast, it should still go off in the direction of his body or the next person on the threat table imo and apply it's other effects. The fact that tank death completely negates even the one cast of the mechanic is a bug by itself; and to force it happen, you have to go out of your way to find a way to kill him, because he is not even supposed to be taking damage at this point.

I don't disagree with you in principal, but there's a very fine line imo. Bugged class mechanics exist on a lot of fights. For example, on the last boss of BRH, there's a bug with prot paladin's hand/light of the protector that causes it to heal for an infinite amount.

I agree that it's though to find the line in many cases and Blizzard should be more transparent, consistent and communicate clearly what is and isn't tolerated and what the consequences are.

As far as the Light of the Protector goes though, is it really bugged? I just thought that since it's supposed to heal for 30 % (more in concecration/with traits) and you have a 300 % healing buff, it just heals for enough to top you off.
Sure, it kinda double-dips from the buff (indirectly from increase in hp and directly from increase in healing done), but I don't consider that a bug. Aren't all percentage based heals affected the same way?

[Deleted]

I don't disagree with you in principal, but there's a very fine line imo. Bugged class mechanics exist on a lot of fights. For example, on the last boss of BRH, there's a bug with prot paladin's hand/light of the protector that causes it to heal for an infinite amount. There's been some times that without benefiting from that bug I would have wiped on that boss. Should I be banned and have my gear/ap from those kills removed? Should I have just not used hand of the protector and been a significant burden to my group? Is this bug more okay to abuse because I have no control over it activating?

Personally, I would like to draw the line at exploiting class mechanics. Which is to say, if there's something about your class that's bugged, abuse away. If there's something about a boss or reward that's bugged, abusing is a no no.

I think it's the same situation as the Ap WQ exploit. If you did a few times without intention, its fine. But if you did it repeatidly, you exploited.
Blizz just has to check logs to find out if they were doing it repeatidly or not.

[WhatIsLegion]

They didn't bug it. If they had, their dps would've been much higher than it is. Stop whining please millenials.

Yes they did, there is clear evidence in Viklund's video and also Viklund himself admitting he did it.

[kamuimac]

No matter how much smaller the advantage, cheating is cheating. If Blizzard wants to send the clear message they seem to want to send, and i aprove of it, at least the individual player should be banned and his achievement removed.

that is true - cheating is cheating - if he indeed did that they should loose world 2nd and player should get as long ban as exorsus

[D3athsting]

using spriest should be considered exploiting anyway

[Glas]

it wasn't as game breaking as what the other guilds did, but it is an advantage and no matter how you slice it; an exploit

should the entire guild be banned for one player? no, but should that player be suspended for 8 days and the kill credit be removed? probably

should blizz look into method's kill and see if they used this exploit? yes

the issue I'd imagine people are taking with this is the inconsistency with suspensions over exploits, and account sharing for that matter (i.e. reckful getting perma banned for account sharing around the time method did it to secure blackhand, without punishment)

it's beyond frustrating, and muddies the water for everyone

[OrcsRLame]

I think it's the same situation as the Ap WQ exploit. If you did a few times without intention, its fine. But if you did it repeatidly, you exploited.
Blizz just has to check logs to find out if they were doing it repeatidly or not.

I can't not do it though. On that fight, the healing increase you get when you turn big wigs out with HotP, causing it to heal for more than 100% of missing health.

The only way I can NOT intentionally exploit that is to not cast Hand of the Protector, my only real consistent source of self healing as a paladin tank. That'd be like a warrior just not using Ignore Pain. How the fuck is that fair, especially considering I reported this bug in beta? "Sorry guys, find a different tank for BRH. I can't do that one cause I'm not allowed to use any self healing. Special paladin only handicap, I'm sure you understand."

- - - Updated - - -

The fact that the whole encounter bugs out and stops using breath is only one part of the problem. Of course, it's clearly unintended, but you could argue that they bad battle resses ready to do it multiple times anyway.

The other issue (and why the comparison with Archimonde crystals really doesn't hold up) is that crystal is supposed to kill the tank. If you can't kill it in time and outheal the damage, the tank dies, that's the intended result of the mechanic. It's the same thing as random person getting a debuff that deals damage to them, you have several options: dispel it, outheal the damage, or let them die, no issues there.

The breath is not a channeled spell supposed to kill the tank though. You are not supposed to die during it's cast (I believe the boss doesn't even melee her target). It is only targeted on the tank so that you have the ability to position it properly and to force a tank swap afterwards.
If the tank dies during the breath's cast, it should still go off in the direction of his body or the next person on the threat table imo and apply it's other effects. The fact that tank death completely negates even the one cast of the mechanic is a bug by itself; and to force it happen, you have to go out of your way to find a way to kill him, because he is not even supposed to be taking damage at this point.




I agree that it's though to find the line in many cases and Blizzard should be more transparent, consistent and communicate clearly what is and isn't tolerated and what the consequences are.

As far as the Light of the Protector goes though, is it really bugged? I just thought that since it's supposed to heal for 30 % (more in concecration/with traits) and you have a 300 % healing buff, it just heals for enough to top you off.
Sure, it kinda double-dips from the buff (indirectly from increase in hp and directly from increase in healing done), but I don't consider that a bug. Aren't all percentage based heals affected the same way?

It's definitely bugged. Other tank self heals such as warrior's Ignore Pain or DKs Death Strike do not benefit from the healing increase the same way.

One time, I used a HotP for 932 million on that fight. That can't possibly be intended.

[Zyky]

What's with people thinking they're entitled to be able to kill every boss with fuck all effort or something? Why do you guys think that mythic difficulty should be able to be done by every man and his dog raiding 1 night a week without farming ap/legendaries and everything that comes with it?

No one even talking about entitlement, not a single person raiding 1 night a week with no AP/Legendary grinding is complaining.

It's fucking MYTHIC. Like the top guilds are saying helya is one of the best bosses to come in a long time, because she's fucking hard.

Really now? Because all of the top guilds are saying the raid is completely overtuned and not fun that they have to search for an exploit in order to actually kill Helya. So where is your proof that a single top guild is saying that she's the best boss to come in a long time? Go read some blogs from high end guilds you 12 post twat.

Like there's different difficulties for a reason, normal is for people just stepping into raiding, heroic is for groups that want to take a more casual approach to raiding and mythic is for the best guilds and the hardcore guilds. It should be the hardest thing in the game, it should be fucking gruelling and take 100s of wipes and near perfect play otherwise the hardest part of the game is trivial after the first few days to the top guilds. If you can't handle the difficulty that's absolutely fine, raid heroic difficulty. That's obviously where you sit in terms or skill, commitment or a mix of the two.

Those last 2 sentences tell everyone what a derp you are. Every single guild, including the 2 guilds who didn't get bans, used an exploit. The guilds who did get banned used a Breath exploit that was reported since heroic week, 9 days before the first mythic kill happened, yet it wasn't fixed before the mythic race. The other 2 guilds are using a Shadow Priest exploit to make it so they can stop the rate at which Insanity decays by using VT on Helya when she enters P2 then using Dispersion to stop the decay rate increase.

And for all the self righteous but lazy fucks who are going to arc up saying "I pay for this game I deserve to see all the content, whinge whinge whinge" Think of the truly skilled and committed players who are having a great time because there's actually a challenge in the game for them. When you guys get more gear and new raids release, THEN you can go give mythic a burl.

No one is having a "great time" with an unkillable overtuned boss. People are literally losing sleep because those guilds require the players to do so. I promise you there isn't a single guild progression on Helya having the time of their lives because they have to do something that's impossible to do without exploiting.

[Glas]

-snip-

why are you accusing method of using this exploit?



Notice how vik, the only confirmed player who used this exploit, is well ahead of every shadow priest?

Unless Method releases their logs, only blizz can confirm method didn't use it-- the evidence the public actually has, points to most likely not.

Viklund absolutely did exploit, as we have the video, and the public meters on the videos also shows the discrepancy in output.

This puts him FAR ahead of everyone else's output, there's even potential that Serenity would not have KILLED this boss if he didn't exploit, because when they did there was only 2 players standing.

Since the difficulty of this boss is mainly a DPS check, this should absolutely be investigated by blizzard and punished if they confirm it on their side.

[Yhcti]

Yes they did, there is clear evidence in Viklund's video and also Viklund himself admitting he did it.

Really? because on his stream he got pretty p!ssed off when someone mentioned it and said he didn't... oh well who cares really... what do you get for becoming world first? oh, nothing.

[Deleted]

Really? because on his stream he got pretty p!ssed off when someone mentioned it and said he didn't... oh well who cares really... what do you get for becoming world first? oh, nothing.

Who would admit it after the recent ban sprees. ViklunD confirmed smart.

[Glas]

Really? because on his stream he got pretty p!ssed off when someone mentioned it and said he didn't... oh well who cares really... what do you get for becoming world first? oh, nothing.

http://i.imgur.com/6KEdiJ4.jpg


I dunno if this is 100% truth or someone made a meme, but since there's the video as well...