7.1.5: Fire completely wrecked

[BiggestNoob]

This is a mage only phenomen. You compare yourselves to balance and shadows and still somehow think you're inferior. Outside of S2M (which is fixed in 7.1.5, along with over the top mage mobility/burst), you still have auto-spreading dots on top of all your mobility and defensive utility. Blizzard often says how specs should be great in X and only good in Y, but in Legion fire mages had it too good.

Just think for one second what a mage has over any other ranged caster. This whole topic is a joke, hence why top mages dont even comment, since theres no issue if you're a good mage.

Fire's burst isn't the biggest burst in the game, and that's with 100% conversion of crit into mastery and HS doubling mastery benefit.

Those specs aren't getting their burst nerfed in 7.1.5. They also scale significantly better than fire.

I wonder if even Julius Caesar himself sometimes felt jealous of others, sitting on his throne. The world at his feet.

Fire is bad on Helya. The guild you're talking about already stated they would've taken other classes over the mages if they had them available.

[Deleted]

"Those"? Who?! Melees + Hunters get 5% less base crit on top of some hefty changes. Other caster specs arent even comparable to fire mage, besides Spriests who also get a S2M change.^

To quote a person who posted this in a different thread:

+12 https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...gregate=amount
+15 https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...unt&metric=dps

Fire mage is the 2nd best caster DPS in mythic+12 and the best in +15. You mages have it really bad.

[stevenho]

Other caster specs arent even comparable to fire mage

True, 90% of them are much better.

[Deleted]

True, 90% of them are much better.

As shown by logs, sims and toolkit comparisons.

[CptEgo]

True, 90% of them are much better.

You try leveling a Shadow Priest. Barely being able to kill 3 mobs on your own really feels good.

[stevenho]

As shown by logs

Precisely. Mythic raid logs to be exact.
AKA the only thing that matters.

[Rylalai]

You try leveling a Shadow Priest. Barely being able to kill 3 mobs on your own really feels good.

You sound like the people crying before Legion release how utterly useless S2M will be, because you cannot level with it or use it in dungeons.. x_x

Who cares about leveling experience anyway nowadays.. You level your char in a couple of hours to 110 and then the "real" game starts.

[CptEgo]

You sound like the people crying before Legion release how utterly useless S2M will be, because you cannot level with it or use it in dungeons.. x_x

Who cares about leveling experience anyway nowadays.. You level your char in a couple of hours to 110 and then the "real" game starts.

Yea well, people are always gonna complain. Mages could be doing twice the damage of everyone else and you would still find something to fucking whine about. Must be hard being the king of casters for the 12th year in a row, huh?

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True, 90% of them are much better.

You can't possibly believe that.

[Obelisk Kai]

Yea well, people are always gonna complain. Mages could be doing twice the damage of everyone else and you would still find something to fucking whine about. Must be hard being the king of casters for the 12th year in a row, huh?

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You can't possibly believe that.

Are you getting anything out of this discussion? You're not going to convince us we are overpowered gods because we've lived the experience and you are derailing a topic that was dealing with Fire Mage issues, into one about imagined Mage entitlement. Mages do have the right to discuss their issues you know. Just because you think we have no issues and should be so thankful that we shouldn't complain is irrelevant. That was not the point of the thread and what it has become is just a waste of time.

If you believe your own class has issues, why not go to their forums and begin a productive discussion?

[MashTactics]

As shown by logs, sims and toolkit comparisons.

The eyeroll implies sarcasm... and yet...

"Exceptionally OP" yet beat by multiple specs on the fights where they are "exceptionally OP." I don't know what expansion you are playing but it sure as shit isn't legion.


"Best caster on other fights" so warlocks and Spriest aren't casters now?

Nyth - Demo locks beat fire
Ilg - shadow, afflic and destro beat fire.
Ren - fire wins
Ursoc - Shadow and demo beat fire
Dragons - Afflic beats fire
Cenarius - Afflic, shadow, demo, destro, balance all beat fire.
Xavius - Shadow and afflic beat fire.

Odyn - Shadow, afflic, demo, destro, balance, all beat fire.
Guarm - shadow, afflic, demo, balance all beat fire.
Helya - Shadow beats fire.


Literally only one fight where fire beats all casters. And the three fights they are in the top 5 are all due to unnecessary padding. Those mobs die within seconds regardless of fire mages. Source

I've said this in this thread before, and I'll say it again, I'm sorry that elemental shamans are in a bad place, but don't advocate for fire nerfs because you chose the wrong spec. Especially when your opinion is based on feelcrafting rather than empirical evidence.

Also, just so we're clear, you could literally - no stop, not figuratively - you could literally remove all offensive spells from fire mages except fireball and still make that toolkit argument, so I'm not sure how much weight that particular argument holds in regards to being taken into raids as a DPS.

[deadman1]

Yeah, you need ice floes and blink-while-casting to compete with Warlocks & Shaman with 0 mobility.

Again how does this logic actually make it to your finger tips without being parsed?

The implication that the other specs need the same mobility implies they do identical damage and that the mobility somehow inflates DPS yet the logs show otherwise.

If you've OP legendaries and cant beat most classes its time to re roll or quit, you're right - but not because your class is bad.

This is mind blowing, this is shocking that someone can actually think this and believe they are correct. Logs prove you wrong unequivocally.

Nyth - Demo locks beat fire
Ilg - shadow, afflic and destro beat fire.
Ren - fire wins
Ursoc - Shadow and demo beat fire
Dragons - Afflic beats fire
Cenarius - Afflic, shadow, demo, destro, balance all beat fire.
Xavius - Shadow and afflic beat fire.

Odyn - Shadow, afflic, demo, destro, balance, all beat fire.
Guarm - shadow, afflic, demo, balance all beat fire.
Helya - Shadow beats fire.

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Yea well, people are always gonna complain. Mages could be doing twice the damage of everyone else and you would still find something to fucking whine about. Must be hard being the king of casters for the 12th year in a row, huh?

"King of casters" not the best caster on 9 out of 10 fights, logic doesn't real.

Mages are on average 9-10th place overall in T19 so far and are being changed because apparently being middle of the pack is too strong.

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Yeah, sorry my bad that your class has 3 competive PvE specs.

Yeah sorry that you chose to play ele when enhance is exponentially better.

[TyrianFC]

I swear some of you clowns think that 'acceptable shape' means number 1 dps on every fight.

[Bugs]

Are you guys saving your AP for now?

[Armourboy]

I swear some of you clowns think that 'acceptable shape' means number 1 dps on every fight.

And some think " acceptable shape" is if Fire is dead last. Considering we aren't top dogs on anything ( even the ones we are supposedly OP for) I've yet to see a valid argument as to why the spec needs to be nerfed. The only thing the spec is good at is short boss fights ( 45 seconds or less) and mass AOE packs like in 5 mans. Everything outside of 5 mans is pretty meh at best.

The spec may have needed some retooling to get crit in line and burst vs. sustained in line, but as things currently sit on PTR ( which is all we can go by atm) they basically gutted much of the burst and haven't returned anything on the sustained side.

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Are you guys saving your AP for now?

I'm not. I'm putting large chunks I get into fire, smaller chunks into arcane so if it is bad I have something to move to, and if it's not then I haven't gotten to far behind on the fire one.

[Rylalai]

Are you guys saving your AP for now?

I'm going for 35 points in fire and then switching to arcane (currently 25). :-)

[Bugs]

I got 550K in my bank. Just trying to figure out, if I should use it on Fire.

[Deleted]

Fire's burst isn't the biggest burst in the game, and that's with 100% conversion of crit into mastery and HS doubling mastery benefit.

Those specs aren't getting their burst nerfed in 7.1.5. They also scale significantly better than fire.



Fire is bad on Helya. The guild you're talking about already stated they would've taken other classes over the mages if they had them available.

Source 1-0char

[Deleted]

And some think " acceptable shape" is if Fire is dead last. Considering we aren't top dogs on anything ( even the ones we are supposedly OP for) I've yet to see a valid argument as to why the spec needs to be nerfed. The only thing the spec is good at is short boss fights ( 45 seconds or less) and mass AOE packs like in 5 mans. Everything outside of 5 mans is pretty meh at best.

The spec may have needed some retooling to get crit in line and burst vs. sustained in line, but as things currently sit on PTR ( which is all we can go by atm) they basically gutted much of the burst and haven't returned anything on the sustained side.

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I'm not. I'm putting large chunks I get into fire, smaller chunks into arcane so if it is bad I have something to move to, and if it's not then I haven't gotten to far behind on the fire one.

you also have to realize that blizz have stated their intentions with these changes and how they will compensate(which is already more than we usually gets from blizz with changes) and on ptrs in general they have historically always made the mechanical changes first and then done the number tuning later bcoz that is the best and most logical way of making changes, so its literally pointless to whine now bcoz they havent even started the tuning pass yet which will come in the next few weeks. blizz is perfectly aware that fire needs buffs with these changes, ppl just need to be patient but ppl tend to be extremely shortsighted.

[Deleted]

"King of casters" not the best caster on 9 out of 10 fights, logic doesn't real.

Mages are on average 9-10th place overall in T19 so far and are being changed because apparently being middle of the pack is too strong.

And the only acceptable shape is #1 on every boss or what are you implying? Sorry to burst your bubble, mage will be finally in line with any other caster DPS. In fact, all caster DPS were fine atleast after 7.1, except for fire mages and Spriests which get adjusted now.

Yeah sorry that you chose to play ele when enhance is exponentially better.

I play every ranged spec in WoW, including fire mage. But if you dont see the difference between Ele and Enh then I also cant help you.

[Deleted]

And the only acceptable shape is #1 on every boss or what are you implying? Sorry to burst your bubble, mage will be finally in line with any other caster DPS. In fact, all caster DPS were fine atleast after 7.1, except for fire mages and Spriests which get adjusted now.




I play every ranged spec in WoW, including fire mage. But if you dont see the difference between Ele and Enh then I also cant help you.

So according to you elemental is fine at this time.

Mages already are in line with the rest, just look at the logs.