Legion - Assassination Discussion

[Deleted]

Other than that part where 6cp rupture dmg is unchanged... All the change did was make it do the same dmg no matter the cp's used making Deeper Stratagem not so massively ahead but in overall dmg rupture will do less dmg than it does on live.

I don't know what's so hard about this for people. Yes 5cp to 5cp ptr will do more dmg than live but that doesn't really have anything to do with the overall dmg comparison because no one uses it at just 5 on live with ds.

I never aimed for 6cp rupture all the time, I use rupture at 5cp very often. Only for cd usage like exsang or snapshots I'm aiming for 6cp.

I did the calculations on excel (incl old vs new forumals of both rupture and ds). Rupture at 5cps is doing 15% more damage than before, Rupture at 6cps is doing 4.5% less damage than before. At the end the 5cp rupture buff negates the 6cp rupture nerf.

This is interesting, because the ds nerf is 5% already, but 6cp rupture dmg is actually only decreased by 4.5%. The rupture change buffers some of the nerf of ds.

[Greylan]

I never aimed for 6cp rupture all the time, I use rupture at 5cp very often. Only for cd usage like exsang or snapshots I'm aiming for 6cp.

I did the calculations on excel (incl old vs new forumals of both rupture and ds). Rupture at 5cps is doing 15% more damage than before, Rupture at 6cps is doing 4.5% less damage than before. At the end the 5cp rupture buff negates the 6cp rupture nerf.

So it's a buff if you were doing it wrong? Other than on short lived trash/adds you should always be using 6 cp.

[Deleted]

So it's a buff if you were doing it wrong? Other than on short lived trash/adds you should always be using 6 cp.

I must doing something right, since i have only one strong dps legendary and have very strong rankings at most bosses (99% / >115 points per boss).

Every cp generating spell is a waste of energy at 5cp except garrote. The CPPE is decreased by (your critchance for that spell)% (2 times higher for mutilate). Furthermore to go 6cp all the time for rupture decreases the uptime of your buffs/debuffs by a small margin.

On the other hand, there are some really strong rogues around which are using rupture even at 4cp just to keep the uptime of the debuffs/buff as high as possible.

[Mursy]

Can anyone tell me what i doing wrong i just don't understand names Talro https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=233&fight=22

Stats are 40.09% Crit, 10.78 Haste, 101.75%, Mastery, 1.43% Vers

I'm useing EP and AP

[Puffah]

Can anyone tell me what i doing wrong i just don't understand names Talro https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...e=233&fight=22

Stats are 40.09% Crit, 10.78 Haste, 101.75%, Mastery, 1.43% Vers

I'm useing EP and AP

At only a glance...

You didn't use flask or pots. Consumables are a massive dps increase and mandatory if you want higher %
EP uptime could be higher. Aim to Envenom at 3+ CP to maintain higher uptime
Also, while not as important, you dont have a neck enchant.
You should also use Fishbrul food for ST

[Mursy]

At only a glance...

You didn't use flask or pots. Consumables are a massive dps increase and mandatory if you want higher %
EP uptime could be higher. Aim to Envenom at 3+ CP to maintain higher uptime

Yea it was just a quick run so i didn't buy flasks or pots, is it really ok to do 3cp Envenom? i heard 4. Also how do my stats look? Do i go for more Crit or Mast. Iv heard 40% crit, 90% mast or 45%crit, 90% mast

[Puffah]

Nothing wrong with your stats really. Haste could be lower and Versa higher though

[omeomorfismo]

So it's a buff if you were doing it wrong? Other than on short lived trash/adds you should always be using 6 cp.

so you waste intentionally 1-3 CP and EP uptime and call it right?
lol

[Deleted]

You can get from 5 to 6 with a garrote. And if you are at 5 and want a desperate 6 (for vanish rupture), use FoK, not Mutilate, or you are doing it wrong.

Besides: getting to 70-75% EP uptime is no art even if you force 6 CP ruptures. I am a 6CP rupture refresher as well and the amount of times i need to use FoK because there is no garrote in range or I get bad CP luck is actually low. Checking the logs the wasted CP stays below 10 as well using this technique. I don't see any mistake in doing it. To everyone their own I guess.

[Theracrosa]

Hello everyone, i have a thread but i will just ask it here too since people check this more often,

is it better to go EP/AP with %41 crit %9 haste %123 mastery and %3 versa

or %45 crit %8 haste %108 mastery and %5 versa EP/EX or EP/AP

im 870ilvl and have 25.000 agility... with no vendetta cooldown relics, i have the boots

[Greylan]

so you waste intentionally 1-3 CP and EP uptime and call it right?
lol

You don't need to waste any CP, as poster says above, Garrote or in a pinch FoK will get you your 1 CP to turn that mediocre 5 CP rupture into a nice 6 cp rupture.

[Deleted]

You don't need to waste any CP, as poster says above, Garrote or in a pinch FoK will get you your 1 CP to turn that mediocre 5 CP rupture into a nice 6 cp rupture.

the link of my rankings is somewhere posted in this forum. If you are interested to take a look in my rakings, feel free to look at. but to proof your fok / 6cp thing, you should show us your rankings.

[Greylan]

the link of my rankings is somewhere posted in this forum. If you are interested to take a look in my rakings, feel free to look at. but to proof your fok / 6cp thing, you should show us your rankings.

Trying to make this some dick measuring contest? My logs are public as well, under my posted name here, you can look them up if you want, but measuring dicks here doesn't add any value to the discussion.

[Deleted]

Trying to make this some dick measuring contest? My logs are public as well, under my posted name here, you can look them up if you want, but measuring dicks here doesn't add any value to the discussion.

its not dick measuring, it is to determine and validate data. I am open-minded for new stuff, but I need a small of a proof before I change/test something. Furthermore this discussion isnt really new, there were always debate about how many cps are the best. At the end the "5 to 6 cps" playstyle was the strongest every time.

[Deleted]

5 / 6 CP refreshing is so insignificant compared to gear difference, the randomness of each bossfight, your procs, the kill speed and everything else. You would need to subtract a lot of error variables and need a really high amount of tries to even approximate the difference. Simming this 5 / 6 CP rule is a far better idea, but I don't have the scripting knowledge of SimC to allow for that. Maybe there are some experts here on the topic who know better.

Btw. if you are so high ranked (and have the idea of how randomness works) you should know that your performance has no significance on the outcome on different rotation strategies or item builds at all. Moreover, the mechanical skill of a person has no meaning either. There are people who have strong analytical abilities but suck at the actual execution. Devaluing someone else's opinion on the discussion because of skill or performance difference is quite silly tbh and doesn't bring us forward.

[Greylan]

its not dick measuring, it is to determine and validate data. I am open-minded for new stuff, but I need a small of a proof before I change/test something. Furthermore this discussion isnt really new, there were always debate about how many cps are the best. At the end the "5 to 6 cps" playstyle was the strongest every time.

Well, like I say, my parses are public and they're not bad parses. Greylan-Skywall [US]. But like the poster above me said, there are too many variables to account for to really see the difference. I doubt rupture would need a buff at 1-5cp if they were currently worth a damn, but I too am open minded enough to wait and see.

[Fiftyonred]

There was no big rupture buff rupture no matter how you talent rupture will be doing less dmg than live period. It was a qol change but still a nerf in overall normal dps, now on fast dying mobs it is a buff since you don't have to use max cp's for max dmg. With ds rupture will be doing 5% less than live without ds rupture will be doing 10% less dmg than live.

Any rogue worth his salt should be running subterfuge even now for mythic+ content, so it's an overall buff regardless.

[Wow]

Any rogue worth his salt should be running subterfuge even now for mythic+ content, so it's an overall buff regardless.

What does subterfuge have to do with deeper stratagem?

[Fiftyonred]

What does subterfuge have to do with deeper stratagem?

Because DP + sub is not a thing. You need Vigor for mythic+ with subterfuge to get garrote on all trash packs, DP does nothing for this.

[Pikaboo]

Hey guys

I'm new to Assassination (Main Outlaw but never playing Rogue before that) and I'm trying to branch into this spec for raids and potentially higher level mythics.
I've got 27 ranks (everything except Shadow Walker, Shadow Walker and Fade into Shadows) and I've got some variance in my gear but with the set of gear that gives me 41% crit 11% haste 92% mastery 4% versatility (Mutilate has 10% to crit chance because of 2 Mutilate relics), I have found that I can keep the most dps on a raiding training dummy (usually 430k doing the rotation for a few minutes)

My knowledge so far comes mostly from Icy Veins and watching videos by Nattle.
I have a few questions regrading talent choices, rotation and spells - Is there a way to maximize Kingsbane usage? Should I wait if for example Vendetta is 10 seconds off cd (or the other way around) so I could theoretically apply more poisons during Kingsbane duration?

Regrading Exsanguinate - how exactly do you use it? According to Icy Veins "If you are talented into Exsanguinate Icon Exsanguinate, you should refresh your bleed effects before and after Exsanguinate Icon Exsanguinate casts for maximum efficacy." - Does this mean you should refresh Rupture before Exsanguinate even if it has, let's say, 20 seconds to go? And by after they obviously mean when Rupture is within Pandemic range, correct?

Elaborate Planning - I've been doing 2+ (whatever Mutilate decides to give me) Envenoms like Nattle said to keep EP as much as possible, but if for some reason I couldn't keep it up and Rupture/Garrote do not need refreshing anytime soon, should I do a 6 point Envenom?

Talent choices - I have read a thread here and in it people suggested Subterfuge is better for Mythic+ - did anyone actually test this? Is it actually better? makes a lot of sense but I can't judge on my own because I am still awful on Assa and the few times I've done Mythic+ with it, I couldn't really be the judge of anything based on my performance

Thanks!